#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 20 Feb 2002 (GMT)

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[05:41:32] <sb-x> lo
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[08:32:53] * Darke bows, "Hello."
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[10:28:45] <sb-x> lo
[10:32:37] <Darke> Hello.
[10:33:17] <sb-x> How are you?
[10:35:14] <Darke> Slowly being driven out of my mind... oh, wait, sorry, that's already happened. Just generally good.
[10:36:26] <sb-x> I found something in exult's configure script that seems to be a "bad thing" but which may be my fault. I'm not sure.
[10:37:13] <sb-x> If I set prefix=/usr/local/stow/exult then configure shouldnt be trying to put exult icons and desktop links in my /opt/gnome/shared tree should it?
[10:41:24] <sb-x> I don't even use Gnome. :)
[10:41:35] <Darke> I think that's only the prefix directory for libraries, binaries and headers.
[10:42:10] * Darke seems to remember part of the 'default' autoconf macros sets that up.
[10:42:40] <sb-x> It's supposed to be the prefix directory for all the other directories (data too)
[10:43:09] <sb-x> Shouldn't the installation of an icon and desktop link be part of a package script?
[10:44:17] <Darke> No idea. <shrug>
[10:44:22] * sb-x rephrases... "If I'm only doing a local build, I don't like stuff being put anywhere with 'make install'. I would expect that if I was installing a package"
[10:44:56] <sb-x> Since Wumpus told me about Stow, I've been using that frequently. :)
[10:46:39] <Darke> <grin> Pretty much the same answer. No idea. It would make sense that the icons and desktop links be only installed if you have Gnome installed though. <grin>
[10:47:41] <sb-x> Well I have it installed, but I just don't use it. ;-)
[10:48:19] <sb-x> The problem would show up if I wanted to remove the installation after i've already deleted my build directory.
[10:48:30] <sb-x> I should just be able to rm -rf /usr/local/stow/exult
[10:49:48] <sb-x> Of course, in this case I would be leaving files behind after that.
[10:50:08] <Darke> Nah. That's why `make uninstall` was created for you know? <grin> Technically, I do think that what it's doing, is 'correct'. Whether it's the best solution or not, I don't know.
[10:50:18] <Darke> s/why/what/
[10:52:05] <sb-x> I can't make uninstall if my exult build dir is gone
[10:52:47] <sb-x> ?Date
[10:52:47] <exultbot> It is now Wed Feb 20 10:52:47 2002 (GMT).
[10:56:57] * Darke tends to keep his build dirs around, and even then if it's gone, you just untar/gz the original source and `./configure
[10:57:02] * Darke tends to keep his build dirs around, and even then if it's gone, you just untar/gz the original source and `./configure; make uninstall` and things clean up quickly.
[10:58:17] <sb-x> Obviously a matter of taste then. :)
[10:58:27] <Darke> Agreed. <grin>
[10:59:27] <WumpAway> hmm
[10:59:58] <sb-x> The simple solution would be to not install the icon and desktop link, and leave that for the package creation scripts(rpm, deb etc)
[11:00:38] <sb-x> But I guess it's not too bad, and since it's likely the way it is for a reason, I won't push my preference on anyone. :-)
[11:01:27] * sb-x is also too tired to make much sense, so please do not mind him if he sounds crazy. :P
[11:03:14] * WumpAway can't keep build dirs around on account of it taking almost all of my free space on /home ;-p
[11:03:23] * WumpAway boings
[11:03:25] --- WumpAway is now known as Wumpus
[11:04:14] <sb-x> Hi
[11:04:24] <Wumpus> `lo sb-x, darke :-)
[11:04:55] * Darke thinks he'd be able to understand sb-x easily then, since he knows he, himself is crazy.
[11:04:59] <Darke> Hi Wumpus.
[11:15:43] <Darke> sb-x: Here's one of my patiented Weird Links(tm), just for you. <grin> It's... surreal. http://www.matazone.co.uk/kitty1.html
[11:17:18] <Wumpus> huh? hmm
[11:17:20] * Wumpus kicks mozzila
[11:17:26] <Wumpus> i thought i fixored the shockwave plugin already
[11:17:59] <Wumpus> hmmmmmm
[11:18:34] * Darke upgraded Mozzila recently too, and had to reinstall that plugin.
[11:18:47] <Wumpus> do you have to do anything other than put it in the right directory?
[11:18:50] <Wumpus> IE .mozilla/plugins ?
[11:19:05] <Wumpus> (libflashplayer.so some class file)
[11:21:17] <sb-x> that page doesn't like me Darke
[11:21:20] <sb-x> hmm
[11:21:34] * sb-x bookmarks it for future visitation.
[11:22:36] <sb-x> I think I should sleep now.
[11:22:46] <Darke> Wumpus: Nope just drop it into your mozilla/plugins directory, IIRC you can type about:plugins into your browser to find out if it installed properly.
[11:22:50] <Darke> Night sb-x.
[11:23:15] <Wumpus> ahh... hmm,well i'm most of the way through re-grabbing the tarball anyway, so i can read the instructions
[11:23:29] * Darke _can't_ understand why anything, let along a webpage couldn't like sb-x.
[11:23:41] * sb-x gives Darke a carrot.
[11:23:46] <sb-x> i agree
[11:23:51] * Darke carrotnibbles.
[11:23:52] * Wumpus is almost the same, except s/couldn't/could/ ;-p
[11:24:19] * Darke grins.
[11:24:34] * sb-x collapses.
[11:24:38] <-- sb-x has left IRC ("ZZzzzZZzz...")
[11:28:20] <Wumpus> hmm
[11:28:48] * Wumpus ponders and thinks maybe .mozilla/plugins isn't the right place?
[11:29:43] <Darke> I installed mozilla in ~/mozilla, then copied the plugins into ~/mozilla/plugins.
[11:30:01] <Wumpus> oh well, i have mozilla in /usr/local/blah
[11:35:17] * Wumpus looks at darke sideways
[11:51:23] * Darke wonders why Wumpus is looking sideways at him.
[11:52:07] <Wumpus> these are weird :P
[11:52:10] <Wumpus> ... and slow :-(
[11:52:49] * Darke knows they are weird. <grin> He didn't notice them being slow though.
[11:53:18] <Darke> I did mention they were a little 'surreal' didn't I? *grin*
[11:53:46] <Wumpus> too damn warm :|
[11:54:00] <Wumpus> stupid summer
[11:54:39] * Darke complains about the summer along with Wumpus.
[12:59:38] * Wumpus complains about darke's complaints
[13:00:28] * Darke complains about Wumpus complaing about his complaining with Wumpus.
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[14:03:06] * Wumpus goes in search of sleep, g'night
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[14:43:02] <Colourless> hi
[15:07:08] * Darke unidles. "Hi."
[15:07:18] <Colourless> 'bout time
[15:07:38] * Darke grins.
[15:11:19] * laxdragon is back (gone 15:38:04)
[15:42:38] <Colourless> hmm, MAC on the forum is being a bit of a 'problem'
[15:43:51] * Darke was just about to say the same thing. Get out of my head. *grin*
[15:46:55] <Darke> Umm... MAC has only been a registered member of the forum for 5 days, yet has posted 47 posts, all of which are about combat. *blinkblink*
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[15:48:04] <Nadir> hya
[15:48:11] <Colourless> hi
[15:48:15] <Darke> Hi.
[15:48:16] <Nadir> we need a bugfix for MAC
[15:48:21] <Colourless> indeed
[15:48:52] <Nadir> I know I'm not the most diplomatic person in the world, but the reaction we're getting is a bit too much
[15:49:12] <Colourless> aye it is.
[15:50:14] <Darke> Putting things into context: For Microsoft, or any other big company that has a security related bug, it's 'common' curtosy to give them a 14 day 'analysis and fix' period before you release the security notice to the public. We didn't even get 4 days to 'fix' the problem before he blew up on us.
[15:50:14] <Colourless> nadir: really you haven't said anything wrong there. i would have said the same
[15:50:33] * Darke would have said the same thing too.
[15:53:34] <Nadir> I've replied... with the GPL
[15:54:27] <Colourless> good
[15:54:35] <Colourless> but i doubt it will do any good
[15:54:55] <Colourless> SHOULD THE
[15:54:55] <Colourless> PROGRAM PROVE DEFECTIVE, YOU ASSUME THE COST OF ALL NECESSARY SERVICING,
[15:54:55] <Colourless> REPAIR OR CORRECTION.
[15:55:00] <Colourless> :-)
[15:55:46] <Colourless> almost all free software has no warranty afaik
[15:56:37] * Darke _likes_ that particular section. <grin>
[15:57:09] * Darke wonders if we can recoup part of that million in development costs that way...
[15:57:22] <Darke> blah $3million that should be.
[15:57:52] <Colourless> heh, charge the end users for getting us to bug fix :-)
[15:58:56] * Darke is considering replying to that effect. <grin>
[16:01:02] * Nadir is listening to the Martian Dreams MIDIs
[16:01:05] <Darke> "Sure I'll fix combat! Since I'm touching code in exult that I've never touched or looked at before, (I don't even know where it is!), I'll be forced to charge a US$10,000 fee to fix these bugs, please contact me at the above email address and I'm sure we can come to a suitable arrangment." *grin*
[16:01:27] <Colourless> hehe
[16:02:37] <Nadir> I think we should make a version of Exult called Exult-for-MAC.zip which makes all monsters cause 10HP of damage everytime
[16:03:05] <Colourless> :-)
[16:03:25] * Darke snickers.
[16:07:02] <Colourless> i think that even if we did make exult's combat exactly the same as the originals, MAC would still complain
[16:07:30] <Darke> Agreed.
[16:07:40] <Colourless> the combat in the originals may have had a fairly complex model, but it was really just as crap as exult's combat
[16:07:44] <Nadir> how long would it realistically take to do the sliders thing
[16:07:54] <Colourless> a day
[16:08:36] <Colourless> modifying the gump would take the longest imo
[16:09:02] <Colourless> though, that probably wouldn't have anything to do with spells
[16:09:14] <Colourless> they are handeled a bit different afaik
[16:13:33] <Nadir> can we have sliders in a larger gump ?
[16:14:52] <Nadir> I never actually looked at it (although I should have for the RGB sliders...)
[16:15:01] <Colourless> hmmm, i don't think so
[16:15:45] <Nadir> Because you want three sliders in one gump and not three separate gumps
[16:16:01] <Colourless> yeah
[16:17:52] <Colourless> though, you could just use a series of buttons, not sliders for now
[16:18:23] <Colourless> it just depends on how many steps are used
[16:18:46] <Colourless> with buttons you'd generally have something like, very easy, easy, normal, hard, very hard
[16:19:05] <Colourless> it's pretty obvious what they would do
[16:20:06] <Nadir> MAC wants sliders and we're going to give him sliders
[16:21:24] <Darke> Let me guess, 'very easy' damage will start at monsters doing 10 points of damage to you, and it works up from there? <grin>
[16:21:26] <Nadir> hey we have a new Dominus and wjp replies to that thread
[16:21:46] <Colourless> yeah
[16:22:11] <Colourless> come on darke, you need to respond now. :-)
[16:22:23] <Darke> Just a sec. Nearly finished. <grin>
[16:25:11] <Darke> Done! <grin> I hope it lives up to your expectations. <innocentwiggle>
[16:28:46] * Colourless looks
[16:29:20] <Nadir> Darke: I replied to you
[16:29:49] * Darke giggles. Nice!
[16:30:00] <Colourless> 10000 is pretty cheap for writing a combat system for a game
[16:30:04] <Nadir> or maybe you prefer monetari
[16:30:17] <Colourless> filari?
[16:30:23] * Darke would actually prefer to have it make him a nice cup of coffee. <grin>
[16:30:32] * Colourless sees the reply
[16:30:50] <Colourless> ignore my "filari?" comment :-)
[16:31:06] * Darke giggles.
[16:32:28] <Colourless> yes, lets take over the thread and make it into a second comming of sparks ass. More stupid comments please :-)
[16:32:47] <Colourless> since it's us devs doing it so far, it's 'ok' :-)
[16:33:10] * Darke wonders if MAC will actually take it in good humour, or if he'll start flaming me... <grin> Either way, it'll be fun.
[16:33:34] <Darke> Colourless: Trying to abuse power again are we? *grin*
[16:34:06] <Colourless> no, i think you are thiking of algebraic number theory, which was in no way related to sparks ass
[16:35:44] <Nadir> forum stats: wjp: 152 posts, nadir 150 posts, darke 12 posts, colourless 98, dominus 51
[16:36:15] <Colourless> well if it weren't for me erasing algebraic number theory, i would have had more
[16:37:41] <Colourless> amazing, i haven't compiled exult in some time and there were no namespace problems. there was a forcing int to bool warning though :-)
[16:38:32] * Darke hasn't compiled it for a while either. So it's either impressive, or no-one is doing any 'major' changes. *grin*
[16:38:56] * Darke replied to That Thread(tm), with nothing fancy of course.
[16:38:56] <Colourless> well, jeff has been adding lots of code, normally problems turn up there
[16:39:24] <Nadir> spark's ass ? what's that ?
[16:39:26] <Nadir> :)
[16:39:53] <Darke> No, not _that_, That Thread(tm), the _other_ That Thread(tm). *grin*
[16:40:17] <Colourless> the 'new thread'
[16:41:59] <Darke> Thread *NewThatThread = ThatThread[1];
[16:42:23] <Colourless> no Thread *ThatThread = new Thread;
[16:43:16] <Colourless> or more specifically in the case of this forurm
[16:43:40] <Colourless> Thread *ThatThread = &allThreads[4408]
[16:43:46] <Colourless> ;
[16:43:59] <Darke> Agreed. <grin>
[16:46:20] <Colourless> if (ThatThread->get_foolishness_starter()->is_not_dev_team()) find_mod("Colourless Dragon")->set_mode(ThatThread, MOD_ABUSE_MODE, true);
[16:47:20] <Darke> I'm surprised that isn't automated in the phorum code already... *grin*
[16:48:47] <Colourless> :;-)
[16:48:50] <Colourless> hmmm
[16:48:53] <Colourless> :-)
[16:49:25] <Darke> A winking smile with the sunglasses pulled up so you can see his eyes. Nice!
[16:49:37] <Colourless> hehe
[16:49:42] * Darke is sorry. *grin*
[16:49:57] <Colourless> with me it would be more like my actual glasses, not sunnies
[16:50:36] <Darke> Me too. <grin> It'd need to be either dark black or mirrored shades, so you'd have an excuse to do that though.
[16:51:01] <Colourless> or i might just be wierd
[16:51:57] * Darke bites his tongue, "No! Nothing of the SORT!"
[17:11:01] <Nadir> bye
[17:11:04] <-- Nadir has left IRC ("Client Exiting")
[17:11:06] <Darke> Bye
[17:49:30] <Colourless> if nothing interesting occurs in the next 10 minutes, i will.... :-)
[17:58:14] <Darke> You'll occur? <grin>
[18:00:50] <Colourless> hmm, i don't know how to respond to that :-)
[18:02:06] <Darke> Good, because I don't know what ir _really_ means in the first place. But it is strangely funny though. *grin*
[18:02:18] <Colourless> aye
[18:04:31] * Darke is composing one last reply in that thread before he sleeps. *grin* I don't suppose you know how to word a specific reference to 'the bunny that turns into a female when you give it a carrot in SI' do you? That is if I'm remembering it properly.
[18:04:55] <Colourless> just a sec, i'll fire up si
[18:06:06] <Darke> Thanks. I figured I might as well throw a little surreality into things, although I'm still not sure how we'll it'll work. *grin* A name, if she has one would be good, or something similar.
[18:06:35] <Colourless> the rabbit itself is called Buggs
[18:06:43] <Colourless> :-)
[18:06:49] * Darke giggles.
[18:06:51] <Colourless> and it's a dangerous beast
[18:07:18] <Colourless> "a born preditor" of "royal lineage"
[18:07:28] * Darke tries to work out how to word this... <grin>
[18:07:48] <Colourless> at it will only eat off of a gold plate
[18:09:23] * Darke snerks. Such a picky bunny.
[18:13:54] * Darke posts and 'decides' to go to bed now. "Night!" *grin*
[18:14:00] <Colourless> cya
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