#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 22 Nov 2001 (GMT)

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[00:08:21] <-- SB-X has left IRC ("bbl")
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[05:16:07] <Blackbird> Hmmm... looks like everyone had the good sense to get to bed... maybe I should, too.
[05:16:36] <Blackbird> you there matt0?
[05:16:42] <Blackbird> Kreed?
[05:16:50] <Blackbird> exultbot?
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[08:28:15] <wjp> hi
[08:29:02] --- wjp is now known as wjp|work
[09:09:25] <matto> wjp!
[09:09:49] <matto> I have finished reading book 7 :)
[09:10:30] <matto> and I posted my two cents on alt.books.terry-goodkind
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[09:59:29] <matto> _Kreed_!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[11:03:08] --> Darke has joined #exult
[11:03:21] * Darke greetingsbows. "Hi all."
[11:05:50] * Darke opens up his portable hole and paws through it, removing a can of mat-black paint and a paintbrush, both of which he conceils between the cushions of the couch for later.
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[11:25:48] <matto> wjp|work!
[11:25:50] <matto> Darke!
[11:26:09] * matto flufflegreets Darke
[11:29:01] * Darke bowfluffs, "Greetings. I see you're cutting down on your exclamation mark usage. Running out are we?" <amusedfluff>
[11:30:41] * matto pounds Darke with a flurry of !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'s
[11:30:51] <matto> You'll find I have a bottomless resource of !'s
[11:33:22] * matto runs away from SharpTooth, the scary dinosaur in Land Before Time
[11:34:29] * Darke amusedfluffs, and sweeps the little pile of exclamation marks into his portable hole with his paw. Such a weird creature this 'matto'.
[11:36:19] * matto blows Darke's fluff off his body
[11:36:29] <matto> that should teach you to fluff yourself out like that
[11:36:39] <matto> my birds like to fluff themselves out too...
[11:37:07] * matto reads the topic
[11:37:09] <matto> bahahaha
[11:37:41] * Darke looks at matto even weirder he still appears to have fur on himself, it just looks a little cleaner. "You're weird." <fluff>
[11:38:50] * matto sneezes, as he is allergic to Darke's fluff
[11:39:09] * matto looks for something to wipe his runny nose on and spies Darke's nice fur coat .. hmmm
[11:39:15] * Darke starts sorting through his little collection of exclamation marks, discarding the ones that are substandard.
[11:39:44] * matto bids Darke a "good day" and passes out, unconscious
[11:40:47] * Darke paws over to the sink and fills a bucket with water, then returns and dumps it on matto's head, looking down at him. "Feeling better?" <smile>
[11:59:58] * Darke hops over to his portable hole and removes a notebook computer. He then hops over to the couch and sits crosslegged upon it and rests the notebook on his lap, staring intently at the screen.
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[13:22:29] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[13:22:44] * Darke bows. "Greetings."
[13:22:52] <Nadir> hi
[13:23:00] <Nadir> s/Darke/SharpTooth/ ?
[13:23:16] * Darke nods and smiles. "Yet another character."
[13:23:55] * Darke doublechecks 'about us' and notes it hasn't been modified yet. <grin>
[13:27:01] <Nadir> :)
[13:27:11] <Nadir> have you read my proposed addition to README ?
[13:27:55] * Darke nods and grins. "Perfect!"
[13:28:47] <Darke> I especially liked this line: "Remember: Exult runs on many platforms, not just yours."
[13:31:47] <Nadir> :)
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[13:35:29] <Rlyeh> hi all
[13:35:46] * Darke bows. "Hello."
[13:36:33] <Rlyeh> what's the topic ?
[13:36:35] <Nadir> hi
[13:36:44] <Rlyeh> anyone from exult team here ?
[13:36:47] <Nadir> yep
[13:37:01] <Rlyeh> I bow deeeeeeply
[13:37:03] <Darke> exult normally. <grin> And yes there is at least one dev here.
[13:37:41] <Nadir> you can tell if someone is a member of the Exult Team if he has ops
[13:37:47] <Nadir> (there are notable exceptions :)
[13:37:52] <Rlyeh> ok
[13:38:12] * Darke looks unimportant.
[13:38:15] <Rlyeh> So ye are nearing the beta ?
[13:38:24] <Nadir> yes
[13:38:38] <Nadir> Jeff wants to wait a couple of days
[13:38:42] <Darke> It's scheduled for Real Soon Now(tm).
[13:39:18] <Rlyeh> and the Avatar will walk in Britannia again(tm)
[13:40:15] <Rlyeh> I wonder if the sound files will be included in exult ?
[13:40:17] <Nadir> no
[13:40:28] <Nadir> they will always be a separate download
[13:40:32] <Rlyeh> ok
[13:40:47] <Nadir> (as they are quite large)
[13:41:00] <Nadir> (and you only need to download them once)
[13:41:25] <Rlyeh> true... but you should make the file installation easier.
[13:41:43] <Nadir> or we should make our users smarter
[13:42:03] * Darke paws Nadir a couple of spare pairs of braces and throws in half-a-dozen of matto's 'used' exclamation marks.
[13:42:06] <Rlyeh> it's easy for us, but I had many people who asked me to help them to make the soundfile work
[13:42:39] <Rlyeh> ...as they didn't understand english very well (french here)
[13:42:59] <Nadir> we were planning on implementing a cross-platform file-selector to use within Exult to configure paths, but we never got round to it
[13:43:17] <Darke> The other problem with the sounds is also from a 'legality' point of view.
[13:44:05] <Rlyeh> anyway EA won't be pleased with exult. With or without soundfiles.
[13:45:06] <Rlyeh> as long as they don't earn money with someone else's work, they aren't pleased...
[13:45:37] <Darke> <shrug> They can probably hit us for violoating their copyright on the sounds, but they can't 'legally' complain about our reverse engineering. It's possible they will though.
[13:47:47] <Rlyeh> I don't know... Maybe they wait for you to make the final release, then they will download it for free and SELL it along with the game... hmmm maybe they won't be smart enough to do that, and just will complain about it... Legally I don't know if they can do something.
[13:49:51] <Darke> Not likely. They wouldn't make enough money from it to repackage exult+u7+si and sell it seperately. If they got sufficient clue and tried it with some sort of pay-for-web-download thing they might. But even then the market would be tiny.
[13:51:43] <Rlyeh> maybe... maybe not. It depends of the package... Imagine a complete "The Ultimate Ultima" package among U1-U9, and with all the updated versions of Ultima... I think that would sell.
[13:52:04] <Rlyeh> a few collector objects in it...
[13:54:04] <Rlyeh> well I have to go... if one day you need a french website to distribute Exult, or to translate it you can contact me. I have a french CRPG dedicated website : http://dagon.jeuxderoles.com
[13:54:32] <Rlyeh> continue the good work...
[13:54:45] <Darke> <nod> But you're still targeting a 'niche' market from their point of view. From what I've seen the big companies don't sell it unless they're 'sure' they will get 100k+ sales out of it. They're looking for the "1 Million copies sold!" sticker rather then anything else.
[13:54:56] * Darke bows. "Good bye."
[13:55:25] <Rlyeh> *bye
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[13:58:24] <Colourless> hi
[13:58:31] <Darke> Hi.
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[14:08:59] <Nadir> hi colourless !
[14:09:11] <Colourless> hi
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[14:14:22] <Darke> Hello.
[14:14:25] <Dominus> hi
[14:14:41] <Dominus> hey we still have the topic set by you :-)
[14:14:57] <Colourless> hi
[14:15:22] <Dominus> matto|wookin & matto: I got an email last night from Amazon that they shipped my copy of SoT!!!! Yeah
[14:15:29] <Darke> Apparently. <grin> I'm just waiting for someone to think of something more creative to replace it with.
[14:15:32] <Colourless> probably a record for the amount of time a topic has been kept. openprojects.net usually has a split and wipes the title
[14:15:37] <Nadir> hi
[14:16:09] <Dominus> Nadir: what do you think of including a "Start a new game" on the beta readme?
[14:16:09] <Darke> Colourless: They must have fixed that
[14:16:20] <Darke> Colourless: They must have fixed that bug, we've had three netsplits so far tonight.
[14:16:34] <Nadir> Dominus: check your inbox
[14:16:48] <Dominus> :-)
[14:17:50] <Dominus> Nadir: good writing
[14:17:59] <Colourless> yeah, it's good
[14:18:15] <Dominus> has a good ring to it
[14:19:53] <Dominus> if you don't suddenly release today/tonight, I will change the FAQ as well to reflect the new version and the zlib inclusion tomorrow morning.
[14:20:16] <Dominus> the version will be 0.99.0 beta1?
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[14:21:33] <Colourless> no, I think just keep incrementing the numbers we have noe
[14:21:34] <Colourless> w
[14:21:55] <Colourless> we were at 0.94 Alpha 5 were we not?
[14:22:10] <Dominus> yep
[14:22:46] <Colourless> therefore just go to 0.95 Beta 1
[14:23:30] <Colourless> that is just my opinion
[14:24:39] <Dominus> ok, with me anyway. I think we just had to clarify this before. wjp mentioned yesterday that another "roadmap" would have been now the 0.99.0 beta1...
[14:25:56] <Colourless> i think that 0.99 should be for the 'Final' Beta... i.e. pretty much no bugs left
[14:26:50] <Dominus> hmm, with the speed we release this version will probably be 0.97 if not 0.96 :-)
[14:27:32] <Colourless> well didn't we go from 0.40 to 0.90 in 1 release? :-)
[14:27:51] <Dominus> true :-)
[14:38:45] * Darke wonder if ucc supports goto's and labels. He can't remember. Time to check the code I suppose.
[14:40:50] <Nadir> I think 0.99.x releases should be used for release candidates
[14:41:22] <Dominus> okey dokey, I'm off now !!! see you tomorrow then
[14:41:26] <-- Dominus has left IRC ("got to play Exult now")
[14:42:16] * Nadir tries "make dist"
[14:44:20] * Darke hmms, it doesn't look like ucc supports goto's at the moment.
[14:54:54] <-- wjp|work has left IRC ("[x]chat")
[15:07:56] * Darke pads over and quickly paints Colourless' feet and hands a nice, semitranparent matt-black, whilst he's not paying any attention at all, then returns to his seat and laptop.
[15:08:18] <Colourless> oi!
[15:08:30] * Darke earperks and looks innocent.
[15:08:43] <Colourless> hmmm
[15:09:06] * Darke continues to look innocent and look like he's actually doing something.
[15:16:04] <Nadir> ouch.
[15:16:15] <Nadir> I'm getting "aborted" from expack during build
[15:17:21] <Nadir> fixed
[15:17:39] <Darke> <grin> At least it was an easy fix.
[15:17:47] <Colourless> what was it?
[15:18:44] <Nadir> data/Makefile.am didn't include sfx_icon.shp, so in the "make dist"ed tar.gz it was missing
[15:19:02] <Nadir> if that makes sense
[15:19:32] * Darke quickly runs a stripe of paint down Colourless' dragon tail whilst Nadir is distracting him.
[15:19:57] <Colourless> grrr
[15:20:11] <Nadir> what colour was the paint ?
[15:20:14] * Darke continues to persist in looking innocent.
[15:20:35] <Darke> Nadir: Semitransparent matt-black.
[15:21:10] <Nadir> shouldn't that be "matte"
[15:21:32] * Darke considers that Colourless can't _really_ complain. I mean it's not as if he's painting him a 'colour' or anything.
[15:21:42] <Darke> Nadir: Possibly. I can't remember the exact spelling. <grin>
[15:22:21] <Darke> Nadir: Both are correct according to my dictionaries.
[15:22:32] <Colourless> yeah.
[15:28:45] * Darke wonders just how well paint would stick to a dragon made out of semi-transparent crystal anyway...
[15:30:37] <Nadir> Colourless: do you diffract light ?
[15:32:22] <Colourless> hmm
[15:32:27] <Darke> One would think so, it just depends upon the refraction index of the crystal he's made up of.
[15:32:47] <Darke> And of course how transparent he is.
[15:33:44] <Darke> Colourless: And for that matter do you have wings? Or are you one of those wingless oriental dragons?
[15:34:34] <Colourless> i am a real dragon :-)
[15:34:58] <Darke> Colourless: Define 'real' in the context of 'imaginary'. <fangygrin>
[15:35:32] <Colourless> :-)
[15:36:32] * Darke hops up and pulls out Colourless' wing and attempts to look through it, failing to. "He's rather opaque as well. A smoky quartz dragon?" <grin>
[15:38:30] * Darke considers the design of a Super Soaker(tm) filled with paint, then discard the thought. The paint would have to be rather runny for it to work, and it wouldn't stick properly. Especially not to crystal.
[15:41:25] * Nadir thinks that Darke should put Colourless' wing back into its place
[15:42:20] * Darke thinks it should automatically return to it's place without his help. <grin>
[15:42:33] <Colourless> :-)
[15:42:59] <Darke> After all, it's got to extend when he flies, so it shouldn't be broken or anything.
[15:43:22] <Nadir> http://exult.sourceforge.net/about.php
[15:44:27] <Darke> Nadir: It's still missing another couple of characters. <innocentwiggle> But since they are does they aren't likely to wander in here.
[15:44:44] <Nadir> "does"?
[15:44:52] <Darke> Female rabbits. <grin>
[15:45:05] <Colourless> ah
[15:45:21] * Darke and SharpTooth are 'bucks', Male rabbits.
[15:45:37] <Nadir> Colourless: you were wondering too ?
[15:46:26] <Nadir> http://savannah.gnu.org/
[15:46:30] <Darke> Admittedly they could also be refering to deer among other animals who have the same male/female names, but anyway...
[15:47:27] <Colourless> yeah I was
[15:47:50] <Darke> Nadir: <nod> The open source 'version' of sourceforge. <grin> It looks strangely familiar.
[15:48:05] <Colourless> yeah it does :-)
[15:48:51] <Nadir> is that what Jeff was referring to when he said "moving to GNU" ?
[15:49:11] <Colourless> i believe so
[15:49:15] <Darke> I'm guessing so.
[15:49:52] <Nadir> :)
[15:50:50] * Darke considers the levitating gnu logo to be a 'nice' touch. <grin>
[16:03:51] <Darke> Nadir: Ok, so we've got one 5foot 7inch black, anthro-form, bunny-rabbit in a kilt, and one crystaline dragon humanoid that looks to be about 6 and a half feet tall. Just what do _you_ look like? <grin> A mundane human? Or something more 'interesting'?
[16:06:48] <Nadir> I am below the horizon, so you can't really see me
[16:10:43] * Darke lifts up a rug and opens a trapdoor, then shouts into the darkness. "Hello down there? Nadir can you hear me?"
[16:13:10] <Nadir> yep
[16:14:30] * Darke leaves the trapdoor open so he can hear Nadir clearer, and wonders why Nadir persists in existing in such an odd position. <grin>
[16:14:51] * Darke also wonders if his writer has gone completely loopy.
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[16:26:31] <wjp> hi
[16:26:38] <Colourless> hi
[16:26:40] * Darke bows. "Hello!"
[16:26:47] <Nadir> hi
[16:27:21] * Darke is rather impressed, he might actually have this decompiler 'working' by the time Jeff has updated the compiler.
[16:27:53] <Nadir> :)
[16:28:07] <Nadir> does it decompile to Jeff's script ?
[16:28:41] <Darke> I'm getting there at the moment. <grin> I need to do a bit of hacking on the output format code and adding the 'description' of the output format to Docs/opcodes.txt.
[16:29:07] <Nadir> good. A BNF description of the grammar would be nice
[16:30:29] <Darke> Just read the .yy file for it, if you want something that looks like BNF grammar. <grin> I'll want the grammar to be set more in stone before I start doing some 'real' documentation on it.
[16:32:07] <Darke> As a random bit of information. <grin> If you actually look at the code, you'll find that the information about the binary usecode format is duplicated 3 times. Once in exult, once in ucc, and once in ucxt. Then there is another 'duplication' in Docs/opcodes.txt.
[16:33:09] <Nadir> A nice thing to integrate in ExultStudio would be an ExultScript (or whatever we want to call it) editor with syntax highlighting (using http://www.scintilla.org) and a gui decompiler.
[16:33:15] <Darke> I'm currently in the process of shuffling most of the knowledge out of ucxt and into datafiles, so I can actually fiddle with it easily.
[16:33:40] <Nadir> So one can choose a usecode function, decompile it and quickly see it with nice syntax colouring
[16:34:01] <wjp> just write an emacs mode for it :-)
[16:34:08] --- wjp is now known as wjp|dinner
[16:34:09] <wjp|dinner> bbl
[16:34:47] <Darke> Nadir: <nod> I'm trying to get the code to present one interface to the outside world, so it would be easier to integrate it with that. <grin> Throwing ostreams here and there and everywhere is rather... 'fun'.
[16:36:05] <Nadir> yes
[16:36:21] <Nadir> Colourless: have you done any work on that "scripting language for intros and endgames" ?
[16:47:21] <Colourless> no, not in a while
[16:48:16] * Colourless looks at what he has done
[16:48:20] <Colourless> gee, it's been over a month
[16:53:28] --- wjp|dinner is now known as wjp
[16:53:51] <Nadir> wb
[16:54:12] <wjp> thx
[17:23:14] <Nadir> Colourless: does it do anything ?
[17:24:09] <Colourless> no, only specs
[17:24:17] <Colourless> no code written for it
[17:31:09] <Colourless> opps
[17:31:10] <Colourless> Exult.exe - 700 error(s), 37 warning(s)
[17:31:43] <Darke> <bow> Must disappear, sleep to attend to, Good night (or day, depending upon your timezone and perception of reality) all. <grin> Bye-the-bye, I'll add a particularly unhelpful, "Perhaps we should extend usecode to handle it", suggestion to the intro scripting language discussion.
[17:32:45] <Darke> Colourless: Bad dragon. No maiden for you tonight to eat. <grin>
[17:33:00] <Colourless> :-)
[17:33:08] <Colourless> even better:
[17:33:08] <Colourless> Exult.exe - 806 error(s), 63 warning(s)
[17:34:06] * Darke rereads what he just typed and sighs as notices a completely different meaning from what he intended.
[17:34:24] <Darke> Colourless: Go! Fix! Now! <shoofluff>
[17:37:45] * Darke bows and disappears in a puff of logic.
[17:39:41] <Nadir> i'm off too. bye
[17:39:57] <-- Nadir has left IRC ("Client Exiting")
[17:44:35] <Colourless> ooh:
[17:44:36] <Colourless> Exult.exe - 1252 error(s), 1 warning(s)
[17:45:02] <wjp> well, at least you almost got rid of the warnings :-)
[17:46:41] <Colourless> how about this?
[17:46:42] <Colourless> Exult.exe - 0 error(s), 0 warning(s)
[17:47:39] <wjp> much better :-)
[17:58:22] <_Kreed_> 0 errors(s), 0 warning(s), 2352 bug(s)
[18:01:53] <wjp> :-)
[19:59:27] <matto> _Kreed_: hehe
[20:48:57] <-- matto has left IRC ("Play Dragon's Lair in linux - http://www.daphne-emu.com - Developers welcome :)")
[21:21:04] <wjp> hmm, someone else that wants to translate a game
[21:21:17] <wjp> I wonder why that's suddenly so popular :-)
[21:21:49] <Colourless> :-)
[21:25:25] <Colourless> Seen the "This may sound a bit lazy but..." thread? :-)
[21:25:42] <wjp> yeah, I did :-)
[21:25:48] <Colourless> i'm not sure exactly how to answer that one :-)
[21:27:46] <wjp> hmm... let's see
[21:28:05] <Colourless> i have an idea...
[21:28:44] <Colourless> something about travelling back in time so I could impliment the feature so it will function in the current version of exult :-)
[21:28:52] <wjp> lol
[21:29:03] <wjp> that would work :-)
[21:33:39] <Colourless> replied :-)
[21:34:40] <wjp> hehe, nice :-)
[21:51:00] <wjp> I should go
[21:51:03] <wjp> night
[21:51:13] <-- wjp has left IRC ("[x]chat")
[21:52:13] <Colourless> no point staying around really
[21:52:16] <-- Colourless has left IRC ("why")