#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 19 Jun 2001 (GMT)

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[08:41:08] <mrod> hello, may I ask a question ? exult complains about not being able to find /usr/local/share/exult/exult_bg.flx, but i installed exult using exult-0.92alpha3-1.i386.rpm
[08:42:16] <mrod> and "rpm -ql exult | grep share/exult" gives me only exult.flx and midisfx.flx
[08:43:11] <Kirben> sounds like file is missing
[08:43:38] <Kirben> I can dcc copy, but not sure if will work since I use cvs versions
[08:44:20] <mrod> maybe I could try to get the source package and try to compile it
[08:44:59] <Kirben> use cvs source then, much more up to date
[08:45:22] <Kirben> Can get cvs snapshots from http://io.spaceports.com/~kirben/
[08:45:45] <mrod> oh, thank you. i was just searching for the cvs :-)
[08:45:51] <Kirben> or I can dcc copy
[08:46:01] <Kirben> site is a few cvs updates behind
[08:48:17] <mrod> hmm, it'd be nice, but I fear I'm not able I'm not able to receive dcc requests right now (I've began using this irc client a few days ago, on linux)
[08:48:30] <mrod> but it's worth a try :-)
[08:49:45] <mrod> hmm, hey it seems to be working ^_^
[08:49:47] <Kirben> working :)
[08:50:43] <mrod> I used mIRC and I wouldn't have imagined that there was a /dcc get command to issue, but I've seen in the help it does :-)
[08:52:11] <Kirben> Yes mIRC makes it much easier than basic text based irc client
[08:52:52] <mrod> I guess xchat is easier too, on this side
[08:53:11] <mrod> i'm using irssi
[08:55:25] <mrod> it's kind of you, thank thee :-)
[08:55:47] <Kirben> no problem
[08:56:22] <Kirben> new sdl (1.2.1) is out too if you want to recompile/reinstall that first.
[08:56:47] <Kirben> http://www.libsdl.org/download-1.2.html
[08:58:59] <mrod> nice, I'm downloading it
[09:02:45] <mrod> I wonder what does LB think of this. I'm sure he has heard of it.
[09:04:25] <Kirben> I think he would be very pleased but I don't think anyone has asked him.
[09:05:00] <mrod> :-) I long to hear what he thinks. I guess he's proud ^_^
[09:05:48] <mrod> there's an error during compile: lex.yy.c:1662: declaration of `int isatty (int)' throws different exceptions
[09:06:24] <mrod> /usr/include/unistd.h:668: than previous declaration `int isatty (int) throw ()'
[09:06:42] <Kirben> Is that from sdl or exult ?
[09:06:57] <mrod> exult
[09:07:22] <mrod> i've picked up SDL rpm, and installed it
[09:07:46] <Kirben> Sorry no idea, never since anything like that doing win32 compiles.
[09:08:04] <Kirben> what gcc version ?
[09:08:13] <mrod> 2.96
[09:08:58] <Kirben> That should be fine I think
[09:09:26] <Kirben> That others should be on in next hour or 2, they might be able to help more.
[09:10:02] <mrod> I'm going to grab also the non-cvs version, to see if the problem is also there
[09:12:10] <Kirben> good idea
[09:12:45] <mrod> make fired
[09:15:55] <mrod> hmm, the problem is also in the non-cvs version. it must be some problem of my system then
[09:17:02] <mrod> I'm going to try feed configure some non-default option
[09:21:26] <mrod> hey, it seems to be going on, with --disable-compiler
[09:23:49] <mrod> great, it starts ok.
[09:24:14] <Kirben> Thats good
[09:31:17] <mrod> hey, I was thinking that maybe you all of the exult team will be happy to see the mention of exult on www.everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1030056 (and there's also another writeup, not by me, about exult itself) :-)
[09:33:04] <Kirben> Yep any mention of exult on sites is always good :)
[09:34:30] <mrod> :-)
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[09:47:41] <Wumpus> third time lucky, hehe
[09:47:51] <Wumpus> (join #xult twice first :P stupid fingers)
[09:48:31] <mrod> :-)
[10:36:25] <mrod> i can't seem to get music on linux, even if i have timidity installed and I hear the initialization brief noise, and exult does not complain about music
[10:36:55] <mrod> maybe there's some setup i should do for timidity ?
[10:37:12] <Wumpus> dunno
[10:37:23] <Wumpus> timidity hits more than 50% CPU usage on my computer, so I disable sound
[10:37:45] <mrod> the sound works in the windows version, though
[10:37:49] <Wumpus> (it doesn't sound extremely nice though :P)
[10:37:49] <Wumpus> combared to my opl3
[10:56:56] <mrod> i go for now, have a good day. bye !
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[11:18:47] <wjp> hi
[11:18:52] <Wumpus> `lo
[11:21:05] <wjp> hmm.... pity mrod is gone already :/
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[11:28:58] <wjp> hi
[11:29:04] <Nadir> hi
[11:29:22] <Nadir> I played a bit of SI yesterday. It's working quite well.
[11:29:37] <wjp> yeah, it does
[11:30:36] <Nadir> I have a couple of problems in Fawn though... Zulith is following me and whenever he reappears Exult stops responding to events until the pathfinder has "positioned" him near me
[11:30:45] <Kirben> Hiyas
[11:31:06] <wjp> yeah, the 'approach_avatar' intrinsic is broken
[11:31:35] <Nadir> Also I should be able to accuse him of following me
[11:31:51] <Kirben> Would GTK SDL Widget help porting exult_studio to other platforms ?
[11:32:05] <Kirben> http://sourceforge.net/projects/gtksdl/
[11:32:44] <wjp> no, since exult_studio doesn't use SDL
[11:33:09] <Kirben> This converts gtk calls to sdl I think
[11:33:37] <wjp> according to the summary on the homepage it embeds SDL in GTK
[11:33:47] <Nadir> Kirben: no, that is just a widget to embed a SDL surface within a GTK app. What we need is the revers
[11:33:58] <Nadir> s/revers/opposite/
[11:34:05] <Kirben> oh, wrong way
[11:34:11] <wjp> yeah :-(
[11:34:21] <wjp> would've been nice, though
[11:34:31] <Kirben> BTW SDL 1.2.1 is out and seems to work well with Exult (Win32)
[11:34:34] <Nadir> Only Gtk+ 2.0 will provide different "backends"
[11:35:02] <Nadir> Hmm, Chatzilla works rather well... it's a bit basic
[11:35:17] <wjp> yeah, I noticed you were using that :-)
[11:35:26] <wjp> --> Nadir (chatzilla@ has joined #exult
[11:35:43] <Nadir> I'm in Windoze now, and I don't have my faithful X-Chat...
[11:36:00] <Kirben> GCC 3.0 out too, does exult still compile well in GCC 3.0 ?
[11:36:12] <wjp> dunno... haven't downloaded it yet
[11:36:18] <Kirben> I know of x-chat port for cygwin if you are intersted
[11:36:45] <wjp> I'm not sure if I feel like building gcc from source
[11:36:54] <Nadir> Yes, Dancer has done some "Code-Nazi" checkins to Exult which should make it compile with GCC 3.0
[11:37:06] <Nadir> See the Changelog
[11:37:06] <Kirben> X-chat port for Cygwin is at http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=6998
[11:37:07] <wjp> and Max did some more last night
[11:38:16] <Kirben> Yes I noticed Dancer's changes, I was just hoping nothing else changed in GCC 3.0 before release to break it.
[11:38:30] <Nadir> Yes. The Mac compiler Max is using is rather strict (but I bet gcc 3.0 is stricter still). If you've been using RedHat's gcc 2.96 (the latest RPMS) you should already know what 3.0 means
[11:38:48] <Nadir> kirben: unlikely, as gcc has been in freeze for quite a while now
[11:38:59] <Kirben> ah, good
[11:39:26] <Nadir> But, as wjp says, compiling gcc from source is a *time-consuming* task
[11:39:26] <Kirben> Windows is still stuck on GCC 2.95.3 but I expect that will change soon enough.
[11:39:45] <Nadir> I've done it a couple of times...
[11:39:55] <Wumpus> hehe
[11:40:00] <Wumpus> not as time consuming as ghc :P
[11:40:13] <Nadir> ghc ?
[11:40:32] <Wumpus> Glorious Glasgow Haskell Compilation System or some such :P
[11:40:43] <Nadir> Why is that ?
[11:40:46] * Wumpus got paid to hack haskell during summer :)
[11:41:00] <Wumpus> haskell is a functional programming language, ghc a compiler for it (written, of course, in haskell)
[11:41:46] <Nadir> I know what Haskell is. One of my lecturers at Uni was in love with it. I only have experience with Lisp and ML
[11:41:56] <Wumpus> hehe
[11:42:09] <Wumpus> they teach it in one of our first year computing courses
[11:42:17] <Wumpus> its quite cool :-)
[11:42:59] <Nadir> wjp: anyone planning to fix approach_avatar ?
[11:43:42] <Nadir> Also we should add the Ankh as a browser icon on the web site, so that it appears in the bookmarks
[11:48:56] --- wjp is now known as wjp|work
[11:49:22] <wjp|work> Nadir: not AFAIK, and sure, why not
[11:54:41] * wjp|work wonders why putting in a favicon.ico doesn't work
[11:55:50] <Nadir> you uploaded a favicon to exult.sourceforge.net
[11:56:00] <wjp|work> yeah
[11:56:14] <wjp|work> but it doesn't seem to do anything
[11:56:33] <wjp|work> I used the exult.ico from the win32/ dir
[11:57:41] <Nadir> It needs to be 16x16
[11:58:00] <wjp|work> oh, wait, it does work :-)
[11:58:40] <wjp|work> although a custom 16x16 icon might look better than this scaled-down one
[11:59:05] <Nadir> actually it's fine as it is
[12:00:01] <Nadir> wjp: weekly update ?
[12:00:15] <wjp|work> oh, right, it's that time of week again :/
[12:00:16] * Nadir is a pain in the butt :)
[12:00:38] <Wumpus> a bit later than that time of week already, isn't it? :P
[12:00:45] <Nadir> chatzilla has auto-smileys...
[12:00:49] <wjp|work> nah, I usually did it on tuesday
[12:00:49] <Nadir> 8)
[12:01:04] <Nadir> and today is: TUESDAY !
[12:01:07] <wjp|work> the last 3 weeks were just a bit irregular
[12:01:10] <Wumpus> hehe
[12:01:17] <Wumpus> ahh :)
[12:02:27] <Nadir> where is approach avatar ?
[12:03:05] <Nadir> found it.
[12:03:25] <Nadir> the new cvs browser on sourceforge does syntax colouring
[12:04:35] <Nadir> but how can an asynchronous version of approach_avatar be implemented?
[12:05:49] * Nadir is not very experienced with Usecode...
[12:11:30] <Nadir> gotta go. bye guys
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[12:15:59] <wjp|work> back
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[12:43:58] <wjp|work> hi
[12:44:19] <eZ> hey
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[12:51:21] <wjp|work> hi mrod
[12:51:31] <wjp|work> I've just read the questions you asked this morning, and:
[12:51:49] <wjp|work> exult_bg.flx is (unfortunately) missing from our alpha3 .rpm
[12:51:59] <mrod> hello wjp|work
[12:52:08] <wjp|work> there's a bug in the flex version of some of the recent linux distros
[12:52:08] <mrod> hello to all
[12:52:49] <mrod> i understand
[12:53:11] <mrod> flex ?
[12:53:31] <wjp|work> flex = lexer generator
[12:53:47] <wjp|work> we use it to generate a lexer for our usecode compiler
[12:54:11] <mrod> oh, about the compile error, i understand
[12:54:37] <mrod> i see
[12:55:03] <wjp|work> easy to workaround, btw
[12:57:56] <mrod> i hope to succeed in getting music asap, but unfortunately i have no clue, since the program initializes the mixer (i hear it because of the brief noise), but no sound|music seems to make it
[13:00:30] <wjp|work> hmm, weird
[13:00:33] <wjp|work> using timidity?
[13:01:00] <mrod> yes, I have it installed on my system
[13:01:19] <wjp|work> I assume you have sound in exult enabled? :-)
[13:01:26] <mrod> of course :-)
[13:01:37] <-- Wumpus has left IRC (And so, I go)
[13:01:42] <wjp|work> are you using the cvs version?
[13:01:47] <mrod> i've also tried toggling the various options in the menu, but nothing
[13:02:38] <mrod> i've tried both cvs and non-cvs version
[13:03:49] <wjp|work> does playing midi's with timidity work? (outside of exult)
[13:04:57] <mrod> this i did not try yet, because my linux box was set up recently and i've still many things to try. but i'll try right now
[13:05:24] <eZ> Hi, Do you guys know anybody interested in starting a U6 / Worlds of Ultima project in the same vain as Exult?
[13:06:45] <Kirben> http://www.laymeduck.com/u6/
[13:06:49] <mrod> hmm, timidity complains a lot
[13:07:03] <eZ> Are they the #D conversion guys?
[13:07:10] <eZ> 3D ;)
[13:07:33] <Kirben> yes
[13:07:50] <eZ> I was thinking of a direct conversion for hand helds etc. :)
[13:08:48] <mrod> timidity says "No instrument mapped to tone bank 0 program <number> - this instrument will not be heard" about 20-25 times. i'm trying to play windows' canyon.mid, if that helps
[13:08:58] <Kirben> I don't know of any like that
[13:09:19] <Kirben> Would be to decode all ULtima 6 formats for a start
[13:09:35] <Kirben> be=need
[13:10:02] <mrod> i guess that each instrument did not make it, and it must be the same thing happening with exult. so it's not an exult problem.
[13:10:29] <eZ> There seems to be a bit of info floating around for the map and object formats.
[13:10:54] <mrod> Kirben: i've seen some people tweaking u6 on the web, maybe there's someone willing to share out there :-)
[13:11:57] <Kirben> yes seem to be some around, just need the programmers I guess
[13:12:04] <eZ> Would an understanding of the U7 internals help with decoding U6 or are they to far removed?
[13:12:07] <wjp|work> eZ: do you have any instruments installed?
[13:12:09] <mrod> wjp|work: the only strange thing is, how come exult did not complain about music ? doesn't timidity notify the failure of one or more instrument initialization ?
[13:12:19] <Kirben> I really doubt it
[13:12:30] <eZ> CVS exult breaks with my version of Kmid :(
[13:12:33] <wjp|work> mrod: timidity might notify exult, but exult ignores any output :-)
[13:12:49] <mrod> wjp|work: :-)
[13:12:54] <wjp|work> eZ: with 'Kmid' do you mean KDE midi?
[13:13:02] <Kirben> could try and use some of exult code as base I guess though maybe ?
[13:13:26] <Kirben> Never seen more portable program
[13:13:33] <wjp|work> (because that's not the library we use)
[13:14:48] <eZ> libkmid??
[13:15:10] <Kirben> eZ:maybe try asking on ultima news groups and setup sourforge site if there is enough interest in helping ?
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[13:15:16] <wjp|work> hi Ryan
[13:15:30] <Colourless> hi
[13:16:14] <mrod> eZ: anyways, i'd love to see ultima 6 too alive with something like exult :-)
[13:16:28] <eZ> I was just seeing if there was any interest in the idea.
[13:16:47] <Kirben> I'm sure there would be interest
[13:17:09] <Colourless> yeah, there probably would be
[13:17:10] <mrod> eZ: i definitely would love it, but unfortunately i'm no skilled programmer
[13:17:57] <mrod> i'm definitely *sure* there would be interest. look at all those u6 tweakings, add-ons, etc. on the web, for instance
[13:18:24] <Kirben> I'm no programmer either but I can try and hunt down all known Ultima 6 details if it would help. I like reseaching.
[13:19:10] <eZ> That would help :)
[13:19:15] <wjp|work> wow... my gcc build already seems to have reached bootstrap stage2... *yawn*
[13:19:58] <eZ> I'm pretty sure we could get a map editor working fairly quickly but getting the actual game mechanics might prove quite a hard task.
[13:20:19] <eZ> I've been compiling gcc 3 today too. :)
[13:20:27] <Kirben> eZ: let me know your email address and will let you know what I find.
[13:20:54] <Colourless> it might prove almost impossible. From what I've heard, much of the U6 gamecode was written in ASM
[13:21:30] <eZ> How was U7 info obtained? DEBUG session?
[13:22:29] <Colourless> i really don't know how much of it was done.
[13:22:43] <Kirben> Check out http://www.geocities.com/nodling/ for a start
[13:23:16] <Kirben> http://www.geocities.com/nodling/text/u6tech.txt specifically
[13:24:31] <Kirben> Someone's tried some Ultima 6 debugging already ^
[13:28:31] <eZ> u6tech.txt looks good.
[13:29:46] <eZ> looks like he hasen't figured out the conversations part yet.
[13:33:51] <Kirben> Could try emailng him incase he has made more progess since then, thats almost a month old now.
[13:34:19] <eZ> Here's a site with the U6 NPC headshots. http://www.geocities.com/xenerkes/En/u6head1.htm
[13:35:30] <Kirben> Quite good graphics for the time
[13:36:24] <eZ> I remember playing U6 on my old Hercules mointer in Green and Black. ;)
[13:39:32] <Kirben> conversations http://home.hiwaay.net/~rgregg/ultima/literal/
[13:40:03] <Kirben> Download Ultima 6 Transcript
[13:41:00] <eZ> sucking it down now :)
[13:44:30] <eZ> Looks like this guy transcribed all that through playing the game.
[13:44:44] <mrod> !
[13:46:03] <Kirben> That must have taken ages! will keep looking...
[13:49:14] <wjp|work> he did _what_??
[13:49:30] <wjp|work> good god...
[13:49:50] <mrod> :-D
[13:50:26] <mrod> well, it's kind of ... unusual ?, but it's a great work !
[13:51:04] <Kirben> There is Ultima 6 clone project, http://ire.sourceforge.net/
[13:51:31] <Kirben> But is seems more focused on creating a better editor
[13:52:21] <eZ> That guy did a fair bit of stuff with U6 http://members.nbci.com/ithe/u6_tools.htm
[13:54:06] <Kirben> http://members.nbci.com/ithe/u6_tools.htm
[13:54:33] <Colourless> so good it needed to have it's url said twice?
[13:55:03] <Kirben> The Ultima 6 Developer's Kit^
[13:55:26] <Kirben> oops
[13:55:54] <eZ> :)
[13:56:25] <eZ> http://www.graf.torun.pl/~rackne/maporg.html Good Map info
[13:57:37] <eZ> This guy wants a 1 to 1 pixel U6 map to hang on his wall!
[13:58:02] <Kirben> I saw that one too but it said U6 like games...
[13:58:09] <wjp|work> Exult can do that for U7 :-)
[13:58:11] <Colourless> we would make a 1 to 1 pixel map of u7, but it would be so huge that it would fill the entire wall
[13:58:19] <eZ> At that scale it would be a 16384x16384 pixel bitmap
[13:58:29] <eZ> U6 map that is.
[13:58:34] <wjp|work> U7 would be 24Kx24K
[13:58:50] <wjp|work> I had one on my HD for a while :-)
[13:58:56] <eZ> Wouldn't that look nice!
[13:59:09] <eZ> How long did that take to generate?
[14:00:57] <wjp|work> not that long
[14:01:27] <wjp|work> it produces 144 2048x2048 .pcx files
[14:01:38] <wjp|work> about 450Mb total, or 140Mb when .png'ed
[14:02:03] <eZ> Is that functionality still in exult?
[14:02:23] <Colourless> yeah
[14:02:58] <wjp|work> see "exult --help"
[14:05:12] <Kirben> Will find more tommorrow
[14:05:45] <eZ> great
[14:06:02] <Colourless> ez: what so are you using?
[14:06:03] <-- Kirben has left IRC (Sleep)
[14:06:08] <Colourless> s/so/os
[14:06:37] <eZ> ?
[14:06:44] <wjp|work> -eZ- VERSION xchat 1.6.4 Linux 2.4.2 [i686/1000MHz]
[14:07:00] <Colourless> what operating system are you using... never mind...
[14:07:15] <eZ> ah ;)
[14:07:21] <eZ> Distro is Slackware 7.1
[14:07:58] <eZ> What is the define __GNUG__ used for in vec.h??
[14:08:29] <eZ> It's causing the CVS snapshot to complain when compiling. :(
[14:09:04] <eZ> path.cc in pathfinder/
[14:09:07] <wjp|work> gcc 3?
[14:09:12] <eZ> yup
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[14:09:19] <wjp|work> I'm just trying to fix that :-)
[14:09:26] <eZ> ah right. ;)
[14:09:37] <Fingolfin> I *LOVE* open source
[14:09:38] <eZ> somthing to do with stdc++V3
[14:09:47] * Fingolfin just fixed the OS X DSL driver
[14:10:16] <wjp|work> eZ: if you use the top line it breaks in path.cc, if you use the bottom line it breaks in objs.cc
[14:10:22] <Colourless> if you used a real computer system though, you wouldn't have had those problems in the first place... :)
[14:10:36] <eZ> That being?
[14:10:51] <Fingolfin> colourless: name one? one "real computer system" ?
[14:11:05] <Fingolfin> colourless: donīt say linux, or windows, or I'll laugh
[14:11:05] <Fingolfin> ;)
[14:11:12] <eZ> I can't :(
[14:11:17] <Colourless> x86! :)
[14:11:21] <eZ> Nothings perfect.
[14:11:44] <Fingolfin> ryan? I think you should s/:)/8;---)))))))))]]])))/
[14:12:40] <Colourless> if you say so.
[14:13:01] <Colourless> I was careful not to mention an operating system because i hear that OS X is pretty good
[14:13:08] <eZ> I'm off to bed. cya
[14:13:30] <eZ> I'd like to get my habds on an OS X machine. Objective C is Nice. :)
[14:13:39] <eZ> hands. :)
[14:14:16] <-- eZ has left #exult
[14:14:26] <Fingolfin> hehe
[14:14:29] --- Fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|busy
[14:21:41] * wjp|work kicks gcc3
[14:21:41] <mrod> bye, see you later
[14:21:44] <wjp|work> bye
[14:21:48] <-- mrod has left #exult
[14:22:09] <wjp|work> for(std::vector<T>::iterator X = begin(); X != end(); ++X) <-- parse error before ';' token
[14:22:47] <Colourless> those lines cause problems in MSVC if i attempt to compile exult in that
[14:23:42] <Fingolfin|busy> hmmm
[14:23:52] <Fingolfin|busy> before which ; is the error?
[14:23:55] --- Fingolfin|busy is now known as Fingolfin
[14:24:21] <wjp|work> it doesn't say, but I'll split up the line
[14:24:33] <Colourless> from memory doing something like using std::vector and changine std::vector<T>:: to vector<T>:: tended to fix the problems I was getting
[14:24:41] <wjp|work> first
[14:24:45] <Colourless> hope the makes sense
[14:24:49] <Fingolfin> ryan: hm, could be
[14:25:02] <Fingolfin> ryan: some compilers/parsers have big troubles with such constructs ;)
[14:26:37] <wjp|work> I put the "std::vector<T>::iterator X;" on a separate line, and it complains about that now
[14:29:54] <wjp|work> but it doesn't complain if I remove the declaration of X??
[14:32:01] <wjp|work> oh, it does, but not in this file :/
[14:33:30] <wjp|work> removing the --pedantic seems to work
[14:42:01] --- Fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|afk
[14:44:23] <wjp|work> ok, exult builds and runs :-)
[14:44:34] <wjp|work> and it even complains when I remove 'using std::cout;'
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[15:07:02] <wjp|work> I'm off; bye
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[15:07:09] <Colourless> cya
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[16:07:14] --- Topic for #exult is: * Colourless sets mode matt0 +stand_in_corner
[16:07:14] --- Topic for #exult set by wjp at Sat Jun 16 22:12:19 2001
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[16:24:49] <madmagi> has anyone gotten exult to work on Linux?
[16:25:37] <Colourless> work on linux?!? Exult was designed on Linux systems
[16:26:16] <madmagi> Colourlss - I keep getting errors when I try to run it with the path. I have verified it, but to no avail.
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[16:30:11] <Colourless> i'd like to help, but I don't use linux
[16:35:42] <madmagi> thanks anyhow - works fine on my Windoz box, but I really want it on my Linux Laptop
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