#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 15 Feb 2002 (GMT)

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[00:54:19] <sb-x> This is the first message logged by exultbot today!
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[02:50:24] <_Kreed_> this is the second message !!!
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[04:06:57] <fester> !topic When geeks propose: http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/02/14/143254&mode=thread&tid=166
[04:20:17] <fester> oops wrong chan
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[09:32:06] * MichaelZ bounces in
[09:32:28] * MichaelZ observes that gtk is quite nice, once one gets the hang of it... still got a long way to go though :)
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[09:46:43] * Darke bows, "Hello."
[09:48:00] <MichaelZ> `lo darke *bow*
[09:48:03] <_Kreed_> lo
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[11:49:40] <Darkatom> hi
[11:54:16] <Darke> Hello.
[11:54:58] <Darkatom> darke
[11:55:04] <Darkatom> can you tell me how can I make new spells in U7?
[11:55:50] <Darke> You can't make new spells, you can purchase spells from the mages, or you can get them on scrolls in SI, IIRC too.
[11:56:30] <_Kreed_> and have reagents?
[11:56:33] <Darkatom> some
[11:57:29] <Kirben> if you want all spells quickly, use cheat key or cheat room via trinsic.
[11:58:26] <Darkatom> I don't wanna use the cheats :)
[11:58:32] <Darkatom> Darke
[11:58:52] <Darkatom> I don't understand what you're telling
[11:59:12] <Darkatom> if I click on the spell book
[11:59:28] <Darkatom> on the speel I want to use
[11:59:42] <Darkatom> It doesn't make anything
[12:00:37] <Darke> You need to double click on the spell in the spell book that you want to cast. If you have enough of the appropriate reagents, then the spell will be cast.
[12:01:37] <Kirben> yes, as darke said.
[12:02:13] <Darkatom> ok, but
[12:02:39] <Darkatom> how can I know the exactly number of reagents I need?
[12:02:53] <Darkatom> (in order to cast a speel)
[12:03:17] <Darke> The manual/spellbook tells you. It'll be either in pdf format on your cd, or you'll have a physical one you can reference.
[12:04:01] <Darkatom> oops
[12:04:20] <Darkatom> I haven't anyone
[12:04:32] * Darke considers the other possibility is to reference the code in exult, that will probably also have the values. <grin>
[12:08:22] <Darkatom> if I have the correct number of reagents, the spell will be casted automaticaly?
[12:11:33] <Darke> If you have at least the minimum required number of reagents to cast the spell, the spell will Just Work.
[12:12:13] <Darke> If you don't the spell will go *poof* and you'll see an animation of some sort as a visual cue, IIRC.
[12:13:08] <Darkatom> ok
[12:13:08] <Darkatom> thank you
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[12:19:06] <Kirben> hmm npcs still don't seem to use spells in combat.
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[12:44:53] <Colourless> hi
[12:47:41] <Darke> Hi.
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[13:02:08] <sb-x> hi
[13:02:12] <Colourless> hi
[13:02:40] * Darke slaps sb-x around with a trout. "First message indeed. <grin> Oh, yes Hi."
[13:07:18] * sb-x looks completely innocent.
[13:09:18] <Darke> Come now sb-x, that doesn't work for me, so it's certainly not going to work for you. <grin>
[13:10:37] <sb-x> It might work, as long as I can claim to have an evil twin... Now can I at least eat the trout?
[13:14:12] <-- Kirben has left IRC ("System Meltdown")
[13:14:27] * Darke happens to have a good twin... I suppose that's why looking innocent doesn't work for me. "Yes, you can eat the trout if you wish."
[13:15:03] * sb-x happily eats the trout. :)
[13:15:15] * sb-x starts choking on something and spits a key out at Darke.
[13:15:25] <sb-x> hmm sorry
[13:15:45] <Darke> Hey! You didn't ask to eat a body, you asked if you could eat the trout! <grin>
[13:15:49] <Colourless> eww you ate a body
[13:16:04] <sb-x> heh
[13:16:11] * sb-x is the victim of a Usecode error! Honest!
[13:16:15] <sb-x> :P
[13:16:29] <Darke> sb-x: Suuuurrre! Blame the usecode! Everyone else does.
[13:17:16] <sb-x> Failing that, I blame the Exult team.
[13:17:40] <Colourless> the exult team is perfect in every way
[13:17:55] <Colourless> you can therefore, not blame the exult team
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[13:18:31] <sb-x> :\
[13:18:47] <sb-x> hi
[13:19:02] * Darke bows, "Hello."
[13:19:06] <Colourless> uh, hi
[13:19:53] * royalsexy greets the friendly people
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[13:21:13] <Darke> Hmm... a fellow Brisbanite. <grin>
[13:22:07] <Colourless> too many autralians here. we are like taking over the place.... under much consideration, i have decided this isn't a bad thing after all
[13:22:40] * royalsexy waves
[13:23:08] <royalsexy> well i wasn't expecting this to be an aussie channel
[13:23:09] <Darke> Colourless: Agreed. Between the Australians and the Canadians, I'm sure we'll have an easy time to take over, and assimilate the rest of the world. <grin>
[13:23:20] <royalsexy> i've just been d/ling the source for exult
[13:23:26] <royalsexy> looks like a great idea
[13:24:32] <Darke> AFAIK, it's accidental that there is an abnormal number of .au programmers working on exult. We're not trying to take over the world using exult as part of out fiendish plot or anything.
[13:25:12] <Colourless> Jeff keeps mentioning that's his plan, and you know, the amount he says it, there might just be some truth too it :-)
[13:25:23] <royalsexy> heh
[13:26:49] * Darke wouldn't be surprised. He has a friend who's stated goal in life it to somehow acquire enough 'power' to take over a signifigant country or two, and preferably the world.
[13:28:32] <sb-x> I think I could take over Iceland if I tried hard enough.
[13:30:34] <sb-x> Or a Pacific island, at the very least.
[13:31:29] <royalsexy> its worth a shot at least
[13:32:03] <Colourless> so, if we all group together, i think we might be able to take over enough the entire world :-)
[13:36:06] <sb-x> I'd be afraid you Australians would make me put your flag on my new island. No deal. :P
[13:38:36] <Colourless> well, majority rules :-)
[13:56:42] <Darke> Everyone who approves of putting the .au flag on sb-x's new island say 'Aye'. <grin>
[13:58:31] <royalsexy> :)
[13:59:07] <Colourless> aye
[13:59:22] <Darke> By royal decree, I proclaim that a smilie is an acceptable substitute for an 'aye'.
[14:00:45] <royalsexy> heh
[14:00:54] <royalsexy> then you have my vote :P
[14:01:55] * royalsexy goes off to learn c++ so he can reverse engineer games - brb
[14:02:00] <Colourless> i somehow think the vote will be futile. i don't think enough of the people will vote for the proposition
[14:02:17] <Colourless> i think most are going to abstain
[14:06:01] <Darke> Looks like it.
[14:06:07] <royalsexy> can't we make it mandatory to vote?
[14:06:35] <Colourless> uh, no
[14:06:51] <Darke> Not that I know. It's a shame though. <grin>
[14:07:01] <sb-x> I am not going to take over an island anyway. I'm too lazy for anything of that magnitude.
[14:07:07] <Colourless> royalsexy: the path you travel will surely send you crazy... the phrases "why doesn't that work" and "that doesn't make sense" will dominate your life :-)
[14:07:32] <royalsexy> heheh
[14:07:37] <sb-x> Colourless: why? that doesn't make sense
[14:07:44] <royalsexy> it already does, mate
[14:08:22] * Darke is also questioning why he's learning C++ to do that. To reverse engineer games, all you need is a nice, solid wall to bang your head against. <grin>
[14:08:28] <Colourless> programming and reverse enginnering, are things that most wouldn't describe as fun, a worthwhile challenge perhaps :-)
[14:08:47] <royalsexy> ahh its ok
[14:08:59] <royalsexy> i'm learning some c++ in my course anyways
[14:09:06] * Darke , 'unfortunately', describes both of those activities as fun. Most people think he's insane though.
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[14:09:22] <royalsexy> which is good since i can't get the hang of it from "Learn C++ in 21 days!" book
[14:09:22] * sb-x gives Darke a carrot.
[14:09:32] <royalsexy> lol
[14:09:44] * Darke bows, "Thanks!", and nibbles on the carrot.
[14:09:58] <Colourless> darke: could be worse
[14:10:11] <Darke> Colourless: Worse?
[14:10:30] <Colourless> well, at least you use c++
[14:11:35] * Darke has a horrible mental image of himself writing RE tools in Cobol, Pascal and Lisp. <shudderfluff>
[14:11:55] <Colourless> :-)
[14:12:03] <Darke> And FORTRAN as well.
[14:12:05] * royalsexy writes a copy of visual fortran for Darke
[14:12:34] <Darke> royalsexy: Sorry, I've seen then hideous abomination already. And OO-COBOL.
[14:12:36] <royalsexy> :)
[14:12:57] <royalsexy> OMG did someone actually make one?!
[14:13:16] * royalsexy runs screaming
[14:13:44] <Colourless> fortran is still used quite a bit
[14:13:47] <Darke> OO-COBOL. Yes. Visual FORTRAN, I'll have to double check. I've heard it mentioned 'not as a joke' before.
[14:14:13] <Darke> There we go: http://www.compaq.com/fortran/
[14:15:15] <Darke> And here for the OO-COBOL: http://directory.google.com/Top/Computers/Programming/Languages/Cobol/OO_Cobol/
[14:16:02] <Colourless> one wonders why there are just so many programming languages
[14:16:37] * sb-x is glad he hasn't attempted to learn many of them.
[14:18:01] <royalsexy> i think i've halfheartedly attempted to learn too many of them
[14:18:03] <Darke> There's so many particular applications. The 'common knowledge' is that you're better off using a domain specific language to code your application in, then a general language, since most of the features you'll want, will already be included in it, rather then having you to code them for yourselves.
[14:18:09] <royalsexy> which is why i can't code shyte
[14:18:34] * royalsexy nods - makes sense
[14:19:20] <Colourless> ElastiC seems to be a really popular language.... only 1 page on the internet :-)
[14:19:33] * Darke doesn't like domain specific languages, because if you get good at one of them, you're likely going to be coding multiple variations of the same thing for the rest of your life.
[14:19:34] <royalsexy> jeezus visual fortran
[14:19:52] <royalsexy> my mum used to program in fortran - but then she used to punch her own cards too...
[14:21:12] <Colourless> ow, elastic looks kind of nasty
[14:21:34] * Darke points out that truth is _always_ stranger then fiction. No matter what insane story, or object you theorise the existance of someone, somewhere will have done that, or created it.
[14:21:37] <Darke> url?
[14:21:42] <Colourless> http://www.elasticworld.org/
[14:21:49] <Colourless> look in the code examples
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[14:22:59] <Fingolfin> g'day
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[14:23:01] <Darke> I'd run screaming from this bit of advertising: "Automatic real, very fast, Garbage Collection." It sounds like either a marketdroid wrote it, or it was written by someone very, very inexperienced. <grin>
[14:23:05] <Darke> Hi.
[14:23:05] <Colourless> hi
[14:23:19] <Fingolfin> lol
[14:23:36] <royalsexy> 'lo Fingolfin
[14:23:53] <sb-x> hi
[14:24:01] <Fingolfin> anybody else having problems connecting to SF ?
[14:24:34] <Darke> Colourless: It looks like someone's trying to take the 'best' bits of perl and the 'best' bits of java/c and create a useful language. It doesn't appear to be working.
[14:24:57] * Darke is having no problems with the exult forums at any rate.
[14:25:02] <Colourless> i wonder how the lanuage attempts to work with multiple files
[14:25:06] <Fingolfin> yeah, I mean the SF front page
[14:25:16] * Fingolfin tries another browser
[14:25:26] <Colourless> there is no actual entry point
[14:25:29] <Darke> www.sf.net isn't resolving.
[14:25:37] <Fingolfin> fine
[14:25:50] <Darke> Nor is www.sourceforge.net looks like a problem. <grin>
[14:25:57] <Fingolfin> sourceforge.net is resolving for me
[14:26:04] <sb-x> ww.sf.net. is an alias for usw-pr-web.sourceforge.net.
[14:26:04] <sb-x> [08:27:36] usw-pr-web.sourceforge.net. has address
[14:26:06] <Fingolfin> can you try to connect to
[14:26:26] <royalsexy> exult.sourceforge.net is working fine for me
[14:26:30] <Darke> Not working.
[14:26:34] <Colourless> yeah, exult.sf works for me
[14:26:36] <sb-x> s/ww/www/ :-)
[14:26:45] <sb-x> me too
[14:26:49] <Colourless> but sourceforge itself isn't working
[14:27:12] <Fingolfin> the project webservers are disjoint from the SF web server
[14:27:21] <Colourless> i remember the last time we released sf died
[14:27:24] <Darke> sb-x: That ip address points to a 404. It looks like something is a bit broken. <grin>
[14:28:10] <sb-x> What is the source of SF problems?
[14:28:15] <Fingolfin> ok, mccombs tells me they are working on it
[14:28:44] <royalsexy> hrm i was on the main sourceforge webpage just an hour or so ago and it was all good
[14:30:10] <Darke> Colourless: I guess multiple file support would work kind of the same way that Java supports it's main() function, with something that suspiciously looks like a hack. <grin>
[14:31:36] <Colourless> :-)
[14:32:00] <Darke> Or, I presume, using it's 'package' system. Although I don't know how that works.
[14:32:51] <Darke> It's documentation is only half complete too. I was just reading the quickref.
[14:33:49] <sb-x> You have no room to speak about someone elses documentation Darke. :-)
[14:33:55] <Colourless> hehe
[14:34:05] <Colourless> heh, it's half more complete than his :-)
[14:35:02] * sb-x goes to the url to check it out.
[14:35:17] <Darke> sb-x: Well, yes. But I'm not writing a programming language, and expecting others to learn it from it's _only_ source of documentation, the one they're producing, am I? <grin>
[14:35:57] <Fingolfin> what are you guys talking 'bout, anyway?
[14:36:01] <Colourless> http://www.elasticworld.org/
[14:37:05] <Colourless> a language so popular it only has one page/site on the internet
[14:37:25] <Colourless> at least according to google
[14:37:28] * Darke thinks that is url is scary though. Why 'elasticworld'?
[14:37:42] * Darke thinks it's probably the fault of the documentation. <grin>
[14:38:19] <Darke> It's got gotos? Isn't this supposed to be a 'VHLL'?
[14:38:33] <sb-x> VHLL?
[14:38:51] <Darke> Very High Level Language, according to them. Although I've never heard that term used before.
[14:38:56] <sb-x> Ooh
[14:39:17] <sb-x> I thought that was code that sounded like spoken language.
[14:39:43] <Darke> No, that's FORTRAN. <duck> You're thinking 4GL, IIRC.
[14:40:42] <Darke> Actually, I think it's s/FORTRAN/COBOL/ <grin> I haven't looked at either in a long time thankfully.
[14:41:22] <royalsexy> http://i-want-a-website.com/about-linux/articles/jan02/billglish.shtml
[14:41:26] <Fingolfin> VHLL is a common term, actually, at least in language research
[14:41:42] <Darke> Colourless: Actually, there's at least two sites devoted to it. It's got a mirror site. <grin>
[14:41:43] <Fingolfin> (computer language research that is :-)
[14:42:24] <Colourless> hmm, i don't think this language actually supports having more than one source file
[14:42:37] <Colourless> at least, there hasn't been a linker written yet as far as I can tell
[14:42:42] <Darke> Fingolfin: You mean they actually do research in it, rather then just cobbling something together?!? I'm shocked! <grin>
[14:43:11] <Fingolfin> you obviously never dealt with ML or Haskell, did you? :)
[14:43:17] <Fingolfin> or Mozart
[14:43:29] * sb-x stumbles... "Com-pu-ter lan-gu-age Reeeaassearrchh" ???
[14:43:43] * sb-x goes and stares at the wall.
[14:44:46] <Darke> Fingolfin: Yes, and unforturately for me, yes, I haven't seen Mozart though. I certainly don't consider Hascall to be anything approaching 'high level'. <grin>
[14:44:47] * royalsexy draws pretty pictures on the wall for sb-x to look at
[14:45:52] <Fingolfin> first off, I was refering to language research in general. and secondly, haskell is a lot more high level than Perl or Java I'd say :) but it's not a VHLL of course
[14:47:31] <Darke> Agreed. It's certainly more 'high level' then Perl or Java. However trying to code in it, always remided me of the month or so I spent teaching myself INTERCAL. <grin>
[14:48:23] <Darke> And INTERCAL also wins points for being far more polite too. <duck>
[14:50:04] <sb-x> INTERCAL?
[14:50:24] * sb-x collapses out of ignorance.
[14:50:36] <sb-x> that sounds like a dietary supplement
[14:50:43] <Colourless> hehe
[14:51:14] <Darke> The language with no pronouncable acronym, IIRC: http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/intercal/
[14:51:16] <Colourless> if so, i think it would have something to do with calcium
[14:51:51] <Darke> Actually: "Compiler Language With No Pronouncable Acronym"
[14:52:12] <sb-x> calcium indeed
[14:52:16] * sb-x shrugs.
[14:52:23] <sb-x> Oooh Intercal 0.20 - The Millennium Editon
[14:55:09] <sb-x> Darke: Did you manage to learn it?
[14:55:56] <Colourless> i seriously think not
[14:56:05] <Colourless> the easiest way to store the value of 65536 in a 32-bit INTERCAL variable is:
[14:56:05] <Colourless> DO:1<-#0$#256
[14:56:07] <Darke> Enough of the basics to write basic 'hello world' type code. <grin> But I got bored quickly.
[14:57:47] * Darke never could wrap his mind around the COME FROM statement though.
[14:58:47] <Colourless> makes sense to me, but I really couldn't find an actual use for it
[14:59:12] <Colourless> then again, i would say the same about the entire language :-)
[14:59:23] * Darke completely agrees. <grin>
[14:59:59] <Colourless> hmmm: In INTERCAL, AND, OR, and XOR are unary operators
[15:01:07] <sb-x> English: I repartitioned my hard drive and installed Linux
[15:01:07] <sb-x> with a dual-boot configuration but now Windows no longer works. Billglish: EVIL OS NO BOOT [The usual response is "GOTO HELL"]
[15:02:00] <royalsexy> :)
[15:05:32] <Colourless> i want to see some real INTERCAL code
[15:06:13] <Darke> There should be examples in here: <grin> http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/intercal/intercal-0.20.tar.gz
[15:06:35] <Colourless> grr, requires downloading something.... too hard
[15:06:50] <sb-x> Would a soldering gun be a Very Low Level Language?
[15:07:05] <Colourless> yes
[15:07:32] <Darke> Also writing in machine code is too, last I'd heard. <grin>
[15:07:42] <sb-x> Bleh
[15:07:46] <sb-x> too high level for me
[15:07:57] * sb-x goes to work on melting his motherboard.
[15:07:58] <Colourless> darke: that's only a low level langauage
[15:08:35] <Darke> Assembler is low level, I'm thinking toggling it in on the front panel. <grin>
[15:08:53] <Colourless> i believe that a lanague that purely uses logic gates, or even just transistors is what sb-x wants :-)
[15:09:17] <Colourless> s/lanague/language/
[15:09:26] * Darke wants an Altair. <grin>
[15:09:31] <sb-x> I just want to melt stuff
[15:09:59] <Colourless> well, any computer is good enough for that.
[15:10:17] <Colourless> athlons, older ones, are supposed to be really good, just remove the cpu fan :-)
[15:10:50] <royalsexy> heh
[15:11:12] <Darke> Bleh. Newer ones don't you mean? <grin> Any socket athlons over 1Ghz tend to fry in under a second. I've killed one that way.
[15:11:39] <Colourless> aren't the XP's are supposed to have some sort of protection?
[15:12:30] <Darke> Good question. I haven't heard anything about it, but I don't tend to dig too deep into that sort of stuff. <grin>
[15:14:57] <Darke> http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/threaded_intercal.html Ow. Ok, I now understand how COME FROMs work. This language is really evil. <grin>
[15:15:32] <Colourless> hehe
[15:15:37] <Darke> There's also a small segment of code in that one. <grin>
[15:15:54] <Colourless> that is absolutly nastly
[15:16:02] <Colourless> s/nastly/nasty/
[15:16:15] <Colourless> using come froms to create extra threads
[15:16:31] <Darke> It makes perfect sense, but...
[15:16:35] <Colourless> yeah it does
[15:18:15] <Colourless> but what?
[15:18:51] <Darke> It's so incredibly horrible?
[15:19:16] <Darke> It's now almost completely impossible to trace through a program's execution?
[15:19:58] <Colourless> :-)
[15:20:35] * Darke is thinking of three threads, two of them with overlapping code sequences, running in lock step, randomly flipping abstains on and off.
[15:21:38] <Colourless> well, no one ever said INTERCAL was a good language :-)
[15:21:51] <Colourless> much less threaded intercal :-)
[15:21:52] * laxdragon is back (gone 16:15:55)
[15:24:32] <sb-x> wb
[15:24:44] * Darke happens to like Befunge too, but he's never done more then read the specs of it. <grin>
[15:25:10] <Colourless> i just love this quote from the threaded intercal page: "... and none had that special uniqueness that was peculiar to INTERCAL."
[15:26:09] <Darke> Agreed. INTERCAL certainly has a 'special uniqueness'. It tends to warp people's minds AFAICT. <grin>
[15:26:29] <Colourless> abstain and reinstate are just strange at best
[15:27:14] <Darke> And not that useful at worst. But with threading in that manner it's... umm... 'a headache' would be the best description. <grin>
[15:28:15] <Colourless> using those for syncronization between threads would be an absolute nightmare
[15:30:24] <Colourless> though the concept of using abstain and reinstate is somewhat interesting. I could almost see other langauges having statement like them
[15:30:31] <sb-x> Who wants ice cream?!
[15:31:46] <Darke> Colourless: Agreed. <grin> I have a faint memory reinstate only has a 50% chance of 'working' too, but I think I may be confusing it with APOLOGIZE.
[15:32:10] <Colourless> apologize only works 50% of the time
[15:32:17] <Colourless> i beleive reinstate always works
[15:33:24] <Colourless> so are you planning on porting ucxt to threaded intercal? :-)
[15:34:53] * Darke just checked the manual, and indeed it looks like abstain/reinstate work 100% of the time.
[15:35:10] <Darke> Do you _really_ need to ask that question Colourless? <grin>
[15:35:21] <Colourless> cool. you you are!
[15:35:44] <Darke> Attempting to write in a value greater than or equal to SIX
[15:35:44] <Darke> FIVE FIVE THREE SIX for a 16-bit variable will result in the
[15:35:44] <Darke> error message, "DON'T BYTE OFF MORE THAN YOU CAN CHEW."
[15:36:22] * Darke threatens Colourless with a dueling trout.
[15:36:41] <Colourless> generating a random number in intercal would be interesting. I would imagine it would involve using lots of apologize statments
[15:37:16] <Darke> Oh yes, all numeric output is in roman numerals, if you didn't know. <grin>
[15:37:26] <Colourless> yeah i noticed that
[15:37:44] <Darke> (random) No, there's a specific function that will generate a random number for you.
[15:38:03] <Colourless> what, why? that doesn't seem like a very intercal thing to do :-)
[15:39:39] <Darke> It's a library function. <grin>
[15:39:47] <Darke> (1900) .1 <- uniform random no. from #0 to #65535
[15:39:48] <Darke> (1910) .2 <- normal random no. from #0 to .1, with
[15:39:48] <Darke> standard deviation .1 divided by #12
[15:39:59] <Colourless> hmmm
[15:40:30] <Colourless> it would be 'so easy' to write code that uses 16 aplogize statements to flip the bits in a variable :-)
[15:41:34] <Darke> The library code is written in intercal, IIRC, so that's how it's probably written. <grin>
[15:42:30] <Colourless> nice :-)
[15:45:03] <Darke> Also the library wasn't part of the original INTERCAL-72 spec, it's part of one of the later versions. <grin> IIRC, part of the documentation suggests rewriting some of the library functions to get familiar with the language, although it's been a while, I could be hallucinating it.
[15:46:09] * Darke learnt intercal before the threaded intercal spec came out, so it would have had to had been 1997 to early 1998.
[15:46:10] <Colourless> i would believe that
[15:46:35] <Colourless> now, I have to ask why?
[15:46:45] <Colourless> was it so you 'could' write ucxt in intercal? ;-)
[15:47:44] <Colourless> of course you said that you didn't understand how come to's worked so I guess that prevented you from writing ucxt in it right? :-)
[15:48:03] <Colourless> of course now that you 'know'.... :-)
[15:48:35] <Darke> I started working on the 'basics' of ucxt in late 1999, IIRC, so I guess the answer is no. <grin> And 'no', I'm not going to write ucxt in intercal.
[15:49:20] <Colourless> I think we should write the pentagram interpreter in threaded intercal. writing it in a langauge with native thread could be useful because u8 usecode is multi threaded :-)
[15:49:26] <Darke> I'm tempted to get ucxt to output intercal, and then replace the usecode interpreter in exult with one that interprets a intercal script.
[15:49:38] * Darke rofls.
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[15:50:43] <Colourless> i'd like to see you get ucxt to output intercal :-)
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[15:51:28] <Darke> Colourless: Download this: http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/intercal/intercal-0.20.tar.gz and read the doc/THEORY file. You _know_ you want to. <grin>
[15:52:48] <Colourless> hmm, download is pretty small
[15:52:54] <Darke> A quick bit of text from the file:
[15:52:55] <Darke> The generated C code is plugged into the template file ick-wrap.c
[15:52:55] <Darke> inside main(). It needs to be linked with cesspool.o, fiddle.o and
[15:52:55] <Darke> lose.o (these are in libick.a, with the support for runtime switches,
[15:52:55] <Darke> arrgghh.o). Cesspool.o is the code that implements the storage
[15:52:55] <Darke> manager; fiddle.o implements the INTERCAL operators; and lose.o is the
[15:52:57] <Darke> code that generates INTERCAL's error messages. The routine arrgghh.o
[15:52:59] <Darke> parses the runtime command line arguments.
[15:53:28] <Colourless> nice :-)
[15:58:19] * Darke nodnodnodnodnods.
[15:58:19] * sb-x decides to depart before any more of this "INTERCAL" discussion takes place.
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[15:58:19] <Darke> Ouch. And doc/chip.spec whilst you're at it. A physical INTERCAL-on-chip processor. <grin>
[15:58:19] <Colourless> i guess that would be useful for a compiled bytecode veresion of intercal
[15:58:51] <Darke> The library itself is written in intercal.
[15:59:18] * Darke nods. That's what it looks like it was designed for. Thankfully it doesn't look like anyone was insane enough to make one.
[16:00:43] <Colourless> i'm amazed that flex and bison are used :-)
[16:01:40] <Darke> Why? They make perfect sense to me. <grin>
[16:03:37] <Colourless> ick.y :-)
[16:04:52] <Darke> Well, that's what the 'compiler' is called, so it's at the very least, somewhat appropriate. <grin>
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[16:14:06] <Darke> Hmm... that time of the night again, I must go and sleep. Enjoy losing your mind with INTERCAL now Colourless. <grin> Night!
[16:14:07] <Colourless> enough with the intercal
[16:14:25] <Colourless> cya
[16:14:30] <Darke> No. You _must_ learn the language. <grin>
[16:14:36] <Colourless> why?
[16:15:09] <Darke> No reason. <grin> For some reason just after reading about it, I felt 'forced' to learn it, just out of curiosity to find out if it actually works.
[16:15:30] <Darke> But I'm weird like that. <grin>
[16:15:36] <Colourless> i liked a comment in the float lib docs that conforming to standards isn't something that an intercal library needs to do :-)
[16:15:59] <Darke> Agreed!
[16:16:03] <Darke> Night!
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[16:16:17] <Avatar> bye
[16:18:33] <Avatar> i said bye
[16:19:22] <Colourless> we know
[16:19:24] <laxdragon> what do you want, a grand sendoff?
[16:19:28] <Avatar> no
[16:19:36] <Avatar> only a bye
[16:19:42] <Avatar> thats not much
[16:20:04] <laxdragon> yeah it is. You assume we'll miss you.
[16:20:06] <Avatar> wie ich eigentlich in deutsch sagen würde... depp
[16:20:15] <Avatar> hehe
[16:21:11] <Avatar> i hope i get in few weeks UO
[16:21:18] <Avatar> Ultima Online
[16:21:35] <Avatar> when i got it i will delete Exult
[16:22:09] <Avatar> Ultima Online is the best game !!!
[16:22:37] <laxdragon> I disagree, it's an evil EA corporate money pit.
[16:22:48] <Avatar> no
[16:23:03] <Avatar> better then U7
[16:23:10] <Avatar> hoho much better
[16:23:37] <laxdragon> in what way, Storyline? Plot? a point to playing other than glorified chat?
[16:23:52] <Avatar> you are free
[16:23:55] <Avatar> multiplayer
[16:23:57] <Avatar> FREE
[16:24:01] <Avatar> ROLE PLAYING
[16:24:11] <Avatar> with many players
[16:24:34] <Colourless> free??? ultima online???? you must be thinking of a different ultima online than I know
[16:24:42] <Avatar> When you have finished U7 its over
[16:24:51] <Avatar> UO is never over
[16:25:00] <laxdragon> If I wanted to role play, I'd play AD&D with my friends with nothing but dice and a character sheet.
[16:26:50] <Colourless> i think having the rule might help a little with ad&d
[16:28:23] <Avatar> ohh no please not AD&D
[16:28:33] <Avatar> i hate balur's gate and AD&D
[16:28:45] <Avatar> when a pen and paper game then middle earth
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[16:48:28] <Avatar> hey
[16:48:38] <Avatar> i have got Delphi
[16:48:50] <Avatar> i am working at a textadventure
[16:48:59] <Avatar> will someone buy it????
[16:49:03] <Avatar> only 5 euro
[16:49:11] <Avatar> ohh
[16:49:12] <Avatar> wiat
[16:49:15] <Avatar> wait
[16:49:20] <Avatar> i must reboot
[16:49:21] <Avatar> cu
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[16:55:17] <firetooth> yes!
[16:55:21] <firetooth> hello there :)
[16:55:48] <firetooth> first time coming here, so let me introduce myself, I'm Firetooth Dragon of the Udic...
[16:56:02] <firetooth> and I'm looking for help about U7 USECODE Compiler...
[16:56:10] <firetooth> if anyone could help, just say :))
[16:56:18] <Cless|Away> well, it's not finished yet
[16:56:25] <firetooth> damn...
[16:56:46] <firetooth> I have a version, that is intended to works, but have problems...
[16:56:51] <firetooth> is there another one ?
[16:57:11] <Cless|Away> no
[16:57:24] <firetooth> snif...
[16:57:31] <firetooth> I have to wait, then...
[16:57:50] <firetooth> having the whole dialogs of U7 almost ready for recompiling...
[16:57:51] <firetooth> lol
[16:58:18] <Cless|Away> ah, you are talking about wuc?
[16:58:22] <firetooth> yep
[16:58:26] <firetooth> have another one ?
[16:58:40] <Cless|Away> there is also ucc, which is different
[16:58:44] <Cless|Away> wuc should work
[16:59:05] <firetooth> aaaah... well, wuc simply don't, telling me that there is some function not recognized... :(
[16:59:19] <firetooth> ucc, where can I take this one ?
[17:00:00] <Cless|Away> you won't be able to use ucc
[17:00:21] <firetooth> ah, why not ?
[17:00:46] <Cless|Away> it doesn't work like wuc. the code produced by wud can't be used with ucc
[17:01:04] <Cless|Away> what version of wuc and wud are you using?
[17:01:18] <Cless|Away> are you specifying -s with both?
[17:01:29] <firetooth> aww... but obviously, wuc won't recompile any function given bu wud... :(
[17:01:32] <firetooth> nope
[17:01:35] <firetooth> must I
[17:01:36] <firetooth> ?
[17:01:45] <firetooth> well, for version, wait, I check it now...
[17:03:06] <firetooth> ok, for wuc, it is 0.009
[17:03:20] <firetooth> and wud don't give me version, but I guess it's the same...
[17:03:52] <Cless|Away> that doesn't 'really' help me very much. did you compile them yourself?
[17:06:09] <firetooth> nope
[17:06:19] <firetooth> I don't have the source code by now...
[17:07:19] <Cless|Away> ok, where did you get your versions?
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[17:07:36] <Darkatom> hi
[17:07:37] <Cless|Away> as a snapshot?
[17:07:39] <Cless|Away> hi
[17:07:48] <firetooth> woaw... honestly I don't remember where precisely... on an Ultima VII website, for sure, but which one... :(
[17:07:57] <firetooth> yes, it's as a snapshot tho
[17:08:04] <firetooth> hi Darkatom
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[17:08:25] <Cless|Away> well, go to our download page and download the lastest compiled version of the tools. that's all I can really say to help
[17:08:43] <Darkatom> I've found a bug, i think
[17:08:50] <firetooth> well, it's already good for me :))
[17:08:57] <firetooth> what download page, btw ? :)
[17:09:02] <firetooth> the Exult one ?
[17:09:18] <firetooth> Darkatom ah ?? which one ??
[17:09:21] <Darkatom> yes
[17:09:31] <Darkatom> I have a screenshot of that
[17:09:38] <Darkatom> do you want it?
[17:09:42] <Cless|Away> yeah the exult one
[17:09:47] <Cless|Away> ?download
[17:09:54] <Cless|Away> ?help
[17:10:24] <Darkatom> what?
[17:10:30] <firetooth> ?download
[17:10:35] <Darkatom> ?download
[17:10:44] <Cless|Away> download don't do anything
[17:10:48] <Darkatom> ?help
[17:10:54] <firetooth> ?help
[17:11:07] <Cless|Away> ?naem
[17:11:13] <Cless|Away> ?name
[17:11:13] <exultbot> Greetings Avatar. I am called Exultbot.
[17:11:17] <firetooth> gulp... what is naem ?
[17:11:24] <firetooth> ahh.. :))
[17:11:26] <firetooth> ?name
[17:11:26] <exultbot> Greetings Avatar. I am called Exultbot.
[17:11:32] <firetooth> lol
[17:11:48] <Cless|Away> here's our download page: http://exult.sourceforge.net/download.php
[17:12:06] <firetooth> great :))
[17:12:15] <firetooth> thanx... by the way, I have found the command :)
[17:13:10] <firetooth> and, I have forgotten to tell that just yesterday I d/l all what I have found there :)
[17:13:21] <firetooth> to try my work with
[17:13:28] <Cless|Away> oh :-)
[17:15:59] <firetooth> eheh, I'm on two works at the time, for U7...
[17:16:12] <firetooth> the remake, I have to check dialogs,
[17:16:29] <firetooth> and the original (or remake too), where I do also french translation ;))
[17:24:16] <Darkatom> i must leave, bye
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[17:27:41] <firetooth> ok, nice to have been here for awhile...
[17:27:46] <firetooth> leaving for now :))
[17:27:54] <firetooth> good day/night/whatever people :)
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[17:45:41] <royalsexy> 'lo again
[17:45:51] <Cless|Away> hi
[17:46:52] <royalsexy> i'm trying to figure out where to download exult studio (for linux) - can you point me in the right direction?
[17:47:44] <Cless|Away> you need to download the source and compile it
[17:47:55] <royalsexy> the exult source?
[17:48:04] <Cless|Away> yeah
[17:48:09] <royalsexy> done
[17:48:33] <royalsexy> wow that was quick ;P
[17:48:53] <_Kreed_> >job
[17:48:55] <_Kreed_> ?job
[17:48:55] <exultbot> My job is to write down everything you say.
[17:49:03] <_Kreed_> ?bye
[17:49:03] <exultbot> Goodbye, Avatar.
[17:49:07] <_Kreed_> lol
[17:49:12] <_Kreed_> ?murder
[17:50:23] <royalsexy> heh
[17:50:39] <royalsexy> so is the studio included with the main source then?
[17:50:44] <Cless|Away> yeah
[17:50:50] <Cless|Away> it's in mapedit
[17:50:50] <royalsexy> ahh
[17:50:55] <royalsexy> mapedit
[17:50:57] <royalsexy> cool thanks
[17:51:07] <Cless|Away> not sure how you compile it for linux though
[17:51:51] <royalsexy> i'll figure it out :)
[17:51:55] <royalsexy> ta mate
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[17:52:59] <wjp> hi
[17:53:07] <Cless|Away> hi
[17:53:16] <royalsexy> 'lo wjp
[17:56:40] <wjp> hey cool... email from Brendan Segraves
[17:57:36] <Cless|Away> more info please?
[17:57:46] <wjp> it's on the ML
[17:58:10] <wjp> Jeff forwarded it, anyway
[17:58:14] * Cless|Away looks and doesn' see anything
[17:58:18] <Cless|Away> ah
[17:59:18] <Cless|Away> si/ss code would be most useful
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[19:15:06] <Colourless> time to go
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[19:23:47] <Darkatom> hi
[19:24:13] <wjp> hi
[19:25:19] <Darkatom> wjp
[19:25:32] <Darkatom> I think I've found a bug
[19:26:19] <Darkatom> I was in Skara brae talking with the mayor
[19:26:51] <Darkatom> when the program has been interrupted
[19:27:25] <Darkatom> something like: assert /shapes/vga.h line 180 or something like that
[19:27:44] <wjp> while you were talking?
[19:28:42] <Darkatom> when the mayor is about to come with me and sacrifice his life
[19:28:45] <Darkatom> hehe
[19:31:06] <wjp> what was the last thing you did when it crashed?
[19:31:30] <Darkatom> I did what I'm telling
[19:31:38] <Darkatom> talk with the mayor and
[19:32:02] <Darkatom> tell him to come with me in order to sacrifice his life
[19:32:17] <Darkatom> do you know what I'm talking about?
[19:32:29] <wjp> yeah, but I need to know the exact moment it crashed
[19:32:48] <Darkatom> mm...let me see...
[19:32:57] <Darkatom> yes
[19:33:26] <Darkatom> I remember to have asked all the people in Skara Brae about to come with me
[19:33:42] <Darkatom> but the actio that crash the gae
[19:34:17] <wjp> do you have a savegame right before talking to the mayor?
[19:34:26] <Darkatom> but the action that crash the game, was the answer of the mayor
[19:34:39] <wjp> ok, so the mayor said something, and then it crashed?
[19:34:47] <Darkatom> exactly
[19:35:31] <Darkatom> I think the game crashed when mayor finished talking
[19:37:16] <wjp> do you have a savegame right before talking to the mayor?
[19:37:51] <Darkatom> I think yes
[19:38:03] <Darkatom> wait..
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[19:44:57] <Darkatom> wjp: wait 2 mins, i'll back again
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[19:51:13] <Darkatom> ok
[19:51:21] <Darkatom> wjp: I have the savegame
[19:51:27] <wjp> great
[19:51:27] <Darkatom> take it
[19:52:12] <Darkatom> I have a screenshot of the error, do you want it?
[19:52:21] <wjp> yeah, sure
[19:53:02] <Darkatom> ok
[19:54:24] <wjp> spanish buttons :-)
[19:54:35] <Darkatom> yeap
[19:55:16] <wjp> ok.. let's try this savegame...
[19:55:51] <wjp> juego? hm... "game" ?
[19:55:58] <Darkatom> hehe
[19:56:05] <Darkatom> yes
[19:57:28] <wjp> hmm, I assume I have to return Rowena and then talk to everybody about sacrifice first?
[19:57:56] <Darkatom> yes, of course
[19:58:10] <wjp> it's been a while since I actually played U7 :-)
[19:58:33] <Darkatom> :)
[20:00:47] <Darkatom> do you know how to solve the problem?
[20:00:57] <wjp> still asking people about sacrifice...
[20:01:04] <Darkatom> ok
[20:01:27] <wjp> it crashes right after the mayor agrees to come with you?
[20:01:33] <wjp> (because it doesn't crash for me)
[20:03:31] <wjp> you're using version 0.96beta1, right?
[20:03:49] <EvilMech> yes i am :)
[20:04:00] <wjp> *grin*... not you, silly :-)
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[20:04:29] <Darkatom> yes, the game crash when the mayor agrees to come with me
[20:04:31] <Darkatom> and
[20:04:45] <Darkatom> I'm using 0.96beta1
[20:05:30] <wjp> you could try if the latest snapshot works ok
[20:06:06] <Darkatom> 0.96beta1 is not the last?
[20:06:27] <wjp> it's the last official release, but we've fixed lots of bugs since then
[20:06:31] <_Kreed_> assuming Darkatom knows how to compile from .cvs
[20:06:35] <_Kreed_> :P
[20:06:57] <Darkatom> _Kreed_ : assume that
[20:07:05] <wjp> if you go to http://exult.sf.net/download.php, there's a section named "Snapshots"
[20:07:29] <wjp> the "Windows 9x/ME/NT/2000 binary snapshot" listed there is the latest build of exult available
[20:08:22] <Darkatom> i'll download it
[20:09:01] <wjp> oh, if you don't feel like asking everyone about sacrifice again, here's a savegame where I've already done that: http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/exult112bg.sav
[20:09:34] <Darkatom> ok
[20:09:56] <Darkatom> thank u
[20:14:09] <wjp> oops... no, it isn't. Sorry...
[20:14:09] <wjp> (I just broke that savegame accidently trying to open it in 0.96beta1)
[20:14:09] <Darkatom> :)
[20:14:09] * wjp hits himself... stupid me
[20:14:09] <Darkatom> do you need it again?
[20:14:09] <wjp> no, I still have your savegame
[20:14:09] <Darkatom> ok
[20:14:09] <wjp> I just broke the one I made just before talking to the mayor
[20:14:09] <wjp> brb
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[20:22:57] <Darkatom> wjp: I cannot install the last snapshot binary in win98 or winXP
[20:23:12] <Darkatom> it gives an error
[20:23:42] <wjp> b
[20:23:44] <wjp> what error?
[20:23:48] <Darkatom> but
[20:24:05] <Darkatom> i've decompressed the .exe file with winzip
[20:24:37] <Darkatom> the executable
[20:24:48] <Darkatom> the SFX format
[20:25:17] <Darkatom> is corrupted, i think but is not a problem if it can be decompressed with winzip
[20:31:03] <Darkatom> ok, the last snapshot solves the problem
[20:31:31] <wjp> ok, that's good
[20:31:44] <Darkatom> must leave, bye
[20:31:46] <wjp> bye
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[20:35:11] <wjp> hi again :-)
[20:35:11] <Darkatom> hehe, I'm here again
[20:35:26] <Darkatom> wjp: now I know what's the problem
[20:35:46] <Darkatom> now the mayor comes with me, but...
[20:36:53] <Darkatom> when I go to "Gameplay options" and enable the status bars
[20:37:08] <Darkatom> the game crash
[20:37:15] <Darkatom> es
[20:37:17] <wjp> do you have serpent isle?
[20:37:26] <Darkatom> no
[20:37:34] <Darkatom> no, I haven't
[20:37:35] <Darkatom> why?
[20:37:58] <wjp> some of the faces in the status bars might use graphics from SI
[20:39:05] <Darkatom> i won't enable the status bars by now then
[20:39:15] <Darkatom> byee
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[20:39:18] <wjp> we'll try to fix this, in the meantime...
[20:39:22] <wjp> oops
[21:35:14] --- wjp is now known as wjp|away
[21:45:51] * laxdragon is away: ZZZZzzzzzzzz
[23:41:56] --- wjp|away is now known as wjp