#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 12 Feb 2001 (GMT)

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[00:03:08] <Fingolfin> ?seen wjp
[00:03:08] <exultbot> wjp left IRC around Sun Feb 11 22:19:23 2001 (GMT) ([x]chat)
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[11:21:03] --> Nadir has joined #exult
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[11:51:36] <Nadir> hi
[11:51:50] <Fingolfin> hi nadir
[11:51:57] <Fingolfin> <sigh>
[11:52:09] <Nadir> no default op for you ?
[11:52:16] <Fingolfin> my grandma just came to hospital... now both my grandparents are there
[11:52:21] <Fingolfin> yes there is default op for me
[11:52:41] <Fingolfin> it was disabled because I joined the channel prior to identifying with nickserv
[11:53:05] <Nadir> My wife's grandfather is in hospital right now. And mine is not too well wither.
[11:53:11] <Nadir> s/wither/either/
[11:53:17] <Fingolfin> <sigh>
[11:53:24] <Fingolfin> we all have troubles I guess :(
[11:53:41] <Nadir> let's not discuss about things like these...
[11:54:32] <Fingolfin> yeah
[11:54:38] <Fingolfin> hey, I met Jameson today, in university
[11:54:46] <Fingolfin> I still have two vids of his ;)
[11:55:01] <Fingolfin> so we agreed to meet again on wednesday
[11:55:21] <Nadir> What did you talk about ?
[11:57:36] <Fingolfin> ah, just this and that; that I succesfully instaleld OS X yesterday (woo.hoo) and that this version finally allows me to connect to the internet (wooooo-hoooooo!!!)
[11:57:58] <Fingolfin> ... and that it killed my main system, too :( so I had to reinstall my OS 9.1 yesterday (grrrrr)
[11:58:00] <Nadir> Have you installed the X server ?
[11:58:09] <Fingolfin> nope not yet
[11:58:18] <Fingolfin> I also haven't installed yet the developer tools
[11:59:04] <Nadir> Hopefully you can run GIMP on that.
[11:59:42] <Fingolfin> well, I should be able to, in theory
[12:00:15] <Fingolfin> I have several apps that I want to try once I installed the dev tools: XonX (the X-Server), Jabber Server, GIMP, SDL, Exult ... ;)
[12:00:43] <Nadir> I've made a "Hoe of Destruction" which can be used in the paperdoll-enabled BG. I want to ask Colourless how they can be integrated.
[12:01:21] <Fingolfin> cool!!!
[12:01:27] <Fingolfin> picture available somewhere?
[12:01:47] <Nadir> If so I'm going to draw the faces of the NPCs that can be part of the party.
[12:02:06] <Nadir> It's just a red hoe.
[12:02:30] <Nadir> (didn't want to tax my art skills too much :-)
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[12:10:57] <Fingolfin> crashed :(
[12:10:59] <Fingolfin> oh my
[12:11:21] <Fingolfin> well, "just a red hoe" - but integrating it will allow us to see how to integrate future additions
[12:11:28] <Fingolfin> gives a nice reason to work on that ;)
[12:12:24] <Fingolfin> nadir: what did you change in the menus?
[12:12:55] <Nadir> The first two entries. They now say "Ultima VII: The Black Gate" and "Ultima VII part 2: Serpent Isle"
[12:18:14] <Fingolfin> ic
[12:18:22] <Nadir> ic ?
[12:18:46] <Fingolfin> "I see" ;)
[12:20:05] <Nadir> ah !
[12:20:37] <Fingolfin> hm, doesn't work properly for me... ah, it didn't recompile exultmenu.cc <grmbl>
[12:21:09] <Nadir> Then don't forget to run expack in data
[12:21:29] <Fingolfin> sure, I did that ;)
[12:21:33] <Fingolfin> works nice now!
[12:22:03] <Nadir> It should only display the entries for the games you have installed.
[12:22:25] <Fingolfin> I have installed both... let's see what happens if I remove one from the .cfg
[12:23:08] <Nadir> When I say "it should", it means "it doesn't work yet. we must implement it"
[12:23:16] <Fingolfin> hrm
[12:23:19] <Fingolfin> ahhh ;)
[12:23:43] <Fingolfin> you are right of course; I wished for that feature, too
[12:24:04] <Nadir> "It should" detect FOV and Silver Seed and change the entries too.
[12:24:26] <Fingolfin> yeah
[12:24:30] <Nadir> "It should" have a directory browser, so that users don't have to edit exult.cfg by hand
[12:24:41] * Fingolfin decides to finish the FAQ now so he has that done ;)
[12:24:48] <Fingolfin> right, it "should have" that!
[12:25:06] <Fingolfin> in fact, we had a dicussion about this some tiem ago
[12:25:29] <Fingolfin> I even have an idea how to do it neatly OS independent - we just "borrow" some ideas from Java...
[12:25:29] <Fingolfin> ;)
[12:25:54] <Fingolfin> the graphics are the tricky part, I think
[12:25:56] <Nadir> We need ExutlWidgets ! (actually we already have them: GUMPS)
[12:26:08] <Fingolfin> yeah
[12:26:19] <Fingolfin> they are fairly, static though
[12:26:44] <Fingolfin> ok, we have "Gump_button"
[12:26:55] <Fingolfin> but every button needs its own shape
[12:27:15] <Fingolfin> it would be nice if button graphics were generated "on the fly"
[12:28:03] <Nadir> Yes.
[12:28:35] <Nadir> Then we wouldn't need those silly "text" shapes I've been doing for the menus
[12:30:02] <Nadir> Colourless said he may be committing the schedule/NPC editor stuff today
[12:31:58] <Nadir> Exult crashed in combat !
[12:34:55] <Nadir> Projectile_effects is trying to display shape 599 frame 11 (which doesn't exist).
[12:35:02] <Fingolfin> hrm
[12:35:12] <Fingolfin> jeff worked on that recently, IIRC
[12:36:01] --> Colourless has joined #Exult
[12:36:06] <Colourless> hi
[12:36:12] <Fingolfin> hi man
[12:36:26] <Nadir> hi c'less.
[12:37:23] <Nadir> ryan: I have a simple shape to show the "Hoe of Destruction" in the BG paperdolls. If I add it to exult.flx, how can I get the Paperdoll_gump to show it if I'm wielding it ?
[12:38:22] <Colourless> there isn't a way at the moment.
[12:38:44] <Nadir> You mean there may be in the next 5 minutes :-)
[12:39:21] <Colourless> no. Add in the shape, and I'll have something up tonight my time.
[12:40:36] <Fingolfin> has anyone changed anything on the web page recently (other than me) ?
[12:40:57] <Colourless> probably not
[12:42:34] <Nadir> Colourless: what about portraits for the party, can I start working on those ?
[12:43:06] <Colourless> you can if you want.
[12:44:39] <Nadir> Max: I tried to apply the fix discussed on the mailing list re: ~A_star_queue. It crashes on Linux.
[12:45:01] <Fingolfin> Nadir: it does? hrmmmm
[12:45:11] <Fingolfin> Nadir: I haven't tried it here yet anyway
[12:45:26] <Colourless> the old fix crashed Win32 as well
[12:45:39] <Fingolfin> tsa ;)
[12:45:54] <Fingolfin> maybe we made a more fundamental mistake, then
[12:45:58] <Fingolfin> I will check the code later
[12:46:07] <Fingolfin> but now I really realyl realyl want to finisht the FAQ upgrade!
[12:46:08] <Fingolfin> ;)
[12:46:12] --- Fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|FAQ
[12:46:41] <Nadir> FingolFAQ !
[12:47:39] <Nadir> Colourless: schedule editor ?
[12:48:23] <Colourless> what about it :)
[12:48:33] <Fingolfin|FAQ> where should I put exult_faq.xml and faq.xsl once I am finished? I mean, where in CVS - into the main dir, into a subfolder? (name of subfolder?)
[12:51:47] <Nadir> We should reorganize the "docs" directory into tech docs and info docs. Put it there.
[12:53:54] <Nadir> Colourless: where is it ?
[12:53:59] <Nadir> :)
[12:54:23] <Colourless> ready... but i broke the scalers... badly
[12:54:50] <Nadir> oops
[12:54:57] <Nadir> I guess you didn't want to do that !
[12:55:06] <Colourless> no, i didn't :)
[12:55:46] <Colourless> ah, i see the problem
[12:56:44] <Nadir> can you switch scalers without recompiling now ?
[12:57:32] <Colourless> almost, I just need to fix that bug, another bug in the bilinear scaler (it hadn't been updated in some time) and also put in a config value
[12:58:00] <Nadir> Hey, I am now officially a Dragon !
[12:58:08] <Colourless> cool
[13:01:30] <Nadir> Colourless: do we now have a total of 3 scalers ?
[13:01:44] <Colourless> se will have 4
[13:02:05] <Colourless> make that "we will have 4"
[13:02:09] <Nadir> 2xSAI, raster, the old one and ?
[13:03:00] <Nadir> let me guess: simple pixel doubling ?
[13:03:01] <Colourless> 2xSAI, point sampled, bilinear and interlaced point sampled
[13:03:14] <Nadir> ah
[13:03:37] <Colourless> interlaced is only useful when running in a high res
[13:03:54] <Colourless> i use it when running in a window
[13:21:41] --> TonyHoyt has joined #exult
[13:21:47] <TonyHoyt> Hello people. What's new?
[13:22:15] <Nadir> check the logs
[13:22:41] <TonyHoyt> @help
[13:22:47] <TonyHoyt> What's the log url agian?
[13:22:51] <Nadir> ?logs
[13:22:51] <exultbot> Logs are available at http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/exultlog.php3
[13:22:55] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ?lof
[13:22:58] <Fingolfin|FAQ> err
[13:22:58] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ;)
[13:23:05] <TonyHoyt> That's it! I keep forgetting what the command character is.
[13:23:23] <Fingolfin|FAQ> http://fingolfin.dyndns.org/ - I am working on the final stuff, the "config" section
[13:26:34] <TonyHoyt> Neat neat. So with the new GM Paperdolls, is the disucssion about the hoe of destruction about someone altering a hoe paperdoll to look like the hoe of destruction or does one exist already in SI?
[13:27:05] <Nadir> Fingolfin|FAQ: 3.1 is screwed
[13:27:58] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Nadir: FAQ 3.1 is of course scrwewd I am working on that right now ;) i haven't yet implemented the style for that
[13:28:11] <Nadir> TonyHoyt: the SI paperdoll stuff is missing a "Hoe of Destruction". I just created one and it's now Colourless' job to get it integrated with the rest
[13:29:29] <TonyHoyt> *nods* That's cool. So custom 'shapes'? What are those objects called that show up in the SI-style paperdolls?
[13:31:40] <Nadir> shapes
[13:32:07] <Colourless> :)
[13:32:10] <Nadir> Fingolfin|FAQ: faq is looking good
[13:32:20] <Fingolfin|FAQ> nadir: thx
[13:33:34] <TonyHoyt> Okay so I did have it right. So these custom shapes would have to patched onto the shape data file for all users who wish to use the si-style paperdolls in BG with the new shapes or can it be just a seperate file that exult looks to?
[13:33:48] <Nadir> Fingolfin|FAQ: 1.9 ... is Linux/i386 and Linux/Alpha
[13:34:06] <Nadir> no patching
[13:34:14] <Colourless> TonyHoyt: separate file
[13:34:39] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Nadir: OK, will fix
[13:34:45] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I wonder if I will get it rund under OS X ;)
[13:36:36] <Fingolfin|FAQ> both complaints fixed, I hope ;)
[13:36:54] <TonyHoyt> Cool.
[13:36:57] <Fingolfin|FAQ> (the links in 3.1 are still wrong, I know)
[13:38:44] <Fingolfin|FAQ> the FAQ on Path Settings is very Windows centric.. hrm
[13:42:52] <Nadir> ?seen dancer
[13:42:52] <exultbot> I haven't seen dancer lately
[13:42:57] <Nadir> ?freedman
[13:43:04] <Nadir> ?seen freedman
[13:43:04] <exultbot> freedman left IRC around Fri Feb 9 19:41:26 2001 (GMT) (Leaving)
[13:45:40] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ?wjp
[13:45:46] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ?seen wjp
[13:45:46] <exultbot> wjp left IRC around Sun Feb 11 22:19:23 2001 (GMT) ([x]chat)
[13:45:49] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ?seen jameson
[13:45:49] <exultbot> jameson left #exult around Sat Feb 10 00:26:05 2001 (GMT)
[13:47:40] <Nadir> ?seen
[13:48:09] <Nadir> RFE: exultbot should display "last seen" messages for all non-online users.
[13:58:48] <Fingolfin|FAQ> yeah
[13:59:12] <Fingolfin|FAQ> do you prefer "CTRL-h" or "CTRL h" or "CTRL H" or "ctrl-h" or "ctrl-h" or "Ctrl-h" or what? ;)
[13:59:42] <TonyHoyt> all the above?
[13:59:57] * Fingolfin|FAQ thwaps TonyHoyt
[13:59:57] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ;)
[14:00:05] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I want to know which style I should use in the FAQ
[14:00:06] <TonyHoyt> *chuckles*
[14:00:19] <Colourless> you forgot Ctrl-H
[14:00:29] <Colourless> and Ctrl H
[14:00:30] <Colourless> and... :)
[14:00:33] <TonyHoyt> ctrl-h works for me.
[14:00:53] <Fingolfin|FAQ> grrrrrrrr
[14:01:04] <Fingolfin|FAQ> tony: OK
[14:01:15] <TonyHoyt> Hye, Just my two cents!
[14:01:22] <Colourless> also you said ctrl-h twice :)
[14:01:32] <TonyHoyt> I don't know, I might change my mind in ten seconds!
[14:01:36] <Fingolfin|FAQ> /kick Colourless
[14:01:50] <Fingolfin|FAQ> you are all mean and want to prevent a hard working man from finishing his work ;)
[14:01:52] <Colourless> you wouldn't dare
[14:02:04] <TonyHoyt> *chuckles*
[14:02:13] <TonyHoyt> Oooooooooh, getting personal now..
[14:02:13] <Colourless> i'm busy my own things, and I'm not feeling well :(
[14:02:16] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Anyway, I think this looks ugly: "Alt-+/-"
[14:02:36] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Colourless: ah, Nadir and me had that discussion earlier today
[14:04:07] <Nadir> did we ?
[14:04:27] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Nadir: about personal troubles
[14:04:47] <Nadir> oh yes.
[14:05:06] <Fingolfin|FAQ> anyway, let peace reign and check out the "finalized" FAQ, please
[14:07:18] <Nadir> looking good
[14:07:49] <Nadir> Can we use the xsl for other docs ?
[14:07:56] <Fingolfin|FAQ> we can
[14:09:59] <TonyHoyt> Later guys. Enjoy the day!
[14:10:11] <Nadir> eyb
[14:10:17] <TonyHoyt> Love your guys work. Thanks for doing it.
[14:10:18] <TonyHoyt> Bye.
[14:10:19] <-- TonyHoyt has left #exult
[14:10:24] <Colourless> cya
[14:11:02] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ya-hooooo!! http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http://fingolfin.dyndns.org/
[14:11:07] <Fingolfin|FAQ> "No errors found!"
[14:11:09] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ;)
[14:11:47] <Nadir> Add that W3C icon !
[14:12:02] <Fingolfin|FAQ> well, I think I first need to get the other pages ready for that ;)
[14:14:03] <Nadir> Fingolfin|FAQ: is that strict HTML4 ?
[14:14:36] <Fingolfin|FAQ> nadir: the FAQ is transitional XHTML
[14:14:43] <Fingolfin|FAQ> the other stuff, well, I need to clean that up a bit
[14:16:18] <Fingolfin|FAQ> the <doctype> tags were wrong
[14:18:24] <Fingolfin|FAQ> the W3C logo, should I add it right next to the SF logo?
[14:18:28] <Nadir> yes
[14:30:50] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ok, all pages are now w3c valid!
[14:31:03] <Fingolfin|FAQ> hmm
[14:31:14] <Fingolfin|FAQ> maybe I could even reach strict?
[14:32:19] <Nadir> What would you need for that ?
[14:32:26] <Fingolfin|FAQ> eek, forget it
[14:32:37] <Nadir> why ?
[14:32:37] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I would need to remove all style information (e.g. colors) and use CSS instead
[14:32:48] <Fingolfin|FAQ> maybe one day, but not now ;)
[14:33:14] <Nadir> and you told me CSS was a bad idea :-)
[14:34:43] <Colourless> it is for netscape
[14:35:10] <Nadir> Not really. Unless you do strange things. and only for Netscape < 6
[14:35:17] <Fingolfin|FAQ> well
[14:35:19] <Fingolfin|FAQ> it is, really
[14:35:34] <Fingolfin|FAQ> e.g. it does not work at all in NS if you have JavaScript off
[14:35:45] <Fingolfin|FAQ> but I like CSS
[14:35:56] <Nadir> Basically I don't care much for broken browsers.
[14:36:20] <Nadir> IE on MacOS has much better CSS support than any of the windows versions.
[14:37:39] <Fingolfin|FAQ> yeah
[14:37:57] <Fingolfin|FAQ> oh, I nealy forgot, I also have to make an XSL for the text FAQ!
[14:38:10] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ah, I will do this later, first let me get this site update online ;)
[14:40:00] <Nadir> loki.open-source.sdl: CVS Update (MacOS works great!) - Sam Lantinga
[14:41:10] <Nadir> Fixed keyboard handling on MacOS X and MacOS classic
[14:41:23] <Fingolfin|FAQ> cool, finally!
[14:41:27] * Fingolfin|FAQ reads the email, too
[14:41:31] <Nadir> Fixed mouse cursor visibility when switching apps on MacOS
[14:41:56] <Fingolfin|FAQ> yes!!!
[14:42:02] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I was about to quote that, too ;)
[14:42:07] <Fingolfin|FAQ> it bugged me for a long time
[14:42:24] <Fingolfin|FAQ> and a sound bug...
[14:42:32] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I wonder if that means Speech works now!
[14:42:38] <Nadir> lots of MacOS X stuff
[14:44:05] <Colourless> ok, setting scalers in the config file works
[14:44:26] <Nadir> so it's ready to commit now ?
[14:45:01] <Colourless> almost. I need to write the changelog entry, and remove and debugging code that I may have left in.
[14:45:20] <Colourless> s/and/any
[14:50:25] * Nadir 's jaw drops: http://www.worldforge.org/images/screenshots/mountain_bridge_ta.JPG
[14:52:11] <Fingolfin|FAQ> ok, webpage & FAQ updated
[14:52:33] <Fingolfin|FAQ> neat
[14:54:25] <Fingolfin|FAQ> wtf
[14:55:37] <Fingolfin|FAQ> I don't get this...
[14:55:40] <Nadir> what
[14:55:47] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Opera Beta and IE display http://exult.sourceforge.net/ properly
[14:55:57] <Colourless> i take it that wf is 2d
[14:56:03] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Mozilla and iCab don't display anthing
[14:56:19] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Netscape 4.5 displays text instead of rendering the html
[14:56:36] <Fingolfin|FAQ> BTW, we crossed the 30000 a few mins ago!
[14:57:46] <Nadir> For some reason index.html is tagged as text/plain
[14:58:14] <Colourless> I'm guessing that Fingolfin wants me to use std:: :)
[14:58:50] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Nadir: I am investigating this
[14:59:02] <Fingolfin|FAQ> Colourless: ?!? you are right, though ;)
[14:59:28] <Colourless> this is going to take a while... :)
[15:00:56] <Colourless> i'd also think i have to use snprintf as well wouldn't i
[15:01:09] <Nadir> Yes. No buffer underruns.
[15:01:15] <Nadir> s/under/over/
[15:02:16] <Fingolfin|FAQ> yes, good idea ;)
[15:03:27] <Fingolfin|FAQ> grrrrrrr
[15:03:45] <Fingolfin|FAQ> why does the SF server send it as text/plain?!?
[15:04:57] <Colourless> because it's SF? :)
[15:06:25] <Fingolfin|FAQ> that's too obvious ;)
[15:06:58] <Colourless> Nadir: with the Paperdoll shapes I wanted them to be in a different flx file, at the moment, I'll just use Exult.flx. However, the changes wont be in the commit that I'm going to do
[15:07:28] <Nadir> exult_paperdoll.flx ?
[15:07:35] <Nadir> exult_gfx.flx
[15:07:50] <Colourless> something like that
[15:07:59] <Nadir> At any rate they would have to go in a seaparate directory, because of the flx.in stuff.
[15:08:17] <Fingolfin|FAQ> it seems the problem is that I used "optimized" HTML, i.e. all unused spaces stripped out (amounted to almost 15k saved for all files together)
[15:08:18] <Colourless> yeah, and getting it to work on mac :)
[15:08:58] <Colourless> Fingolfin, go write a better OS for macs :)
[15:09:01] --- Fingolfin|FAQ is now known as Fingolfin
[15:09:09] <Fingolfin> Colourless: no need, I have OS X ;)
[15:09:23] <Fingolfin> Colourless: but... the expack issues on mac are resolved, so what are you talking about?
[15:09:59] <Colourless> ah, so they are
[15:10:25] <Fingolfin> aaaarggh
[15:10:29] <Fingolfin> now the FAQ is broken
[15:10:30] <Fingolfin> <sigh>
[15:11:46] <Nadir> Loading it locally works for Mozilla.
[15:11:57] <Colourless> i have modified 34 files, not including makefile
[15:12:24] <Nadir> Fingolfin: home page works now.
[15:12:24] <Fingolfin> Nadir: yes, the problem is the SF server
[15:12:36] <Fingolfin> but the FAQ not, I am uploading a tweaked version now
[15:12:41] <Nadir> Apache ?
[15:13:10] <Fingolfin> anyway, the SF server seems to have switched - before it used the extension only to detect content - now it seems to parse the content, and for some reasons chokes on lines with 40K ;)
[15:13:20] <Fingolfin> maybe they read line-by-line, into a small buffer?
[15:13:49] <Fingolfin> now it works
[15:14:10] <Nadir> odd.
[15:14:51] <Nadir> And I guess Mozilla's behaviour is correct, in that it renders text/plain as is.
[15:15:02] <Fingolfin> right
[15:15:10] <Fingolfin> in fact, IE is buggy cause it does not do so!
[15:15:36] <Fingolfin> this has caused me grief in the past, when I wanted to view xml files, and it tried to render them - effectively stripping out all "tags"
[15:15:38] <Colourless> i think IE does it's own Extension checking
[15:15:44] <Fingolfin> yeah
[15:15:54] <Fingolfin> well
[15:16:02] <Fingolfin> that is I think it does do it based on the content
[15:16:09] <Fingolfin> it checks if it "looks like" HTML
[15:16:34] <Colourless> for me it properly detects XML, and even renders it with nice colours
[15:16:50] <Nadir> Fingolfin: also the IE teams are separate (Win32 and MacOS). They are effectively different browsers.
[15:17:01] <Nadir> Talk about code reuse.
[15:17:58] <Fingolfin> Nadir: in fact, they seem to be arch enemies (the two teams) ;)
[15:18:12] <Fingolfin> Nadir: rumours are they dislike each other a lot
[15:18:19] <Nadir> Microsoft never learns.
[15:18:49] <Fingolfin> Nadir: the Mac IE is *very* different. E.g. did you know that it has the best PNG support of *all* browsers? 100% support in fact
[15:19:18] <Nadir> What about recent nightlies of Mozilla.
[15:19:31] <Nadir> alpha in png is cool. Mozilla even has mng support.
[15:19:58] <Fingolfin> well, maybe the very recent Mozilla builds are equally good
[15:20:10] <Fingolfin> at least 0.7 still has PNG features missing
[15:20:43] <Nadir> tell me where to point my Moz and I'll check.
[15:22:44] <Nadir> Is there a png-test page ?
[15:23:15] <Fingolfin> http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/
[15:23:23] <Fingolfin> I am looking for the test page right now
[15:24:16] <Fingolfin> hm, it seems Mozilla is good now, too ;)
[15:27:08] <Nadir> where did you read that.
[15:28:09] <Fingolfin> http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/pngmoz.html
[15:28:15] <Fingolfin> btw, try http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/pngs-img.html
[15:29:00] <Fingolfin> gm, but that page is old
[15:31:25] <Fingolfin> try http://www.verbal.nildram.co.uk/mozpng.html please
[15:32:49] <Nadir> going there now
[15:33:54] <Nadir> Three strips ?
[15:34:25] <Nadir> that last url works
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[15:35:05] <Colourless> Opps :)
[15:36:13] <Nadir> I think Moz 0.8 has near-perfect png support (if not perfect)
[15:48:51] <Fingolfin> good!
[15:48:56] <Fingolfin> wb cless
[15:49:23] <Colourless> :)
[15:54:25] <Nadir> Colourless: what is your timezone ?
[15:54:54] <Colourless> +1030
[15:55:39] <Nadir> So is it now 4.30 am ?
[15:55:49] <Colourless> 2:32 am
[15:56:40] <Colourless> with the scalers it doesn't automatically create the config entry, should i change it so it does?
[15:57:00] <Nadir> It's a good idea.
[15:57:38] <Colourless> Need to write somewhere what each scaler does. I'm using numerical values to choose
[15:58:43] <Nadir> can't you use a string description?
[15:59:01] <Colourless> I could do
[15:59:43] <Colourless> i'll make the changes
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[16:53:29] <Colourless> uh oh. Serpent Isle isn't working....
[17:07:02] <Colourless> and it was because I had set exult to use a custom keybinding file that didn't exist.
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[17:22:30] <Colourless> i think i'm ready... btw Hi wjp
[17:23:15] <wjp> hi
[17:23:35] <wjp> Fingolfin: are you here?
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[17:34:47] <Fingolfin> phone, brb
[17:35:37] <Colourless> changes
[17:35:44] <Colourless> committed
[17:43:54] <wjp> hmm... compile error
[17:44:01] <Colourless> where
[17:44:05] <wjp> looks like I need to reconfigure
[17:44:21] <wjp> (and subsequently do a clean make)
[17:44:58] <Fingolfin> back
[17:45:03] <Fingolfin> wjp: I added that u8 link
[17:45:08] <Fingolfin> not online yet, though
[17:45:12] <wjp> k
[17:45:34] <Fingolfin> about the faq mod date: problem is that I haven't found a neat way to generate dates with XSLT yet :/
[17:45:35] <Fingolfin> well, there is one
[17:45:58] <Fingolfin> but complicated: I could write a Java script into the .xsl file that generates it... grmbl
[17:46:46] <wjp> hmm
[17:47:20] <wjp> btw, I just committed a patch to fix a warning. (comma at end of enum)
[17:48:04] <Fingolfin> anyway, I wonder why the SF web server generated the text/plain headers for the .html files when I optimized them!!
[17:48:31] <Fingolfin> It is really annoying - e.g. the FAQ is 50KB normally, but only 38 optimized
[17:48:53] <wjp> optimized as in 'uneditable' ? ;-)
[17:49:05] <wjp> hmm... still compiler error
[17:49:18] <Colourless> and it is?
[17:49:28] <wjp> exult_types.h:41: #error "Please make sure a 16 bit type is provided by exult_types.h
[17:49:35] <wjp> and the same for 32 bit
[17:49:39] <Colourless> not my problem :)
[17:49:57] <wjp> yes, since it's the exult_types.h included in cheat_screen.cc :-)
[17:50:03] <Fingolfin> wjp: well, yes, "uneditable" - but then, it is only one click with a decent HTML editor to format the html again!
[17:50:16] <Colourless> check the headers that i've included
[17:50:21] <wjp> hmm... I tend to use vi on my SF shell account...
[17:50:27] <Fingolfin> wjp: and I think the people with modem connection will be a bit... unhappy... about 12KB of whitespace, no?
[17:50:27] <wjp> brb
[17:51:01] <Colourless> i don't think i included the autoconfigure header
[17:51:41] <Fingolfin> ok, I'll be brave and co... wonder already what will not compile ;)
[17:52:46] <wjp> b
[17:52:54] <Fingolfin> wb
[17:53:12] <wjp> Colourless: you forgot config.h
[17:53:22] <Colourless> as i said... not MY problem ;)
[17:53:30] <Colourless> hehe
[17:53:35] <wjp> warning: control reaches end of non-void function `Usecode_machine::UI_set_new_schedules(int, int, int, Usecode_value *)'
[17:53:39] <wjp> <- and that one?
[18:01:41] * wjp keeps on fixing warnings...
[18:01:41] <wjp> Ryan, you know that you're not supposed a comma at the end of an enum, right? :-)
[18:01:41] <Colourless> yes I know
[18:01:41] <Colourless> that intrinsic.cc file needs a blank line added at the bottom
[18:01:41] <wjp> already added it
[18:01:41] <Colourless> i wonder why I'm not getting warnings for the commas
[18:01:41] <wjp> I fixed enums in imagewin.h, keys.h, endline in intrinsics.cc and config.h in cheat_screen.h
[18:01:41] <wjp> cheat_screen.cc, sorry
[18:01:41] <wjp> ok, compiles now
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[18:02:05] <Colourless> also read the update I made to NEWS
[18:02:09] <wjp> hmm... alt-F2 is taken too
[18:02:26] <wjp> ah, F12 works :-)
[18:02:55] <Colourless> most things will give a "Not avaliable" error or similar
[18:03:35] <Fingolfin> wjp: please commit your changes, so I have them before I begun fixing the compile errors I get here ;)
[18:03:46] <wjp> Fingolfin: I already did
[18:03:56] <Fingolfin> good
[18:05:19] <wjp> why don't these NPC's have anything worth stealing? :-(
[18:06:02] <Fingolfin> colourless: hm, NEWS changes maybe should get another title - after all, your changes are *not* part of v0.91 Alpha 2
[18:06:08] <wjp> ah, I like your solution to the npc number getting solution
[18:06:10] <Colourless> ok
[18:06:25] <Colourless> change it, then to something more suitable.
[18:06:27] <wjp> Fingolfin: I'm already fixing NEWS atm
[18:06:36] <Fingolfin> good
[18:06:44] <wjp> (couple of typos)
[18:07:07] <Fingolfin> wjp: that npc number thing was not invented by Ryan, I believe, but suggest on JackChaos? ;)
[18:07:34] <wjp> really? ah well, still a good solution :-)
[18:08:29] <Colourless> the number one was, the 'grab actor' though, I can't remember if it was me or someone else. It is the only way to edit "monster npcs"
[18:11:37] <Fingolfin> now I get link errors
[18:12:49] <Fingolfin> ah ok
[18:12:54] <Fingolfin> let's see how it crashs
[18:14:24] <Fingolfin> hrm, credits/quotes are now broken... hrm
[18:14:32] <Fingolfin> ah no, not...!
[18:14:36] * Fingolfin looks fearful
[18:14:46] <Fingolfin> noooooo
[18:14:50] <wjp> endlines?
[18:14:51] <Fingolfin> it is broken in the release, too
[18:14:54] <Fingolfin> yes
[18:14:55] <Fingolfin> of course
[18:15:02] <Fingolfin> I had to fix TextScroller in the past
[18:15:09] <Fingolfin> but we changed exult.flx receently :(
[18:17:11] <wjp> hmm... is it just me, or does shift no longer work to speed up the scrolling, after Exult has lost and regained focus?
[18:17:40] <Fingolfin> dunno
[18:17:43] <wjp> ah, looks like events are piling up
[18:17:52] <Fingolfin> I think that the shift speed should be normal speed, and shift should be even faster ;)
[18:17:57] <Fingolfin> also, alt should reverse scrolling
[18:18:06] <Colourless> shift has no effect for at the moment
[18:23:11] <Colourless> no, it does work,
[18:23:11] <Fingolfin> finally, if I click to exit the scrolling, it catches on mouse down ; but hte exult menu catches the mouse_up, hence the click to end credits/quotes can trigger a menu
[18:23:11] <wjp> hmm...
[18:23:11] * wjp check SDL reference
[18:23:11] <Colourless> it also works after task swapping
[18:23:11] <Fingolfin> I will fix it
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[18:24:56] <Fingolfin> commited some fixes
[18:25:24] <Colourless> what's up with Exult bot?
[18:25:37] <wjp> univ. seems to be having some connection problems :-(
[18:26:05] <Colourless> also who is 'chimera|work'
[18:26:11] <wjp> that's Matt
[18:26:36] <wjp> hmmm... I could've sworn I fixed this textscroller unresponsiveness before
[18:27:06] <wjp> only handle one event every 150ms == bad :-)
[18:27:31] <wjp> or maybe that was a similar problem for the intro code... ah well, whatever
[18:28:11] <Colourless> fingolfin: what did you remove from cheat_screen.cc? It's a work in progress you know
[18:28:47] <wjp> dinner's ready... bbl
[18:28:49] <Fingolfin> colourless: err... sorry. but I only removed two unused char buf[512]
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[18:28:55] <Fingolfin> have a nice meal
[18:29:03] <wjp|dinner> thx
[18:29:07] <Colourless> that's ok
[18:29:23] <Fingolfin> cless: does http://exult.sourceforge.net/faq.shtml work properly for you?
[18:29:55] <Colourless> no: "The XML page cannot be displayed "
[18:30:43] <Fingolfin> yeah
[18:30:49] <Fingolfin> I'll fix it
[18:34:11] <Fingolfin> fixed
[18:36:14] <Colourless> it is?
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[18:45:22] <wjp> and both of them return at the same time :-)
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[18:54:34] <Colourless> Another problem was some conversations said in the knights hall were repeated and the crystal ball that you look though in Harnna's place doesn't work so you can't attempt to find cantra
[18:54:36] <Fingolfin> colourless, wjp: the faq page *should* be working, does it?
[18:54:44] <Colourless> fingolfin: yes it does
[18:54:50] <wjp> Fingolfin: 10 minutes ago it did
[18:54:55] <Fingolfin> ok
[18:55:06] <Fingolfin> only because cless said: "it is" ;)
[18:55:33] <wjp> still working ok :-)
[18:55:40] <Colourless> all because of me... wow
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[18:57:59] <Fingolfin|brb> cless: muwahaha
[18:58:37] <Colourless> cool, gorlab swamp now works. :) of crouse we need to impliment map wrapping so it will work properly
[19:06:30] <wjp> the dreamworld lies on the edge of the map?
[19:06:49] <Colourless> yes, half is on the left, half is on the right
[19:07:17] <wjp> we should probably add a few "% s_num_schunks" 's to the renderer code
[19:07:31] <Colourless> the si team used the map space they had most efficently
[19:07:33] <wjp> umm.. c_num_schunks? or something like that anyway
[19:07:44] <wjp> yes, very efficiently :-)
[19:08:00] <wjp> I noticed that while fixing the map-teleport :-)
[19:08:16] <wjp> I kept ending up in really weird places, only to find I was only about 1 screen off :-)
[19:08:42] <Colourless> i could beleive that
[19:09:20] <wjp> should we change the teleport-map to a scaled down version of the real in-game map?
[19:09:50] <Colourless> we could do that, but how will it be created?
[19:10:00] <wjp> my 'blackgate_digital_camera' code :-)
[19:10:08] <wjp> look in Init() in exult.cc
[19:10:18] <Colourless> the map it would produce for SI would be most interesting
[19:10:51] <wjp> I've got 150 Mb of .png's in my BG directory :-)
[19:11:27] <Colourless> i wouldn't have he HD space to try something like that at the moment
[19:11:46] <wjp> you should see the original .pcx version ;-)
[19:12:00] <wjp> I wonder how I should patch them together
[19:12:10] <wjp> (it's one file per superchunk atm)
[19:12:31] <Colourless> do you even have a program that could load a file that big
[19:12:40] <wjp> I doubt it
[19:13:33] <wjp> I should probably scale them down to a reasonable size first, them patch them together, and then scale it down further
[19:14:22] <wjp> btw, have you read this? http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=01/02/11/016201&threshold=1&commentsort=0&mode=thread&cid=6
[19:14:37] <Colourless> no
[19:21:35] <Colourless> that's good
[19:23:51] <Colourless> fixing the wrap around world problem is going to take ALOT of work. Not only will the renderer need changing (easy part), pathfinding will also need changing, as well other code that I haven't thought of yet
[19:24:10] <wjp> hmm... true :-(
[19:24:57] <Colourless> I think wrap around world fixing should become a priority, we leave it any longer and I could become more difficult
[19:25:13] <Colourless> and IT could
[19:25:56] <wjp> :-) almost thought you were threatening there ;-)
[19:26:16] <Colourless> sounds like a quote to me
[19:26:23] <Colourless> "we leave it any longer and I could become more difficult"
[19:26:32] <wjp> :-)
[19:26:38] <wjp> I'll add it
[19:27:35] <Colourless> :)
[19:31:39] <wjp> hmm, is cvs working for you?
[19:32:52] <Colourless> no it's not
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[19:34:01] <Fingolfin> b
[19:34:08] <wjp> wb
[19:34:35] <Fingolfin> "renderer need changing (easy part)" - that was a joke, right?
[19:34:58] <wjp> why?
[19:35:22] <wjp> it should just be adding a few "% c_num_schunks"'s, right?
[19:35:28] * Fingolfin tries to find out how many bugs on SF were cancelled because "fiddling with the rendered is likely to break a lot of other stuff, hence I will not fix this -- Jeff"
[19:35:44] <wjp> ??
[19:35:59] <Fingolfin> well, the question is if it is really that simple
[19:36:07] <Fingolfin> anyway, there are still several renderer bugs
[19:36:23] <wjp> yeah :-(
[19:36:32] <Fingolfin> if you say it is easy to fix, go ahead; but be prepared to find out in a few weeks what else broke ;) that is not a reason not to do it, though ;)
[19:36:40] <wjp> maybe we should do that z-buffering thing someone got from the .exe
[19:36:49] <Fingolfin> yeah
[19:43:57] <Fingolfin> that ./ thing is nice ;)
[19:44:02] <Fingolfin> but freshsheep.net does not exist :(
[19:44:07] <Fingolfin> now where do I get my sheep news then?
[19:44:46] <wjp> :-)
[19:45:12] <wjp> FIRST MOONWALK!!!
[19:45:31] <Colourless> you did not
[19:45:36] <Colourless> :)
[19:45:40] <wjp> heh :-)
[19:45:47] <wjp> spoil-sport :-)
[19:45:58] <Colourless> :-P
[19:46:04] <wjp> maybe we should add a "FIRST QUOTE!" quote? ;-)
[19:46:44] <Colourless> maybe.
[19:47:08] <wjp> nah :-)
[19:52:28] <Fingolfin> that would be lame ;)
[19:53:04] <Colourless> after checking the chunk info, it should be simple to change the renderer for wrapping, and of course break lots of things. When rendering exult addresses each chunk using X and Y coords. Simply allowing negetive chunks and out of range chunks and using a % would be enough
[19:53:35] <Fingolfin> hm...does % handle neg nums correctly?
[19:53:40] <Colourless> no
[19:53:42] <Fingolfin> I always forget if it does...
[19:53:56] <Fingolfin> ah, well, shouldn't be hard to write a func/macro MOD(x,y)
[19:54:22] <Colourless> you just need to do (x+c_num_chunks)%c_num_chunks
[19:54:51] <Colourless> or similar
[19:55:32] <wjp> as long as you always keep the viewport position somewhere in the [0...c_num_chunks] interval
[19:56:22] <wjp> hmm... that didn't sound right
[19:57:04] <wjp> I meant to say we shouldn't let the position get too negative, or too far out of range
[19:57:52] <Colourless> agreed. If possible the view port should be kept within normal ranges.
[20:02:09] <Fingolfin> brb
[20:02:13] <Fingolfin> .
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[20:05:50] <Colourless> hmm, just thought of this. Many of the problem realated to moving the screen around are possibly realated to "Chunk_object_list *Game_window::get_objects(int cx, int cy)"
[20:06:23] <Colourless> and other functions that get things based on chunk coords
[20:06:58] <Colourless> if these are changed to accept out of range coords, there may not be so many problems.
[20:07:11] <Colourless> of course finding them all :(
[20:07:14] <wjp> :-)
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[20:17:55] <Fingolfin> b
[20:18:04] <Colourless> that is something for another day though. with cvs not working, I don't want to break my copy of exult
[20:18:06] <Colourless> wb
[20:18:30] <wjp> ah, cvs is now producing a different error msg.
[20:19:37] <Fingolfin> I think about rebooting to OS X now, I just installed a fresh "classic" system which I can feed to OS X so it can run "classic" apps, and at the same time leave my normal system untouched...
[20:20:00] <Fingolfin> so I will reboot now, and download an IRC client, and then I'll be back ;)
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[20:20:05] <wjp> k :-)
[20:22:16] <wjp> cvs is back
[20:22:26] <Colourless> cool :)
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[20:37:08] <wjp> hmm.. what palette do I need for that hoe_of_destruction.shp?
[20:37:34] <Cless> the normal ingame one.
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[20:37:54] <wjp> which one's that?
[20:38:49] * wjp experiments
[20:39:12] <Cless> i think it's 0
[20:39:50] <wjp> hmm, what an interesting shape format
[20:40:14] <wjp> oh, or is it two layers?
[20:40:41] <Cless> it's 2 layers
[20:40:54] * wjp needs more experience with the Gimp :-)
[20:41:24] <wjp> ah, got it
[20:45:24] <Cless> to think the solution to the chdir problem on Win32 was just a line below the call to chdir
[20:45:30] <Cless> add_system_path("<STATIC>", "static");
[20:45:49] <Cless> can so easily be changed to include the path of the game being run :)
[20:46:05] <Cless> allowing use to remobe the call to chdir
[20:46:12] <wjp> :-)
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[21:05:42] <Cless> my changes don't seem to have caused any problems :)
[21:06:02] <wjp> good :-)
[21:06:30] <Cless> however if the path in entered with a trail slashes all hell will break loose
[21:07:40] <Cless> Me think I can't right proper
[21:07:44] <Cless> :)
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[21:36:30] <wjp> wb
[21:36:43] <Cless> yeah, wb.
[21:36:48] <Fingolfin> lo
[21:36:54] <Fingolfin> grmbl
[21:36:56] <Fingolfin> nope
[21:36:58] <Fingolfin> no OS X
[21:36:58] <Cless> that seemed to take abit of time
[21:37:08] <Cless> why not
[21:37:08] <Fingolfin> lo cless
[21:37:18] <Fingolfin> you see, I was trying to connect to the internet... didn't work
[21:37:20] <Fingolfin> don't ask me why
[21:37:27] <Fingolfin> the PPPoE drivers seem to be messy still :/
[21:37:35] <Fingolfin> also, the parition I installed onto is too small
[21:37:59] <Fingolfin> I only gave it 1.2 GB - this is too few if I also want to install the dev tools
[21:38:13] <Fingolfin> so I think I will do some repartitioning to get it to 3 gigs or so
[21:44:59] <Cless> I just committed my path changes, can everyone make sure that I haven't killed Exult
[21:45:10] <wjp> sure :-)
[21:46:05] <wjp> we should change the name of the gamedat directory
[21:46:47] <Cless> yeah, we should also change the savegame names to .ex instead of .u7
[21:46:51] <Cless> or somthing
[21:46:56] <wjp> good idea
[21:47:41] <wjp> and, but this will probably break backward compatibility, the BG savegames shouldn't be loadable in SI and vice versa
[21:48:27] <wjp> hmm.. I get a warning in the set_new_schedules intrinsic... control reaches end of non-void function
[21:48:37] <wjp> return no_ret; ?
[21:49:26] <Cless> yes, that is missing
[21:50:06] <wjp> ok, I'll commit
[21:50:27] <Cless> ok
[21:51:16] <wjp> hmm... it looks in a different location for keybinding files now :-)
[21:51:44] <Fingolfin> I am against .ex, people will confuse it with .exe ;)
[21:52:01] * wjp sighs... that may actually be true :-(
[21:52:03] <Cless> good point
[21:52:09] <Fingolfin> "ChangeLog: unresolved conflicts". As usual ;)
[21:52:15] <wjp> :-)
[21:52:28] <Cless> where is it looking for keybindings?
[21:52:48] <wjp> game.cc
[21:53:55] <Cless> i see it.
[21:54:56] <Cless> not exactly sure how to fix it though
[21:55:14] <wjp> we can just keep it this way
[21:55:48] <Cless> ok
[21:56:31] <Cless> how about .esv for save games?
[21:56:55] <wjp> or something like 'exult??.sav' ?
[21:57:31] <Cless> that might be a better option. it's quite obvious what it is then
[21:58:09] <Fingolfin> yeah
[21:58:11] <Fingolfin> sounds good
[21:58:28] * wjp recompiles with -Wall
[21:58:41] <wjp> ouch
[21:59:40] <Cless> there is a few warning i take it
[22:00:00] <wjp> quite a lot, yes :-)
[22:00:36] <Cless> well, from what I can tell, it's just the same 3 warnings over and over again
[22:01:05] <Cless> i could be wrong though :)
[22:01:26] <wjp> tons of this one: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to `char *'
[22:01:55] <wjp> lots of: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned
[22:02:29] <Cless> i'm not getting any "warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to `char *'"
[22:02:52] <wjp> the usecode intrinsics tables are generating them
[22:03:05] <Cless> ah, i'm not there yet
[22:04:28] <-- Fingolfin has left IRC (Ping timeout for Fingolfin[pD9504D21.dip.t-dialin.net])
[22:04:59] <wjp> changing these char* to const char* fixes them. (in keys.cc, anyway)
[22:05:55] <wjp> ack, my entire 5000 lines terminal buffer is filled up
[22:06:20] <Cless> mines only 300, it's filled up a looong time ago
[22:08:40] <wjp> I'm reordering some initializers and adding some consts atm
[22:09:27] <wjp> soundtest.cc:40: warning: `void handle_key(int, int &, int, int = 1)' defined but not used
[22:09:45] <Cless> remove it :)
[22:10:46] <Cless> it's some code from the shapebroswer which i copied and gutted
[22:11:07] <wjp> Paperdoll_gump.cc:777: warning: suggest parentheses around assignment used as truth value
[22:11:14] <wjp> about 50 of those :-(
[22:11:33] <wjp> the if (obj = check_object(....)) lines
[22:12:01] * wjp adds a lot of parentheses :-)
[22:12:19] <Cless> bad me
[22:12:25] <Cless> that's my code
[22:12:32] <wjp> it's a silly warning anyway
[22:12:42] <wjp> although it does have a point sometimes
[22:12:50] <Cless> not in that case though
[22:16:41] <wjp> wuc.c:35: warning: no previous prototype for `emit_byte'
[22:16:45] <wjp> now what is that supposed to mean?
[22:17:14] <Cless> don't ask me
[22:17:19] <wjp> does it expect a prototype for non-static functions or something?
[22:17:55] <Cless> i wouldn't think so
[22:18:51] <Cless> i got no warning in the file
[22:21:13] <wjp> hmm... ah well
[22:21:17] * wjp ignores
[22:24:42] <wjp> ok, time to recompile
[22:24:59] <Cless> i await the results
[22:49:39] <wjp> ok, fixed all reordering warnings, most const-related warnings
[22:49:49] <Cless> :)
[22:50:12] <wjp> hmm... judging by the walking speed I forgot to enable debugging
[22:52:59] <Cless> :)
[22:53:06] <Cless> anyway, i'm off.
[22:53:12] <wjp> k, g'night
[22:53:32] <-- Cless has left IRC (I've very much daytime by now :))
[22:56:57] <-- wjp has left IRC ([x]chat)
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