#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 13 Sep 2002 (GMT)

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[08:00:23] <Slave> hello there... anybody home?
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[12:27:30] <Colourless> hi
[12:36:36] <Colourless> little rabbit, i said hello
[12:43:39] * Darke bows. Greetings, oh great denier of being coloured.
[12:44:15] <Colourless> Greetings all mighty bunny
[12:44:54] * Colourless seriously thinks he, like the bunny, is quite insane
[12:45:31] * Darke agrees with Colourless' thoughts as he waits for the dragon to say 'job'.
[12:45:41] <Colourless> job
[12:45:44] <Colourless> :-)
[12:45:46] <Colourless> you asked for it :-)
[12:46:02] <Darke> "Annoying dragons, of course." *grin*
[12:46:16] <Colourless> Dragons?
[12:47:11] <Darke> "You know, those big, scaly things with wings. One dragon I tend to annoy in particular."
[12:48:16] <Colourless> Big?
[12:49:23] <Darke> "Large? Huge? Think that size. Although a number are quite a bit smaller for some reason. *shrug* Maybe a genetic defect."
[12:50:10] <Colourless> Annoy?
[12:50:36] <Colourless> (you should really be 'pushing' answers onto the stack :-) )
[12:51:29] <Darke> "Annoy? Well I generally harass with buckets of paint more then annoy, per se. The silly thing thinks it's 'Colourless', but everyone knows it's just transparent. *nod*"
[12:51:49] <Darke> (Nah. It's more fun this way, that way I have to make up something on the spot, rather then pre-plan. *grin*)
[12:52:14] <Colourless> Colourless?
[12:54:20] <Darke> "One of those dragon things. Rather puny in size in comparison to his racial cousins, but generally non-threatening, although he does tend to threaten and bluster a lot. Especially when I paint him in fluro colours."
[12:54:47] <Darke> (Dominus: Just for reference, _NO_ this is not going into sourceforge island as a conversation. *grin*)
[12:55:20] <Colourless> Threaten?
[12:59:43] <Darke> "More of a bluster and intimidation really. Just general gripes like, `don't do that` and _continual_ complaints about my colour pallete choices when I'm decorating him. *noddle* He's such an incredibly picky dragon."
[13:01:12] <Colourless> Decorating?
[13:05:00] <Darke> "Nothing fancy, just adding a few dashes of colour to an otherwise drab and dreary 'transparent' coloured dragon."
[13:05:37] <Colourless> Drab
[13:08:25] <Darke> "Well he's just a little dull and monotonous, no real differences in his colour over his entire body. I think giving him say, yellow wings, green paws, and a red muzzle would look rather cute. *noddlenod*"
[13:09:26] <Colourless> Cute?
[13:20:54] <Darke> "Well... really it's more close to 'handsome' then 'cute'. But since he lacks a nice coat of fur, he can't really be handsome, so cute in a pet-iguana-that's-rather-larger-then-an-iguana-and-doesn't-eat-insects kind of way, he's rather stuck at."
[13:21:18] <Colourless> Fur?
[13:37:04] * Darke unfortunately must heed the call of sleep now. *grin* Goodnight. *bow*
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[13:40:17] <Colourless> cya
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[14:08:34] <Dark-Star> hi
[14:09:47] <Colourless> hi
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[14:11:07] <Dominus> hi
[14:12:16] <Colourless> hi
[14:14:11] * Dominus thinks that yesterdays logs are just a waste of space :-)
[14:14:41] <Dominus> I just wrote that to see if my client reacts to Dominus written in here
[14:14:51] <Dominus> and yes it does :-)
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[14:37:15] <Colourless> hey Dominus, want to try something out for me?
[14:37:22] <Dominus> always :-)
[14:38:21] <matto|wookin> good evening
[14:38:22] <Colourless> i'll send it by email
[14:38:26] <Dominus> ok
[14:38:29] <matto|wookin> or afternoon
[14:38:32] <Dominus> matto|wookin!!!!
[14:38:38] <matto|wookin> Dominus!!!! :)
[14:38:59] <Dominus> I think it is afternoon for me and close to morning for Colourless :-)
[14:39:10] <Colourless> morning here, just
[14:39:26] <matto|wookin> evening for my Korean friends
[14:39:29] <Colourless> hi btw :-)
[14:39:38] <matto|wookin> Colourless: hi, how have things been?
[14:39:45] * Darke|zzZ cleans up the mess of exclamation marks and peoperly disappears off to bed. Hi! Bye!
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[14:39:52] <Colourless> 'normal' :-)
[14:40:31] <matto|wookin> hehe
[14:40:49] <Dominus> exult development is slow atm
[14:41:01] <Colourless> Dominus: sent. should be lots faster than pervious versions
[14:41:01] <Dominus> pentagram development is even slower
[14:41:11] <matto|wookin> doh :(
[14:41:23] <matto|wookin> daphne development is slow too
[14:41:33] <Colourless> pentagram development 'appears' to be even slower, but that doesn't mean that Darke and I haven't been working on our own pentagram related things
[14:42:03] <Dominus> Colourless: I'll try in a moment. When I have finished buring on a cd
[14:42:13] <Colourless> no problems
[15:00:04] <Dominus> Colourless: tested with Project64 (N64 emulator that has a glide3 graphics plugin) and it works but I don't see much (if any) speed improvement in the fps
[15:00:31] <Colourless> :-)
[15:00:46] <Colourless> you might want to try something that pushes polygon counts just a tad more :-)
[15:01:57] <Dominus> ok
[15:02:36] <Colourless> also, any emulator is going to be CPU limited by the the actual emulation rather than by triangle drawing speed
[15:05:18] <Dominus> yeah
[15:05:34] <Dominus> still works with Neverwinter nights :-)
[15:05:41] <Dominus> can't tell if it is faster
[15:06:16] <Colourless> how fast is your cpu?
[15:06:45] <Dominus> 1 Ghz
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[15:07:07] <wjp> hi
[15:07:12] <Dominus> Uwadv has a fps counter and it really shows some difference
[15:07:20] <Dominus> hi wjp
[15:07:43] <Colourless> ok. i was thinking that if you had a fast cpu nwn might be getting fill limited, but i don't think it would be
[15:07:46] <Colourless> hi wjp
[15:08:21] <wjp> Dominus: did you add the conversation between Darke and Colourless to the ES demo yet? :-)
[15:08:35] <Dominus> he he
[15:08:36] <Dominus> no
[15:08:42] <Dominus> didn't think of it
[15:08:56] <Dominus> good idea
[15:08:59] <wjp> Darke explicitly says not to add it ;-)
[15:09:06] <wjp> [12:54:47] <Darke> (Dominus: Just for reference, _NO_ this is not going into sourceforge island as a conversation. *grin*)
[15:09:16] <Colourless> :-)
[15:09:24] <Dominus> oh, well thern I guess it has to go into it :-)
[15:15:02] <Dominus> Colourless: well so far it seems stable and with uwadv I get about 3 fps speed increase :-)
[15:15:39] <Dominus> but I don't have any other game installed atm
[15:16:52] <Dominus> damn, now I remember what I wanted to ask Kirben! How to enable opengl for exult...
[15:17:00] <Dominus> Colourless: can you help me out there?
[15:17:14] <Colourless> you really don't want to be doing that :-)
[15:17:24] <Dominus> I know :-)
[15:18:18] <Dominus> also, colourless, can you tell me a better wording for the tile_delta and the FmSynth?
[15:18:36] <Colourless> define HAVE_OPENGL
[15:18:52] <Colourless> and then link to opengl32
[15:19:51] <Colourless> i take if you got my email from yesterday that explains what tile_step_delta is
[15:20:18] <Colourless> what do you need to know about the FmSynth?
[15:21:28] <Dominus> I wondered if you want to add something to the "documentation" about it (I just wrote "emulates FM" or something like that)
[15:22:08] <Colourless> it's a Software FM Synthesizer (also known as a emulated Opl2/Adlib)
[15:24:02] <Dominus> and about step_tile_delta, I understood what you wrote, but I don't know how to formulate this in one or two short sentences :-)
[15:25:05] <Dominus> same as volume curve, I understand what it means but can't put it down so others understand it :-)
[15:25:25] <Colourless> well even i can't explain that one well :-)
[15:27:47] <Colourless> tile_step_delta could be something like Controls how far the Avatar will move before Exult recalculates the Avatar's and the party's movement
[15:28:26] <Dominus> ok
[15:28:47] <Dominus> thanks
[15:29:05] <Colourless> the problem is just that for someone who doesn't know what I mean, it might not be obvious what it actually does mean
[15:44:28] <Dominus> Seems Jeff wants to cut down bugs really serious now
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[15:44:58] <Dominus> so we can have a nice 1.0 release party :-)
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[16:20:32] <Suvroc> Hi
[16:20:57] <Colourless> hi
[16:21:05] <Dominus> hi
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[18:15:21] <Dominus> this computer is shitty : http://www.envador.com/Photos/ToiletPC/
[18:15:49] * Colourless runs away from the pun
[18:16:18] <Dominus> ok, that was not a good one :-)
[18:17:19] <Colourless> yes, it was terrible
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[18:18:21] <Suvroc> hi again
[18:19:46] <Dominus> hi
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[19:14:51] <Dominus> jeff?
[19:14:52] <Dominus> Hi
[19:14:58] <DrCode> Hi!
[19:15:37] <Dominus> how is it going?
[19:15:50] <Dominus> I mean how is your job situation?
[19:15:58] <DrCode> Finally got one job interview:-)
[19:16:15] <DrCode> Overall, the job situation kind of sucks. How are things in Europe?
[19:16:54] <Dominus> taking the bad heat from the US (slowly going downhill as well)
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[19:17:18] <DrCode> Every time Bush opens his mouth, the economy gets worse:-(
[19:17:31] <Dominus> yes
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[19:17:43] <Suvroc> hi again
[19:17:44] <Dominus> talk of war is not good for the economy
[19:18:02] <Dominus> and it's hitting the oil price and this hits the economy again
[19:18:26] <DrCode> I know, especially when most of us don't even know why there's war talk.
[19:18:50] <Dominus> I have a wild theory about that but no one wants to believe it
[19:19:13] <DrCode> Go ahead! There's not much about Exult to talk about:-)
[19:19:23] <Dominus> Way back when Bush sr was still governor of texas or so he meat Saddam in Las Vegas
[19:19:49] <Dominus> Saddam borrowed a dollar from bush and won the big jackpot on a slot machine
[19:19:56] <DrCode> :-)
[19:20:20] <Dominus> but then he didn't even give that dollar back not to mention a part of the win
[19:20:30] <Dominus> that's why we had the first gulf war
[19:20:59] <Dominus> and the bush family is not forgiving and won'T stop unless they get their dollar back
[19:21:10] <DrCode> Heh
[19:21:11] <DrCode> Is there more for Bush,Jr?
[19:21:32] <Dominus> that'S it
[19:21:34] <DrCode> :-) Makes about as much sense as anything else we've heard.
[19:22:55] <Dominus> I kind of like it. Everyone thinks that could have really happened, judging by how the bush's behave
[19:22:56] <DrCode> ... though I think Bush just wants their oil.
[19:23:16] <Dominus> Yeah, oil is a big issue
[19:23:41] <Dominus> I could tangle oil into that theory somehow :-)
[19:24:22] <Dominus> well, anyway, about exult, I noticed you hunting down bugs again
[19:24:27] <DrCode> Yes, I think some of Bush's buddies are going to make a lot of money off this somehow.
[19:24:42] <DrCode> I'd like to get another release out soon.
[19:24:51] <Dominus> I thought so
[19:25:41] <DrCode> We really ought to get 1.00 done. I've only actually fixed 2-3 of them. And it seems like we're not getting a lot of new ones.
[19:26:01] <Dominus> I have a feeling that after the 1.0 release we should slowly convert everyone over to the 1.1.x
[19:26:28] <DrCode> I agree. It's probably at least as stable as 1.00.
[19:26:44] <DrCode> Do you think we need another Release Candidate before 1.00?
[19:26:46] <Dominus> and lots more cool features
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[19:26:58] <Dominus> I don't think it is needed
[19:27:00] <Suvroc> re
[19:27:26] * Dominus attaches Suvroc to the channel
[19:28:21] <Suvroc> i was disconnected by a phone call
[19:28:22] <Suvroc> :/
[19:28:27] <DrCode> WB
[19:28:32] <Dominus> DrCode: but I think the bugs that can be fixed (in 1.0.x) from the bug list should get fixed before 1.0
[19:28:45] <DrCode> Let's see what's left...
[19:29:04] <Suvroc> thx :)
[19:29:16] <Dominus> Belt of Strength
[19:29:16] <matto|wookin> Doctar Coed!
[19:29:34] * Dominus silences matto|wookin
[19:30:01] <DrCode> I know the problem. But the solution is risky, so I'd prefer to leave it for 1.1x.
[19:30:06] <Dominus> ok
[19:30:23] <Dominus> probably effects the other "update" items from SS as well
[19:30:59] <DrCode> Yes, same thing. It's a matter of calling the 'unequip' usecode function when an item is removed by another usecode function (instead of by the player himself).
[19:31:28] <Dominus> the "serpent bond" thing (colourless needs to look at that sometime)
[19:31:40] <DrCode> I also don't think I'll fix the 'walk through walls' bug, since it's going to take a fair amount of recoding.
[19:32:00] <Dominus> move it to feature requests
[19:32:02] <Dominus> :-)
[19:32:04] <DrCode> Yep. Or maybe I'll look at it if it seems easy.
[19:32:37] <Dominus> how about that orrery viewer?
[19:33:15] <DrCode> Well.... one would pretty much have to have the source code to do that right... I don't think it will happen for 1.00.
[19:33:43] <DrCode> The 'cart without an Avatar' I might look at this week.
[19:34:43] <Dominus> I think I need to do a list of "known issues with 1.0.x that is/will be fixed with the 1.1.x"
[19:34:53] <Dominus> before a 1.0 release
[19:35:01] <DrCode> Good idea.
[19:35:49] <Dominus> because it might look bad if we release a bug free 1.0 and people come asking why this or that won'T work
[19:36:34] <DrCode> True. And some of these users are really knowledgeable about U7, and seem to find even tiny differences when they play Exult.
[19:36:51] <wjp> hi Jeff
[19:37:05] <DrCode> Hi
[19:37:31] <DrCode> Maybe there's a money-making opportunity: Give the game away for free, then charge to fix their bugs:-)
[19:37:39] <wjp> lol
[19:37:52] <matto|wookin> good idea
[19:38:11] <DrCode> Willem: Do you think we should just release 1.00 soon?
[19:38:25] <Dominus> hope no one from the original team picks that up (as I believe they must have the code somewhere)
[19:39:32] <DrCode> Did anyone hear back from K. Demarest? I tried emailing him, but got no response.
[19:40:12] <Dominus> I didn't write him...
[19:40:24] <DrCode> Maybe he's in New Zealand:-)
[19:40:50] <wjp> hmm... 1.0... good question
[19:41:31] <DrCode> It seems like the bugs are getting pickier and less urgent. Plus, I'm tired of maintaining two source trees.
[19:42:37] * wjp nods
[19:43:09] * wjp takes a look at the bug tracker
[19:43:18] <Dominus> I wonder, at 06-09-02 (ages ago) Dancer wrote about his big mf-patch he had for 1.1.x but since then didn't commit it (or did I miss something)
[19:45:12] <wjp> the "can't move anymore after screen switch" bug is quite easy to fix/workaround
[19:45:13] <DrCode> Don't think he did. He's still around, though; I got email from him a couple weeks ago.
[19:45:25] <wjp> problem is that there's two focus-out events, but only one focus-in event
[19:45:37] <wjp> I'm sure you can imagine what that does to our current pausing system :-)
[19:45:58] <DrCode> wjp: But why? Shouldn't they always come in pairs?
[19:46:07] <wjp> SDL glitch, I guess
[19:47:15] <Dominus> DrCode: concerning the 1.1.x, there really seems to be something odd with the rendering since your last opengl coding
[19:47:25] <DrCode> Trouble is: If we clear the count on focus-in, what if he was in gump mode. I guess we have to remember the count on the first focus-out.
[19:47:46] <wjp> or just keep an extra bool for the focus
[19:47:54] <wjp> and don't pause when it's true
[19:49:00] <wjp> (or false, depending on if it's bool hasFocus or bool noFocus :-) )
[19:49:38] <DrCode> Makes sense. Maybe I'll work on it today.
[19:49:48] <DrCode> I still have a lot of free time:-)
[19:50:49] <DrCode> I wonder: Is the second focus-out coming from when one switches to the other desktop?
[19:51:39] <wjp> I'm not sure what causes it
[19:51:54] <wjp> xev doesn't report two focus events when switching workspace
[19:52:51] <DrCode> Yes. Just saw a 2nd 'game paused' when I switched desktops.
[19:53:29] <DrCode> Anyway, your solution should work. If you're busy, I'll give it a try this afternoon.
[19:54:21] <wjp> I wonder what causes SDL to produce two focus-out events
[19:54:58] <DrCode> Maybe there's a different Xevent when you switch desktops, and SDL is interpreting it wrong.
[19:56:37] <DrCode> Okay... there's an SDL_GetAppState() call; that should tell us whether we have focus.
[19:56:52] <DrCode> Let me try this...
[19:59:02] <wjp> event.active.state & SDL_APPINPUTFOCUS <-- is that right?
[19:59:25] <wjp> the manpage for SDL_ActiveEvent doesn't say anything about .state being a bitfield
[19:59:26] <DrCode> I think so. But first I'm trying your suggestion, since we already have a 'focus' flag in gwin.
[19:59:47] <wjp> is says state is either SDL_APPMOUSEFOCUS or SDL_APPINPUTFOCUS or SDL_APPACTIVE
[20:01:17] <wjp> hm, doesn't look like it matters, anyway
[20:01:29] <wjp> they are used as bit flags in other functions, so they don't overlap
[20:01:37] <DrCode> The SDL_events.h file says it's a mask.
[20:02:12] <wjp> true
[20:02:35] <wjp> but then it wouldn't be the current state, but the changed state?!
[20:02:38] <wjp> ah well
[20:02:58] <DrCode> Your idea seems to work. I'll commit it in both branches.
[20:03:11] <wjp> k :-)
[20:04:14] <DrCode> Hmm... looks like it's not needed in 1.00.
[20:04:30] <wjp> oh, right :-)
[20:04:35] <wjp> no 'stacked' pausing there
[20:05:35] <DrCode> Any ideas about the 'savegump not disappearing' bug? I'm not seeing it here.
[20:06:15] <Dominus> the screen doesn't seem to get repainted after the reload
[20:06:45] <Dominus> unless somthing/someone moves the savegame gump gets shown
[20:07:25] <DrCode> It isn't happening for me (on Linux):-(
[20:07:42] <Dominus> and I don't know if you noticed it, when you click on some items they get drawn over the object that is on top
[20:08:44] <DrCode> Even before you move them?
[20:08:51] <Dominus> especiall if you try to drag them (and they are undraggable)
[20:09:19] <Dominus> it's when you try to move them only, I think
[20:09:45] <wjp> it happens for me
[20:09:52] <wjp> (savegame gump)
[20:09:52] <DrCode> Yes! That one's obvious.
[20:10:05] <Dominus> and the savegame gump problem occured around the time you changed some stuff for the opengl
[20:10:31] <DrCode> I know:-( I'll have to guess at a solution, since I can't duplicate the problem.
[20:11:08] <wjp> also, when you use the King's Foil on an arrow, the king's foil doesn't disappear from the gump until something else triggers a repaint
[20:11:40] <Dominus> If some NPC moves "beneath" the savegame gump only the tile that npc is on gets redrawn
[20:11:48] <Dominus> I try to get a screenshot
[20:12:26] <DrCode> Sounds like a full repaint isn't being done after the restore, even though it should.
[20:12:57] <Dominus> do you need a screenshot of that (NPC redrawing parts of the screen)? I have on eready
[20:13:11] <Dominus> I have one ready :-)
[20:13:21] <DrCode> No, that's okay. It's a symptom of the problem (which I'll have to guess at)
[20:16:31] <wjp> oh, it only happens in 8 bit mode, btw
[20:16:44] <wjp> otherwise a palette cycle will repaint everything
[20:17:08] <DrCode> Thanks. That's a good clue.
[20:18:38] <wjp> also, it doesn't happen when you cancel the gump; only when you actually load a game
[20:18:44] <Dominus> DrCode: also there seems to be something wrong with the initial scene with the automaton in the mountains of freedom
[20:19:17] <Dominus> the automaton doesn't seem to initialise the talk anymore
[20:19:22] <DrCode> That's been a recurring problem.
[20:19:56] <Dominus> and he gets stuck outside of his office (which makes him too easy to fight)
[20:20:51] <DrCode> Erghh. I don't know if I can fix it. There's tons of usecode being executed, and it takes a looong time to get there:-(
[20:20:52] * wjp replays Frigidazzi-scene
[20:21:19] <wjp> always nice how your party members seem to stick around just a bit longer than necessary :-)
[20:21:27] <Dominus> yep that whole trial thing in SI is annoying to play again and again
[20:21:33] <Dominus> he
[20:22:12] <DrCode> We >should< have just supported BlackGate:-)
[20:22:22] <DrCode> (Good thing Colourless isn't around...)
[20:22:35] <Dominus> yes, so true
[20:22:47] <Dominus> all those bugs we have in BG because of SI :-)
[20:23:01] <Dominus> paperdolls, si faces...
[20:23:07] <Dominus> :-)
[20:23:53] <wjp> hm, indeed; MoF automaton is broken for me in 1.1.x
[20:24:13] <wjp> (talking to him manually does work, though)
[20:24:34] <Dominus> yeah, and at least you are not stuck anymore like you were ages ago at this point :-)
[20:24:37] <wjp> and he does indeed lock the door before himself, instead of after himself :-)
[20:24:53] <Dominus> stupid little automaton :-)
[20:25:53] * Dominus thinks that wjp should still put his savegames archive online sometime
[20:26:05] <Dominus> :-)
[20:26:07] <wjp> I'll be uploading for ages :-)
[20:26:22] <Dominus> take a CD with you to the uni?
[20:27:10] <DrCode> I think I'll work on the 'savegump' bug. It's easier.
[20:27:46] <Dominus> he. and more "apparent" for Windows users :-)
[20:27:51] <wjp> hm, it's only ~60Mb
[20:28:47] <wjp> music is skipping somehow
[20:29:27] <DrCode> I should probably get off the phone (modem service, still:-()
[20:29:33] <DrCode> See ya!
[20:29:36] <-- DrCode has left IRC ("Leaving")
[20:29:46] <Dominus> he he
[20:30:02] <Dominus> still maintains his style of logging off here :-)
[20:30:08] <wjp> yes :-)
[20:31:35] <wjp> hehe, in devel-1-00, the automaton walked up to me, said "No new arrivals", and moved on :-)
[20:33:25] <Dominus> kind of strange being ignored in such a fashion :-)
[20:50:45] <Dominus> got to go
[20:50:50] <Dominus> bye
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[22:45:36] <Fingolfin> yp
[22:47:34] <wjp> yp :-)
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