#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 24 Sep 2003 (GMT)

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[00:49:06] <servus> http://allsoft.scei.co.jp/jacket/l/slps00742b.jpg Ultima Underworld the playstation... Sure looks... different :P
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[13:06:54] <Zxcvb_> does exult fix the magic carpet over the isle of the avatar bug?
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[19:45:16] <wjp> hi
[19:45:17] <Dominus> hey ho
[19:46:00] <Dominus> so how about a release really soon?
[19:46:13] <wjp> yes, please :-)
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[19:54:50] <_marcel_> hi
[19:55:10] <_marcel_> does anyone here happen to know a good IRC channel on CAS ?
[19:55:20] <_marcel_> computer algebra systems, like mathematica or maple
[19:57:33] <wjp> hi
[19:57:39] <wjp> what an interesting question to ask here :-)
[19:57:56] <wjp> no, I don't
[19:58:34] <_marcel_> sorry, to ask it here
[19:58:51] <_marcel_> but I found a web log of this channel where mathematica was discussed
[19:58:59] <wjp> hm, quite possible :-)
[19:59:00] <_marcel_> or at least the word mathematica hit
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[19:59:16] <wjp> we have talked about a lot in here :-)
[19:59:24] <_marcel_> I have no clue whatsoever about the meaning of exult
[19:59:53] <wjp> it's a game engine to play Ultima 7 with (~10 year old RPG by Origin)
[20:00:33] <_marcel_> ah
[20:00:37] <_marcel_> game engine
[20:00:39] <_marcel_> sounds fun
[20:00:50] <_marcel_> but uhm
[20:01:13] <_marcel_> Ultima 7... that already has a game engine by itself, hasn't it ?
[20:01:29] <Dominus> but can't be played easily on all modern OS'
[20:01:49] <_marcel_> oh
[20:01:56] <wjp> exult runs on a lot of platforms, including linux, mac osx
[20:01:59] <_marcel_> so you wrote your own engine
[20:02:03] <wjp> yes
[20:02:11] <_marcel_> and use the content of the original game
[20:02:14] <wjp> yes
[20:02:17] <Dominus> exactly
[20:02:19] <_marcel_> ok
[20:02:34] <_marcel_> I usually do the same
[20:02:38] <_marcel_> write my own engine
[20:02:49] <_marcel_> and 'borrow' the content of other games
[20:03:09] <_marcel_> beit with a less generous goal
[20:03:18] <_marcel_> generous isn't quite the right word
[20:03:32] <_marcel_> do you have screenshots ?
[20:03:48] <wjp> they're on our homepage (url is in the topic)
[20:03:58] <Dominus> http://exult.sourceforge.net/screenshots.php
[20:04:51] <_marcel_> oh, sorry, this is bitchx, which means, topic is lost after about 24 lines
[20:05:09] <wjp> "/topic" or "/topic #exult" should show it, IIRC
[20:05:22] <_marcel_> yeah yeah, I know irc
[20:05:45] <_marcel_> but it isn't intuitive to /topic when I ask such a question, is it ?
[20:05:49] <wjp> true :-)
[20:06:22] <_marcel_> hey that looks cool man
[20:06:40] <Dominus> he he
[20:06:57] <Dominus> it doesn't only look cool, it is cool :-)
[20:07:18] <_marcel_> lol
[20:07:35] <_marcel_> is it a large engine ?
[20:07:43] <_marcel_> in code ?
[20:07:47] <Dominus> yes
[20:08:03] <_marcel_> oh
[20:08:12] <wjp> about 150K lines of code
[20:08:15] <_marcel_> so no chance to port it to PDAs or smart phones
[20:08:26] <wjp> well, it runs on the Sharp Zaurus
[20:08:39] <_marcel_> is that a PDA ?
[20:08:41] <Dominus> the original data is already too much for a smart phone, I suspect
[20:08:51] <Dominus> yes a linux based pda
[20:09:18] <wjp> there are some issues with porting it to the wince/pocketpc platform (bad C++ support, IIRC)
[20:09:26] <_marcel_> those scanline gfx screenshots remind me of my good old amiga
[20:09:43] <_marcel_> do you know amiga ?
[20:10:08] <Dominus> btw, exult runs on Amiga as well
[20:10:19] <_marcel_> cool
[20:10:29] <_marcel_> and multiplayer/online as well ?
[20:10:35] <Dominus> nope
[20:10:50] <wjp> strictly single player
[20:10:54] <_marcel_> ah
[20:10:58] <_marcel_> that's too bad
[20:11:10] <_marcel_> I guess making it multi player would completely change the game
[20:11:23] <wjp> yeah
[20:11:26] <Dominus> this was discussed at length a couple of times and the verdict is that although it is a nice idea at first glance it isn't very usefull in the long run
[20:13:09] <_marcel_> I don't know the game itself, so I guess you are right
[20:13:42] <wjp> it's very plot-based
[20:13:49] <wjp> or plot-oriented I should say
[20:15:36] <_marcel_> wjp: that's why I said, it'd probably change the whole game
[20:15:56] <_marcel_> it would more or less end up being a new game but with the gfx and content of ultima 7
[20:16:03] * wjp nods
[20:17:53] <_marcel_> -sigh- this mathematica is so frustrating
[20:18:06] <_marcel_> the documentation is horrible, and the system is very counter intuitive
[20:18:42] <wjp> I never used mathematica, I'm afraid... We use maple and matlab at the uni
[20:19:00] <wjp> (and various other less general purpose tools)
[20:19:17] <_marcel_> matlab is ok
[20:19:30] <_marcel_> maple is horrible as well
[20:20:03] <_marcel_> that's because maple/mathematica are programs written by and written for mathematicians
[20:20:18] <_marcel_> I think those people have an odd way of doing things
[20:21:01] * _marcel_ is a student in CS
[20:21:21] <wjp> careful, I'm one of "those people" ;-)
[20:21:54] <wjp> (mathematics student, that is)
[20:23:36] <wjp> what do you need to do in mathematica, btw?
[20:25:18] * wjp kicks his ISP's "new" homepage... "To view this site optimally you need Macromedia Flash 5"... "optimally"... I wonder if that actually makes some of these links work...
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[20:50:11] <_marcel_> wjp: do you know how I can construct a list with a for loop in mathematica
[20:50:21] <_marcel_> I have something like:
[20:50:28] <_marcel_> Clear[list1]
[20:50:43] <_marcel_> list1 ={}
[20:51:35] <_marcel_> For[i=0,i<=10,i=i+1, Append[list1,i]]
[20:51:43] <_marcel_> when I then print list1
[20:51:46] <_marcel_> it is still empty
[20:51:49] <_marcel_> :(
[20:54:22] <wjp> append doesn't change list1, but returns a new list
[20:54:47] <wjp> so I guess you'd have to say "list1 = Append[list1,i]"
[20:55:23] <_marcel_> see
[20:55:27] <_marcel_> and this is what you get
[20:55:40] <_marcel_> when a mathematician writes such a documentation
[20:56:00] <_marcel_> the synopsis of the function doesn't state the return type
[20:56:15] <_marcel_> usually return type void would hint that it is an operation on the given list
[20:56:30] <_marcel_> and return type list would hint that it is returning a new list
[20:56:32] <_marcel_> horrible
[20:57:06] <wjp> no return types in the docs? that's annoying
[20:58:34] <wjp> I hope it's implemented efficiently internally... list1=append[list1,i] sounds like it could be quite inefficient
[21:04:54] <_marcel_> they should distinguish between operations and non-operations
[21:05:09] <_marcel_> operations do not return, but operate on their arguments
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