#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 11 Feb 2004 (GMT)

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[08:03:39] --> Dominus has joined #exult
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[08:04:09] <Dominus> hi
[08:34:09] <Dominus> Kirben: updated documentation and added images to that as well. So yet even more to include in the snapshot
[08:36:28] <Kirben> Should be auto included, it just copies all gif and png over now.
[08:37:59] <Kirben> oh exult doc images, will have to adjust for that.
[08:47:13] <Kirben> Will need an installer update again.
[08:51:18] <Dominus> oh, need to bother colourless for this
[08:55:11] <Dominus> Kirben: have you taken a look at artaxerxes new tools?
[08:55:37] <Kirben> Just adding them in now.
[08:56:10] <Dominus> cool, thanks
[09:19:10] <Dominus> I will need to make sure with Colourless to make the installer "future" proof for the documentation material. I plan to add faq*.png as well. I just hope the installer accepts wildcards and is not strict....
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[12:36:52] <Nadir> hi
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[12:42:57] <Colourless> hi
[12:43:16] <Nadir> I have a seed for discussion
[12:43:34] <Nadir> "Main menu Setup"
[12:43:37] <Nadir> should it go
[12:43:50] <Nadir> should it stay (obviously drastically changed)
[12:44:20] <Colourless> if it were to stay it should have all of the options that the in game option gumps have
[12:45:15] <Colourless> dominus: What!!! The install just so is not flexible that way.
[12:45:57] <Nadir> actually it should have something that the in-game menu should not: path browsers for choosing data files etc
[12:46:06] <Nadir> a bit like the one in ScummVM
[12:46:19] <Colourless> we wanted that ages ago
[12:47:01] <Nadir> we still want that :)
[12:47:28] <wjp> hi
[12:47:54] <Colourless> our sticking point is how to do it
[12:48:26] <wjp> I think the main menu setup should only have options that could prevent you to go the in-game setup menu
[12:50:46] <Nadir> I also think that fullscreen should be there, but not scaler and not music
[12:51:00] <wjp> an audio enabled/disabled option, possibly
[12:52:48] <Nadir> summing it up: paths (game, sound, etc), audio on/off, fullscreen on/off
[12:57:45] <wjp> maybe an option to reset the resolution, too
[12:58:04] <Nadir> reset to 320x200 ?
[13:15:06] <Nadir> ideally we should have a add/edit game entry there
[13:15:59] <Nadir> add game will let you choose the static path of a game, and will auto identify it and add the relevant entries to the configuration
[13:44:29] <Nadir> Colourless: what's the diff between i5comp and i6comp
[13:44:47] <Colourless> not hard to work it out :-)
[13:45:05] <Colourless> i5comp is for installshield 5.... i6comp is for installshield 6 :-)
[13:48:17] <Colourless> exult's installer is built using the 'data as files' option which isn't supported by i5comp since it's primary task was to extract files from the cabs. Exult's files aren't in the cabs
[13:48:26] <Nadir> ah ok :)
[13:48:29] <Colourless> so the tools aren't too happy working with them
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[13:57:20] <Dominus> hi
[13:57:22] <Dominus> Colourless: sorry for making it complicated
[13:57:47] <Colourless> i am not talking to you
[13:58:08] <Colourless> it was a big enough of an issue getting the snapshots to work properly :-)
[13:58:37] <Colourless> now, it's not a problem IF you don't add any more files :-)
[13:58:49] <Colourless> your wording seems to suggest though more will be coming
[13:59:05] <Dominus> it doesn't need to be that flexible. For now when I'm done with adding screenshots to the FAQ I'm done
[13:59:09] <Dominus> ... for now...
[14:00:02] <Dominus> I just wanted to know if the installer would be flexible enough to support quick adding of new files with the same extension to a dir...
[14:00:22] <Colourless> no
[14:00:53] <Colourless> even adding 1 file takes me about an hour of work to make sure that kirben can properly make the snapshots
[14:00:59] <Dominus> I promise to have it ready long before a 1.2 release...
[14:01:01] <Dominus> ouch
[14:01:16] <Colourless> the installer is not intended to be modified after it is made
[14:02:12] <Dominus> yeah, tried fiddling with i5comp/i6comp myself. getting files out would be easy, but adding the way it is setup....
[14:02:36] <Colourless> using them is actually easy, if you know what you are doing
[14:03:40] <Dominus> I'm struggling with them three times a year when an installation won'T run, always gets messy in the end :-)
[14:04:15] <Dominus> nice thing is a plug-in for Total Commander/Windows Commander that allows browsing the files easily
[14:10:08] <Dominus> Colourless: I really am sorry, didn't intend to make extra hassle/work for you
[14:12:42] <Dominus> another menu clean-up question (as you talked about the setup menu before I burst in): in the game menu audio gump conversion & effects are only midi related, right?
[14:13:10] <Nadir> yes
[14:13:11] <Dominus> could they be "blended" out when FMSynth and Digital are selected?
[14:13:27] <Nadir> those should only appear in-game imho
[14:13:44] <Dominus> yeah, I mean the in-game menu
[14:14:04] <Dominus> I wanted to bring up the setup menu as well today but you beat me to it :-)
[14:14:20] <Nadir> great minds think alike :)
[14:16:26] <wjp> Dominus: I already have that implemented in my local copy at home
[14:16:36] <Dominus> nice :-)
[14:16:40] <wjp> (or actually they totally disappear)
[14:17:20] <Dominus> disappear I meant, but at that moment that word had disappeared on my mind
[14:18:59] <Dominus> Just when I looked at the menus last night those issues were present :-)
[14:22:20] <Dominus> Play Introduction and Play 1st Scene should stay in the Detup Menu IMO
[14:22:42] <Dominus> there is nowhere else to set this except by editing exult.cfg
[14:23:31] <Nadir> Those should go away
[14:23:44] <Nadir> you can skip the intro by pressing esc anyway
[14:24:08] <Nadir> does play 1st scene work for both SI and BG ?
[14:25:56] <wjp> BG only
[14:26:12] <wjp> too much happens in the SI version
[14:26:43] <Nadir> I think we should scrap it then, as it is mostly a debugging aid
[14:26:52] <Nadir> s/is/was/
[14:30:40] <wjp> I would like a way to load a game from the main menu
[14:31:39] <wjp> (or possibly from the commandline only)
[14:32:03] <Nadir> you mean from a savegame
[14:32:22] <wjp> uh, yes, a savegame
[14:33:42] <Nadir> so you would need to show the load game window, the one with the screenshot, party npcs, etc ?
[14:33:52] <Nadir> or would the save game name suffice
[14:34:11] <Nadir> I mainly have a problem with "looks"
[14:34:32] <Nadir> style should be consistent
[14:35:02] <Dominus> true
[14:35:14] <Colourless> would in theory be possible to load the savegame gump at the menu
[14:35:22] <Dominus> (can we keep the exult.cfg settings for intro and 1st scene? :-))
[14:35:37] <wjp> Dominus: (yes :-) )
[14:35:54] <Colourless> but only from the game's mainmenu, not the exult menu
[14:36:07] <Colourless> in order to show party shape/screenshot the game palette is required
[14:36:11] <wjp> Colourless: yes, of course
[14:36:22] <wjp> and otherwise you wouldn't know which savegames to display
[14:36:55] <Dominus> and you'd end up choosing a game anyway before choosing a savegame
[14:38:06] <Dominus> I agree that choosing savegame would be nice from the game main menu (all those menus)
[14:38:45] <Colourless> looking at the source of i5comp which is surprisingly readable, i think that i would probably be able to do 'something' with it to do what i want
[14:39:45] <Dominus> that sounds good
[14:39:45] <Colourless> would probably only work with exult, but i don't really care :-)
[14:42:21] <Colourless> not something i'm doing today though, users can live without images in the docs (like they would notice anyway)
[14:46:36] <Dominus> :)
[14:48:34] <Dominus> IMO it can wait until the 1.2 release
[14:49:18] <Dominus> 1. I'll probably add some more screenshots, 2. I highly doubt anyone is looking at the documentation anyway
[14:49:59] <Dominus> (I'd like to know how many hits the docs/faq page get anyway)
[14:52:47] <Colourless> funny thing, even though i have the exult sources, i still tend to look at the docs on the webpage instead
[14:54:32] <Dominus> funny thing, even though I have the sources, the dir I write them in and actually wrote them, I tend to look at the webpage :-)
[14:55:03] <Dominus> all the hits on the docs come from the developers
[14:56:40] <Dominus> I had so many stupid things left in the docs "since alphaXY you can even have configurable keyboard commands"
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[15:10:52] <Colourless> ?exultbot
[15:10:52] <exultbot> Exultbot is written in Perl by Willem Jan Palenstijn.
[15:11:33] <Colourless> wjp! ?exultbot isn't working for me on #Pentagram
[15:12:48] <Dominus> ?version
[15:12:48] <exultbot> The latest official version of Exult is: 1.0
[15:12:59] <Dominus> nope, not true :-)
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[15:19:25] <Nadir> exultbot: It should be "The latest stable official version of Exult is: 1.0"
[15:22:01] <Colourless> try download it from our download page :-)
[15:22:23] <Colourless> now though seriously, who other then us, actually uses the exultbot commands :-)
[15:22:42] <Colourless> exultbot could even give you that answer :-)
[15:25:36] <Dominus> other than the occasional ?log to show new persons here where to find them they don't have much use
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[15:53:53] <Nadir> ?log
[15:53:53] <exultbot> Logs are available at http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/exultlog.php
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[18:02:00] <wjp> so... "conversion" and "effects" depend on driver being "Normal", right?
[18:02:22] <Colourless> yes
[18:04:05] <wjp> do you agree with my change to Paperdoll_gump.cc, btw?
[18:04:52] <Colourless> changes?
[18:05:12] <wjp> from yesterday
[18:05:58] <Colourless> i don't really care. If it works it's fine :-)
[18:06:45] <Colourless> looks fine
[18:07:28] <wjp> bbl, dinner
[18:31:46] <wjp> ok, committed change to audio options gump
[18:32:36] <wjp> oooh, greek spam on the ML :-)
[18:33:39] <Colourless> :-)
[18:36:35] * wjp wonders if he can deduce from Nadir's comments that Nadir was going to work on the menu
[18:39:49] <Colourless> well he did seem to express a lot of interest in it
[18:47:16] --> exultbot has joined #exult
[18:47:16] --- Topic for #exult is: Exult: an open-source engine for Ultima 7. http://exult.sf.net/
[18:47:16] --- Topic for #exult set by wjp at Tue Jan 6 09:55:17 2004
[19:38:07] <wjp> think it might be worth it to post a 'looking for paperdoll artists' notice on our homepage?
[19:38:28] <Colourless> maybe
[19:38:29] <wjp> would be kind of nice to (finally) have art for all BG items
[19:38:51] <wjp> 14 left
[19:39:53] <wjp> I wouldn't be able to convince you to try a few, would I? ;-)
[19:40:22] <Colourless> maybe
[19:40:31] <Colourless> but you know, i'm a programmer :-)
[19:40:37] <wjp> so am I :-)
[19:40:40] <Colourless> you know what they say about programmer art :-)
[19:41:22] --> WishStone has joined #Exult
[19:42:06] <wjp> WishStone: how good are you with computer art? :-)
[19:42:50] <WishStone> eer uhoh. Why? ;D
[19:43:18] <wjp> we need 14 more pieces of BG paperdoll art :-)
[19:44:09] <WishStone> *shuffles to the boards* Methinks I missed something ;D
[19:44:29] <wjp> the "New paperdoll art?" thread :-)
[19:45:52] <WishStone> Hmhmhmmm.. I could ask around, I know a few people that do stuff professionally. *grins* Like my ex who's a professional webdesigner. My UO Guild is quite happy with that ;D
[19:47:33] <WishStone> What would be involved? I mean how do you guys change the graphics?
[19:48:13] <wjp> we 'ported' the Serpent Isle-style paperdoll to Black Gate in exult
[19:48:23] <wjp> ...and used most of Serpent Isle's paperdoll art for that
[19:48:37] <wjp> ..., however, not all items in Black Gate have equivalents in Serpent Isle
[19:48:44] <wjp> so we need new art for that
[19:48:50] <wjp> s/that/those/
[19:49:12] <WishStone> Hmm... Any how do you guys do that? I mean I figgure a .jpg of that won't help you guys ;D
[19:49:53] <wjp> well, .jpg is the wrong format for pixel art since it's lossy
[19:50:24] <wjp> but I could probably use any art that 'fits' on the characters
[19:50:37] <wjp> (as long as the palette is right and I can read the graphics format)
[19:51:11] <WishStone> *grins* wjp, sorry, I guess I'm too hick. That still does not tell me what you guys want or need. New pictures, and that's about all i understood so far.
[19:51:28] <wjp> did you play SI?
[19:52:02] <WishStone> Yepps
[19:52:11] <WishStone> And you say you want new paperdoll graphics there.
[19:52:15] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/hawk2.png
[19:52:28] <WishStone> But how do you want them? I mean, I could send you a nice hand-drawn bag if that helps :P
[19:52:41] <wjp> the hawk in that image is an example of new art
[19:52:50] <WishStone> *nods* Seen that in the thread.
[19:53:01] <wjp> the rest of the image should look familiar from SI :-)
[19:53:20] <WishStone> Aye, indeed. So youneed png files, aye?
[19:54:23] <wjp> well, the format doesn't really matter that much, as long as it uses the right 256 colour palette
[19:54:50] <Colourless> any really needs to also take into account cycling indices too
[19:55:17] <wjp> (the .png I linked to has the right palette)
[19:55:34] * WishStone looks blankly at Colourless, then wjp
[19:56:11] <WishStone> Well, guess I can't help after all, as I don't understand much of what you guys are saying. And I can't ask my ex to "draw something, just that i have no idea how and where" :P
[19:56:32] <wjp> well, the "what" would be answered by a list I gave in that forum thread
[19:56:48] <Colourless> but that's fine
[19:57:37] <WishStone> wjp: I can draw you up a sword or whatnot, but I have no idea how you want it or want it implemented, thus it would be pretty useless.
[19:57:55] <WishStone> the "what" isn't answered by that list
[19:58:23] <WishStone> Because that list dosn'T tell me what colour palette you want, in what size, format, if you want the item alone or attached to the char....
[19:58:27] <wjp> not entirely no, I guess :-)
[19:59:32] <wjp> palette: the same one as the .png I linked to; size: so that it exactly fits on the avatar; format: png, preferably; alone would be best, but I can 'detach' the item from a character myself, if necessary
[20:00:14] <wjp> but don't worry about it :-)
[20:00:30] <wjp> I just asked because you happened to walk in at the right (or wrong ;-) ) time :-)
[20:00:33] <WishStone> Hmky...
[20:00:45] * WishStone mutters
[20:00:52] <WishStone> People always forget to explain stuff properly..
[20:00:59] <WishStone> yall need some good companion training :P
[20:01:03] <Colourless> neither wjp or i particularly want to be making art
[20:01:13] <WishStone> Read that, colour...
[20:01:19] <wjp> WishStone: yeah, maybe we do :-)
[20:01:28] <WishStone> And I'll help if I can.. but I needed input to even know what or how :P
[20:02:15] <Colourless> works like this, if you knew, then we could have just pawned off the work onto you :-)
[20:02:34] <WishStone> \:]
[20:04:18] <wjp> if you would like to do any particular items of the list, I can make some .pngs with the right palette of 'naked' characters on which you can draw
[20:05:01] <wjp> (you can still decide not to do it after all afterwards, of course :-) )
[20:07:16] <WishStone> I'd have to give it some looking into... i used to be great at pixel-shoving, I drew .ico's for a hobby for a long time :P
[20:08:36] <wjp> .ico's would indeed be about the right size :-)
[20:09:02] <WishStone> ?! Ico's are TINY!
[20:09:31] <Colourless> u7 ran at a really low resolution :-)
[20:09:49] <wjp> that hawk was 16x30 pixels
[20:09:50] <WishStone> I'm speaking about win3.11 Icos, perhaps I should have said that ;D
[20:09:57] <WishStone> ...seriously? Woha!
[20:10:44] <Colourless> i think i'll be going
[20:10:45] <-- Colourless has left IRC ("casts invisibility")
[20:14:24] <WishStone> Can you belive a clansman of my guild wrote a hymn for our guild? ;D
[20:14:52] <WishStone> www.Clan-Blackstar.org If you open that page, a tiny, tiny, tiny flash opens someplace, nothing more but a small black pixel realy.. playing the song.
[20:15:09] <wjp> hehe :-)
[20:16:42] <wjp> lol: (about solving the problem that people think linux is too hard) "We put the chairwoman of our workers' council on stage in front of all the municipal workers, and showed her using the new system. After that, we found that no man would say that he couldn't use his PC now that everyone knew a woman could do it,"
[20:17:17] <wjp> (from http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39146113,00.htm )
[20:19:55] <WishStone> Nice ;D
[20:25:09] <WishStone> Hm... i just realize that I don't have SI installed on my PC, only BG... Could you give me a pic of an avatar, wjp?
[20:25:19] <WishStone> wishstone@astroxys.de if you please :]
[20:27:34] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/paperdolls.png
[20:28:01] <WishStone> Thankies!
[20:28:18] <WishStone> You cheat ;D
[20:28:24] <wjp> I do?
[20:28:36] <WishStone> Both Avars in one party ;D
[20:28:43] <wjp> actually the left one is Jaana
[20:28:50] <WishStone> ooooh, okay :D
[20:29:10] <wjp> :-)
[20:37:25] * WishStone fumbles around with her graphic progs
[20:40:34] * wjp made some in-game screenshots of the items needing art
[20:41:01] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/clothes.png
[20:41:09] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/weapons.png
[20:41:39] <WishStone> Ahhhh, brilliant, thanks :D
[20:42:06] <wjp> if you need any reference items (SI swords, leather armour, etc...), I can supply those too :-)
[20:42:54] <WishStone> Anything welcome ;D
[20:43:23] <wjp> well, there are several hundreds of images; I'm not going to export all of them to .png ;-)
[20:46:11] <WishStone> Hmpf!
[20:46:34] <WishStone> Well,a s soon as I find that damned opetion where to set my brush in PSP into small pixels, I'm set :P
[20:50:23] <WishStone> Ammo... hanging from the belt?
[20:50:41] <wjp> hm, no, in the quiver on the hip
[20:51:26] <wjp> for arrows/bolts (the usual ammo), that "works", but I'm not sure how to make musket ammo fit there
[20:52:27] <WishStone> Hmmm...
[20:52:54] <WishStone> The bag could "stick out" of the quiver somehow perhaps?
[20:53:35] <wjp> something like that, probably
[20:53:52] <WishStone> Or painted over the quiver somehow....
[20:53:59] <WishStone> but that would be a HUGE bag :P
[20:54:07] * wjp checks drawing order to see if that's possible
[20:54:50] <wjp> the ammo seems to be drawn after the quiver, so it would be possible to make it overlap the quiver
[20:55:00] <WishStone> ahh, nice :D
[20:55:08] <WishStone> That would make things a bit easyer...
[20:59:07] <WishStone> hmm...
[20:59:17] <WishStone> The hawk pic you gave me has more pixels...
[20:59:50] <wjp> yes, that's scaled up
[21:00:11] <WishStone> Which will you use?
[21:00:24] <WishStone> more or less pixies? :P
[21:00:41] <wjp> exult does all the scaling itself, so the graphics themselves have to be small
[21:01:02] <WishStone> I see... so if you'd use that hawk for example in exult, it would be scaled down?
[21:01:51] <wjp> well, I'd scale it down manually before putting it into exult
[21:02:31] <WishStone> ah, okay...
[21:02:50] <wjp> sorry I forgot to mention that that first image was scaled up
[21:03:20] <WishStone> np :]
[21:12:25] <-- WishStone has left IRC (Nick collision from services.)
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[21:12:48] <WishStone> Hm, wjp, do you happen to use PSP?
[21:13:08] <wjp> back when I was using windows, yes
[21:13:43] <WishStone> So I guess you don't remember how I size down the use of pixels on the brush ;D
[21:15:22] <wjp> hm, wasn't there another tool that draws single pixels?
[21:15:40] <WishStone> No idea, *chuckles* I'll just keep digging
[21:16:17] <wjp> if not, I'm pretty sure there was a 'size' option in the paint brush tool options
[21:16:39] <WishStone> Indeed, and I've yet to find these ;D
[21:18:09] <wjp> right click on it?
[21:19:14] <WishStone> tried that, as it useually works on Windoof ;D
[21:21:42] * wjp wonders if PSP works in linux using wine
[21:36:00] <WishStone> aaaaaaaaaaaha!
[21:36:01] <WishStone> Finally
[21:36:04] <WishStone> only took me...
[21:36:15] <WishStone> 45 minutes to find :P
[21:41:04] <wjp> congrats :-)
[21:42:43] <WishStone> *steals a U7 bag and starts working with that*
[21:43:14] * Darke hides WishStone's mouse pointer, just to add that extra 'challenge'. *grin*
[21:43:38] * WishStone uses a Trackball... is it a Track-pointer now?
[21:44:36] * wjp adjusts Darke's eyesight
[21:44:47] <wjp> mice and trackballs really do look quite different :-)
[21:46:13] <WishStone> Had a Trackie ever since I had my first PC when I was 8 :D
[21:46:13] <Darke> Nope. It's always a mouse pointer no matter if it's a pad, trackball, 'normal' mouse, gyromouse, clitmouse, or what-have-you. *grin* I've got a trackball on my desk too, it's still mousing device. *grin*
[21:46:26] <WishStone> I can't use mice and all my friends freak out when they want to use my PC :P
[21:46:39] <Darke> Yeah, a trackball is good for that. *grin*
[21:47:03] <WishStone> Hmhmhmmm..
[21:47:11] <WishStone> Can't use Layers on that format.......
[21:47:14] <Darke> Doesn't work as well for lots of games, though they're mostly FPSes.
[21:48:36] * Darke hrms... looks like sprint has broken some of it's internal routes. I can't get to the other half of the .us.
[21:48:46] <wjp> WishStone: yes... that's a really annoying "feature" in PSP
[21:48:56] <wjp> no layers in indexed images
[21:49:16] <WishStone> Well, have to make a "new image" and then layer and safe as pnthingie
[21:50:09] <WishStone> Hmpf
[21:50:11] <WishStone> won't do it...
[21:51:01] <wjp> if you want to use layers you'll have to use an rgb image and later flatten it and convert it to the correct palette
[21:51:16] <wjp> you'll have to be careful only to use colours from the palette, though
[21:51:37] <WishStone> Problem is I haven't ben found out how to use the palette, either...
[21:51:50] <WishStone> Quite frustrating... but then again... I finally get some practice :P
[21:52:21] <wjp> hm, I don't think I ever found an easy way of doing palettes in PSP
[21:52:32] <WishStone> There is one :P
[21:52:41] <WishStone> only "soak" colours from the picture ;D
[21:52:53] <wjp> :-)
[21:52:58] <WishStone> RIGHT
[21:53:09] <wjp> LEFT
[21:53:18] * WishStone grabs the duct tape and quickly wraps up wjp in it till wjp can no longer move..!
[21:53:19] * WishStone paddles wjp for being naughty! 1 I can be naughty, too!!
[21:53:21] * WishStone stuffs a bag of 11,12Ice down wjp 's pants
[21:53:23] * WishStone looks sternly at wjp and starts scolding
[21:53:24] * WishStone slaps wjp around a bit with a large trout
[21:53:26] * WishStone slaps a large trout around a bit with wjp
[21:53:30] * WishStone mutters
[21:53:33] <WishStone> bad wjp, bad!
[21:53:40] * wjp wonders which one of those hurt more
[21:53:58] <WishStone> be glad I never wrote a whip-slap
[21:54:00] <WishStone> ;D
[21:55:00] * Darke thinks that sounds vaguely perverted and stays on the *other* side of the room to WishStone. *grin*
[21:55:31] <wjp> whips are a popular topic of conversation here, it seems
[21:56:43] <wjp> yesterday Dominus was having weird ideas about them :-)
[21:57:57] * Darke resists urge to make snarky comments.
[21:57:59] <WishStone> hmhmhmm..
[21:58:01] <WishStone> wjp?
[21:58:18] <WishStone> How is the pic being build up? Do you knwo what overlaps what?
[21:58:26] <WishStone> (Sorry, not pic, the paperdoll)
[21:58:46] <wjp> any specific things? It's built up of a couple of dozen parts
[22:01:38] <wjp> shield-behind-back, weapon-behind-back, backpack, cloak, body, legs (includes quiver), feet, ammo, torso armour, belt, head, neck, arms, torso armour (arm section), helmet, fingers, hands
[22:02:06] <wjp> (that's the drawing order, so items at the end overlap those at the beginning)
[22:02:29] <WishStone> Hm, sorry, I meant more like: What overlaps what?
[22:02:45] <WishStone> Body is ground layer I assume?
[22:02:52] <wjp> no
[22:03:00] <WishStone> oh :P
[22:03:28] <wjp> things are drawn in the order I gave; so the body overlaps the shield-behind-back, weapon-behind-back, backpack and cloak
[22:04:45] <WishStone> ah, okay...
[22:05:10] <WishStone> I was wondering if I make thebag appear to be hanging from the belt after all...
[22:05:20] <WishStone> And "brown-out" the bottom of the quiver, if that works.
[22:05:45] <wjp> hm, the quiver looks different if you're wearing leg armour, so you probably can't make it disappear
[22:06:17] <WishStone> hmhmhmmm..
[22:06:20] <wjp> not really necessary, of course, since the quiver will still be there, even if it's empty
[22:06:27] <WishStone> So the munition bag would have to fully overlap the quiver?
[22:06:54] <wjp> I wouldn't mind if the quiver still shows
[22:06:59] <WishStone> I do ;D
[22:07:23] <wjp> it would be weird if the quiver suddenly disappeared if you put ammo on your belt :-)
[22:07:26] <WishStone> Guess I can only make a bag "poke out" of the quiver then...
[22:07:36] <wjp> I kind of like the idea of it hanging on the belt, though
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[22:08:13] <wjp> just a pity it can't be on the belt because of the drawing order :-(
[22:11:29] * WishStone stuffs a bag in the quiver
[22:11:31] <WishStone> So there :P
[22:12:46] <WishStone> www.astroxys.de/baginquiver.png
[22:12:59] <WishStone> think it's too tiny?
[22:13:27] <wjp> no, size looks about right
[22:15:10] <WishStone> Right... hm... Musket...
[22:15:15] <WishStone> *skips Musket*
[22:15:18] <wjp> maybe you should move it down one pixel, though
[22:15:21] <WishStone> What swords are these?
[22:15:29] <WishStone> Down one? Can do
[22:15:37] <wjp> (one less row of black pixels)
[22:15:55] <WishStone> Okay
[22:17:38] <wjp> swords: custom sword, main gauche (= french for 'left hand')
[22:17:43] <wjp> custom sword: not sure about it
[22:18:04] <wjp> all I know is the in-game graphic in that weapons.png I posted. (it's the sword in the lower left)
[22:18:18] <WishStone> *nods*
[22:18:27] <WishStone> Mkay...
[22:18:46] <wjp> main gauche: about the size of a dagger (maybe a bit longer), usually used in your shield hand, although it can be in the weapons hand too
[22:18:56] <wjp> (main gauche is the one to the top right)
[22:19:40] <wjp> if I had to do a main gauche I would probably merge the graphics for a sword and a dagger
[22:20:01] <wjp> for a custom sword I'd take a sword and change the hilt
[22:20:39] * wjp pulls up art for sword/dagger
[22:22:28] <WishStone> okay, reload that image, I pushed it deeper in the quiver ;D
[22:23:42] <WishStone> www.astroxys.de/baginquiver.png
[22:23:53] <wjp> ok, I'll get to work on adding it to exult :-)
[22:23:56] <wjp> thanks :-)
[22:24:27] <WishStone> np ;] *pick out the next one
[22:28:38] <WishStone> wjp? Could I get a screenie of anyone holding any sword-weapon, please?
[22:30:09] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/art/paperdoll_sword.png
[22:33:04] <WishStone> Thanks :D I want to get the angloe right :D
[22:33:56] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/art/paperdoll_sword_belt.png
[22:34:20] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/art/sword.png
[22:34:22] <wjp> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/art/sword_belt.png
[22:41:30] * wjp studies up on how exactly ammo displaying works :-)
[22:53:42] <wjp> btw, with which name do you want to be listed in the credits?
[22:53:56] <WishStone> wishstone dragon
[22:54:45] <WishStone> Better fitting for Exult ;D
[22:55:02] * WishStone tinkers around with the sword
[22:55:58] * wjp finally managed to get the ammo into exult :-)
[22:57:01] <wjp> first time I added any type of ammo :-)
[22:57:09] <WishStone> You rock ;D
[22:59:51] <wjp> hm, interesting... I see I forgot an item on the list of needed art: the Avatar Costume used for the play in Britain's theatre
[23:00:06] * wjp wonders how on earth you'd make the avatar look like the avatar :-)
[23:03:01] <wjp> (while making it obvious that he's wearing a costume :-) )
[23:06:02] <-- WishStone has left IRC (Nick collision from services.)
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[23:23:26] <Ranger> Say wjp?
[23:23:31] --- Ranger is now known as Killzor
[23:23:34] <wjp> yes?
[23:23:49] <Killzor> Why don't you guys want to drew these changes actually? :P
[23:24:03] <wjp> we're not artists :-)
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[23:24:29] <WishStone> Baaah, look at what I just did, shoved a few pixels about, not THAT difficult ;D
[23:24:45] <wjp> it's surprisingly hard :-)
[23:25:01] <WishStone> ... *shrugs* okay ;D
[23:25:10] <wjp> that's not to say I didn't do any art, btw. I made about 10 items, although most are adaptations of existing items
[23:25:27] <WishStone> *chuckles*
[23:25:30] <WishStone> Okay then ;D
[23:25:51] <wjp> :-)
[23:30:28] --- WishStone is now known as WishStone|away
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[23:51:32] * wjp converted swamp boots into 'normal' shoes
[23:51:45] <wjp> ...and another paperdoll item done :-)