#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 27 Jul 2001 (GMT)

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[08:02:23] --> exultbot has joined #exult
[08:15:27] <Kirben> Hi wjp
[08:16:14] <Kirben> Could you add 2 files to cvs ?
[08:29:28] <wjp> sure
[08:29:32] --- wjp is now known as wjp|work
[08:32:04] <Kirben> dcc now ?
[08:32:13] <Kirben> or later ?
[08:32:29] <wjp|work> now?
[08:33:44] <Kirben> I sent them to mailing list too but my ISP is delaying email for hours at moment.
[08:34:00] <sty_work> hi wjp
[08:34:05] <wjp|work> hi
[08:34:12] <Kirben> both are just updated for latest mingw release
[08:34:42] <Kirben> mingw is once again ahead of cygwin, so I now compile using native mingw.
[08:34:59] <matt0> yeah.. mingw rules!
[08:35:18] <matt0> you know it.. I know it... even Yellow Dog knows it
[08:35:49] <wjp|work> ok, committed. thanks
[08:35:55] <Kirben> mingw is good but development of windows side is slow at times.
[08:36:02] <Kirben> Thanks
[08:36:24] <sty_work> did they add MAKE utility in mingw this time ? :DDD
[08:36:30] <Kirben> yes
[08:36:35] <sty_work> ooh, that rox
[08:36:48] <Kirben> That was the reason I waited to update compile guide.
[08:37:14] <Kirben> http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/mingw/Mingw-1.0.1-20010726.tar.gz
[08:37:44] <Kirben> just released today, includes new mingw/win32api packages that were released today too.
[08:38:02] <sty_work> wow
[08:38:59] <Kirben> BTW if you want to use it under Cygwin bash, add something like /cygdrive/c/mingw/bin: to path of profile when you use it.
[08:40:21] <sty_work> have to reboot
[08:40:37] <-- sty_work has left IRC (rebooting...ō)
[09:37:19] --> fingolfin has joined #exult
[09:37:21] <fingolfin> BOO
[09:37:37] <fingolfin> wtf, how did Kirben get that op status? He will take over power now!
[09:38:02] <wjp|work> :-)
[09:38:03] <wjp|work> hi
[09:38:04] --- fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|very_later_breakfast
[09:38:15] <Kirben> joke ??
[09:39:50] <wjp|work> I would think so, yes :-)
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[10:02:23] <wjp|work> hi
[10:02:25] <Nadir> hi
[10:02:29] <Kirben> Hi Nadir
[10:03:13] <Nadir> I've had another good idea for SourceForge Island. A house infested with critters (bugs) and a weapon that DrCode gives you to kill them (the BugSlayer)
[10:03:27] <wjp|work> hehe :-)
[10:11:18] --- Fingolfin|very_later_breakfast is now known as Fingolfin
[10:11:24] <Fingolfin> hi folks
[10:11:32] <Fingolfin> <g>
[10:11:34] <Fingolfin> nice idea ;)
[10:13:13] <Kirben> Fingolfin: Would it be possible for site to date the snapshots file ? by reading the time/date from directory ?
[10:13:40] <Nadir> Kir:I'm sure it is
[10:13:40] <wjp|work> Nadir: I just fixed the 'phorum forgets security settings' bug
[10:13:41] <Fingolfin> yeah
[10:13:57] <Fingolfin> a bit more work implementation wise, but no big deal ;)
[10:14:29] <Nadir> wjp|work: good
[10:14:45] <Fingolfin> in fact, is should be possible to also calculate file sizes for local files if that is desired
[10:14:55] <Nadir> php rulez
[10:16:29] <Kirben> That would be cool, would not need to update the page at all, only files :)
[10:17:06] <Fingolfin> aye ;)
[10:17:16] <Fingolfin> give me a bit time, though ;)
[10:17:24] <Kirben> no rush
[10:17:37] <Fingolfin> Kirben: that is, if you want you can already upload the files ;)
[10:18:09] <Fingolfin> I need to store the file descs in a little DB... since I never used any SQL db from PHP so far, I will use a text file for now;
[10:18:21] <Fingolfin> something like every line contains a filename, tab, description
[10:18:34] <Fingolfin> then I iterate over all lines, and use a template to print it out
[10:33:53] <Kirben> hmm is this ok scp exult.zip kirben@sourceforge.net:/home/groups/e/ex/exult/htdocs/snapshots ?
[10:34:11] <Kirben> I keep getting connection refused
[10:34:27] <Nadir> kirben@shell.sourceforge.net
[10:34:34] <Kirben> ok
[10:35:12] <Kirben> working now :)
[10:40:58] <Fingolfin> good
[10:41:03] --- Fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|afk
[10:48:33] <Kirben> ok old page is now online at http://exult.sourceforge.net/snapshots/
[10:49:53] <Fingolfin|afk> good, and I still have your "reference page"
[10:49:58] --- Fingolfin|afk is now known as Fingolfin
[11:06:29] <Kirben> ok integrated new design slighty, does http://exult.sourceforge.net/snapshots/ look ok ?
[11:07:16] <Kirben> What color do you use for warnings ? red looks too bright now.
[11:09:40] <Fingolfin> mom
[11:11:10] <Fingolfin> well, I thought we wanted to put the download links for the snapshots on the download page?
[11:11:58] <Kirben> Yes this is just for the meantime.
[11:14:10] <Kirben> I just could not just leave that old page, it looked too out of place next to your good designs.
[11:18:01] <Kirben> ok reduced it to only files now too.
[11:18:33] <Kirben> Do you think there is any need to leave my email on there ?
[11:19:02] <Nadir> no, better tell them to use the usual bug/discussion stuff
[11:19:41] <Kirben> ok one last question, shoild I leave the links to sound sets or remove them ?
[11:20:06] <Nadir> Those should belong to the standard download page, as they are in SF's download area
[11:20:16] <Fingolfin> well
[11:20:19] <Fingolfin> yeah
[11:20:30] <Fingolfin> I am working on using 4 sections:
[11:20:47] <Fingolfin> official apps, snapshots, data files, libraries
[11:20:49] <Fingolfin> or so
[11:20:53] <Kirben> the only problem is there is no other link to them at the moment...
[11:21:05] <Fingolfin> yeah, so I should add it to the download page
[11:21:26] <Fingolfin> see the progress at http://fingolfin.dnsalias.net/~maxhorn/exult
[11:21:38] <Fingolfin> in fact, you wonīt see much difference ATM ;)
[11:21:42] <Fingolfin> the difference is in the core
[11:22:16] <Fingolfin> add_snapshot("foo.bar", "Cool test file"); - this single line adds file foo.bar, with description "Cool test file", and also sets mod-date und filesize
[11:22:51] <Fingolfin> anybody now how to specify truncation in PHP? ;) Iīd like to display 1.4 instead of 1.428 KB ;)
[11:23:05] <Kirben> cool, the links look a bit fatter though on new site.
[11:23:26] <Fingolfin> hu? looks equal to me
[11:23:42] <Kirben> want screenshot ?
[11:24:27] <Kirben> I mean the links section under exult logo.
[11:24:28] <Fingolfin> yeah (I do believe you, it is just I canīt see it here)
[11:24:32] <Fingolfin> oh wait
[11:24:38] <Fingolfin> hm
[11:24:39] <Fingolfin> yeah
[11:24:42] <Fingolfin> true
[11:24:54] <Fingolfin> that is cause I changed it locally ;) experimenting
[11:25:11] <Fingolfin> what is better? small or big?
[11:25:34] <Kirben> are they currently in bold ?
[11:25:46] <Fingolfin> hm, donīt think so, wait a moment..
[11:26:04] <Kirben> if so maybe big and no bold.
[11:26:18] <Fingolfin> no bold, ATM, will try that on fingolfin.dnsalias.net
[11:26:37] <Fingolfin> check it now
[11:27:19] <Kirben> That is better
[11:27:59] <wjp|work> Fingolfin: re. number formatting: php has a printf() function
[11:28:33] <wjp|work> I'm going home; bye
[11:28:35] <-- wjp|work has left IRC ([x]chat)
[11:28:58] <Fingolfin> omg! look at the counter!
[11:29:01] <Fingolfin> what happend there?!?!?!?
[11:29:48] <Kirben> seems a bit low
[11:30:06] <Kirben> was it reset ?
[11:30:23] <Fingolfin> well, yesterday I reseted them by accident, but I then proceeded to fix it.. hrm
[11:30:27] <Fingolfin> strange
[11:30:49] <Kirben> looks ok here on both sites.
[11:32:30] <Fingolfin> ok, counter numbers are back to normal, I hope...
[11:32:33] <Fingolfin> but why did this happen...
[11:32:41] <Fingolfin> I hope nobody overwrote those files by accident.. ;)
[11:32:49] <Fingolfin> in fact, maybe I should move īem
[11:34:46] <Kirben> BTW the Download page. link at bottom of news page is broken...
[11:36:29] <Fingolfin> Kirben: thanx, will fix that
[11:37:11] <Kirben> redirect is up at old site, please update the snapshots link at exult.
[11:38:51] <Kirben> same goes for faq links on news page, broken too.
[11:38:58] <Fingolfin> yeah
[11:39:06] <Fingolfin> there are many broken links I just see, I fix those now
[11:44:03] <Fingolfin> what about SDL-1.2.2.zip?
[11:48:31] <Kirben> put in on download system I guess
[11:49:18] <Kirben> or are you refering to broken link I just fixed ?
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[11:50:53] <Fingolfin> wb
[11:51:18] <Fingolfin> Kirben: I mean there was this file; and I wanted to know if I should put it on the download page, but...
[11:51:30] <Fingolfin> Kirben: why? I mean, isnīt it available form libsdl.org?
[11:51:48] <Kirben> no this is custom version for exult's makefile
[11:52:09] <Fingolfin> hm... what is custom about it?
[11:52:18] <Kirben> directory structure
[11:52:44] <Kirben> no need to mentioned it on site at all really
[11:53:02] <Kirben> I just added my latest compile guide to readme
[11:54:13] <Fingolfin> and that references it?
[11:54:22] <Fingolfin> anyway, take a lookt at exult.sf.net/download.php
[11:54:34] <Fingolfin> (I will fix the file size report soon, no worries ;)
[11:54:38] <Kirben> yes that reference it
[11:55:04] <Kirben> I will change back generic filename though to make updates easier.
[11:55:47] <Kirben> looks fine other than odd file sizes.
[11:56:57] <Fingolfin> reload, I fixed the file sizes
[11:57:13] <Kirben> but get rid of the red color on warning, looks terrible.
[11:57:34] <Fingolfin> aye, sir ;)
[11:58:02] <Fingolfin> should the warning be kept in a second line, or shall I put it onto one line, like "Snapshots - (These ...")
[11:59:39] <Fingolfin> right now, if you need to add a file to the snapshots page, you must modify download.php
[12:00:02] <Fingolfin> I might split this out into a data file properly, but for now I think it is not that difficult, the syntax is quite straight forward
[12:00:32] <Kirben> use domick's suggestion, Snapshots - Use at your own risk.
[12:03:23] <Kirben> I don't plan on adding any new files anytime soon.
[12:04:11] <Fingolfin> next thing Iīd like to tackle: handling of news item. Make a news DB, index page only displays the first 4 or so, history all the rest
[12:04:57] <Kirben> Could someone add new readme.win32 to cvs if I dcc ?
[12:05:18] <wjp> Kirben: I think you can do that yourself...
[12:05:36] <wjp> you're a member of the exult group, right?
[12:05:59] <Kirben> yes, how exactly ? never tried submitting to cvs before.
[12:06:43] <wjp> anyone using wincvs around?
[12:06:53] <Kirben> I use cvs under cygwin
[12:07:00] <wjp> ah, even better
[12:07:05] <Kirben> so is just like linux
[12:07:17] <wjp> did you login using your SF account or anonymously?
[12:07:28] <Kirben> anonymous
[12:08:08] <wjp> hmm, I wonder if you can change that in a current checked out copy
[12:08:26] <wjp> trying won't hurt I guess... (but make a backup of any changed files first :-) )
[12:08:41] <wjp> are you using bash?
[12:08:50] <Kirben> ok, yes bash
[12:09:06] <wjp> do you have ssh installed in cygwin?
[12:09:17] <Kirben> yes
[12:09:29] <Kirben> logged into sourceforge right now
[12:09:42] <wjp> no, you don't have to login to sourceforge
[12:09:44] <Fingolfin> Kirben: btw, I just changed it... all data for the download page is now in content/download.dat - should be easy to modify that!
[12:09:55] <Kirben> ok
[12:09:59] <wjp> this should do it:
[12:10:03] <wjp> export CVS_RSH=ssh
[12:10:22] <wjp> cvs -z3 -d:ext:kirben@cvs.exult.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/exult update -d
[12:10:27] <Fingolfin> you can check if you are annonymous or not, by goind to your checked out dir, and then "cat CVS/Root" I think
[12:10:38] <wjp> I _hope_ it will override the old cvsroot then...
[12:11:05] <wjp> (this from the directory that contains exult.cc)
[12:11:12] <Kirben> that worked
[12:11:29] <wjp> it asked for your password?
[12:11:39] <Kirben> yes
[12:11:51] <wjp> ok, now try again but without the -d.... (ie. cvs -z3 update -d)
[12:12:20] <Kirben> will that add any changed files to exult cvs?
[12:12:25] <wjp> no, not yet
[12:12:37] <wjp> 'update' means get any changed files from the server
[12:13:06] <Kirben> ok that worked but no password requested
[12:13:12] <wjp> hmm :-(
[12:13:12] <Fingolfin> wjp: hm, the forum is really a big security hole!
[12:13:19] <wjp> Fingolfin: no kidding :-)
[12:13:29] <Kirben> Just want to be sure I don't accidently submit sdl directory to cvs
[12:13:31] <Fingolfin> wjp: what did you want to do to fix it? add a .htaccess, or move it to outside of htdocs?
[12:13:51] <wjp> Fingolfin: which specific hole are you referring to?
[12:14:28] <Fingolfin> wjp: hmm... wait I just see that I was thinking nonsense - include is fine, only PHP files that generate no output anyway ;)
[12:14:28] <Nadir> Fingolfin: If you read SF's docs, it says that anything you put there is *insecure*
[12:15:18] <wjp> all of phorum's stored files are writable by nobody (the webserver) -> anyone on SF can modify them through a cgi/shtml/php/etc...
[12:15:18] <Nadir> The main problem is that Apache runs as nobody/nobody, therefore it is quite difficult to chmod files properly
[12:15:33] <Fingolfin> Nadir: well
[12:15:58] <wjp> Kirben: did it give any warning when you specified the new -d... parameter?
[12:16:02] <Fingolfin> that is why I put the IP data stored by my cookie script *outside* of htdocs - should be the safest compared with adding .htacces
[12:16:18] <Fingolfin> yeah
[12:16:34] <Nadir> but what about our mysql passwords... how can we hide those
[12:16:37] <Kirben> just this:
[12:16:38] <Kirben> The authenticity of host 'cvs.exult.sourceforge.net (216.136.171.202)' can't be
[12:16:38] <Kirben> established.
[12:16:38] <Kirben> DSA key fingerprint is 02:ab:7c:aa:49:ed:0b:a8:50:13:10:c2:3e:92:0f:42.
[12:16:38] <Kirben> Are you sure you want to continue connecting (yes/no)? yes
[12:16:38] <Kirben> Warning: Permanently added 'cvs.exult.sourceforge.net,216.136.171.202' (DSA) to
[12:16:40] <Kirben> the list of known hosts.
[12:16:41] <Fingolfin> cause count.qip / ipdata.qip have to be writeable by all, too, I put them outside of htdocs. still not really safe, but better I think
[12:16:41] <wjp> but outside of htdocs doesn't make it any less writable by the webserver :/
[12:17:01] <Fingolfin> wjp: true. since it has a+w, everybody can write it, but
[12:17:12] <Fingolfin> our concern shouldnīt be attacks from inside, but from outside
[12:17:22] <Nadir> Fingolfin: anyone can create an account on SF
[12:17:33] <Fingolfin> and keeping stuff inside htdocs makes it so much easier to attack, since ppl can see what is there ;)
[12:17:34] <wjp> Kirben: it's probably easiest to checkout a fresh copy of exult
[12:17:42] <Kirben> wjp: ok
[12:17:46] <wjp> Nadir: do users have webspace too? (or only projects?)
[12:17:47] <Fingolfin> Nadir: true, but no reason to make it to easy
[12:17:53] <Fingolfin> only projects I think
[12:18:29] <wjp> Kirben: go the directory below which you want to put the main exult dir, and run 'cvs -z3 -d:ext:kirben@cvs.exult.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/exult co exult'
[12:18:36] <Fingolfin> if the webserver had its own group (say www) then we could chgrp www all the files, then chmod ug+w o-w
[12:18:43] <wjp> Kirben: (make sure the old one is no longer there)
[12:19:13] <wjp> Fingolfin: what would be the point of that?
[12:19:42] <Fingolfin> wjp: btw, how do you know that the web server is nobody/nobody?
[12:19:58] <Fingolfin> wjp: well... if unix had a more intelligent user rights system.. <sigh>
[12:20:01] <Nadir> it says so in SF's documentation, which YOU should have read
[12:20:07] <Fingolfin> wjp: then we could associate say two groups to a file...
[12:20:25] <wjp> Fingolfin: the point is that the webserver has to be able to write the file, which means that anyone with access to the webserver can indirectly write to them
[12:20:29] <Fingolfin> Nadir: I have read it, but never read this. must be new, or I forgot it, is almost two years ago ;)
[12:20:35] <Fingolfin> wjp: yeah
[12:20:37] <Fingolfin> true
[12:20:38] <Fingolfin> hrm
[12:20:43] <Kirben> wjp: ok cvs -z3 update -d requests a password now
[12:20:48] <Nadir> Fingolfin: unix has that. It's called ACLs. There must be patch for Linux to implement those
[12:20:52] <wjp> Kirben: ok, all set then :-)
[12:20:59] <Fingolfin> Unix has that is wrong ;) some unices have it, yes
[12:21:07] <Fingolfin> but unix was not designed around it
[12:21:21] <Fingolfin> solaris has it for example, IIRC
[12:21:24] <Nadir> http://acl.bestbits.at/
[12:21:27] <Fingolfin> but it is a kludge
[12:21:31] <Fingolfin> IMHO
[12:21:50] <wjp> Kirben: now, change the file in the exult dir (and the ChangeLog), and run "cvs commit" (or "cvs commit <filenames>")
[12:21:57] <Nadir> One thing that Windoze has right is the ACL stuff
[12:22:17] <wjp> Nadir: although they made it too untransparent for my taste...
[12:22:25] <wjp> (too many hidden stuff going on)
[12:22:25] * Fingolfin really hopes that one day Unix will be replaced by a new better desigend OS ;)
[12:22:29] <wjp> s/many/much/
[12:22:34] <Nadir> and it defaults to "Everybody"...
[12:22:54] * Nadir thinks that Fingolfin should try Plan9
[12:24:10] <Fingolfin> Nadir: Plan9 is nice, but I donīt see that it will replace Unix one day. the point is, all new OS have a hard time establishing a base, makes it hard to get a new start. It has to have a good POSIX layer to get a start...
[12:24:20] <Kirben> wjp: I'm in some kind of changelog, what next ?
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS: ----------------------------------------------------------------------
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS: Enter Log. Lines beginning with `CVS:' are removed automatically
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS:
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS: Committing in .
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS:
[12:24:35] <Kirben> CVS: Modified Files:
[12:24:37] <Kirben> CVS: readme.win32
[12:24:45] <wjp> I usually just copy the ChangeLog entry in there
[12:25:07] <Kirben> how to exit ?
[12:25:15] <Fingolfin> I donīt know much about Plan9, I heard it has some nice stuff, but is supposed to suffer from non-practical limitations put on it for theoretical reasons ;)
[12:25:16] <wjp> escape, ZZ
[12:25:27] <wjp> or escape, :wq
[12:25:35] <wjp> (vi is fun :-) )
[12:26:08] <Fingolfin> vi is a punishment
[12:26:17] <Nadir> xemacs rules
[12:26:23] <wjp> s/x// ;-)
[12:26:32] * Fingolfin agrees with wjp
[12:27:05] * Nadir can't stand plain emacs
[12:27:12] <Kirben> ctrl z cancels
[12:27:16] <Nadir> and I use joe most of the time
[12:27:35] <wjp> ctrl z?
[12:27:41] <Kirben> What exactly is escape key ? Esc ?
[12:27:43] <wjp> type 'fg'
[12:27:59] <wjp> (to cancel the ctrl-z)
[12:28:17] <Kirben> ok
[12:28:29] <wjp> back in vi?
[12:28:31] <Kirben> I'm not used to vi
[12:28:33] <Kirben> yes
[12:28:38] <wjp> Kirben: it takes some getting used to :-)
[12:28:46] <wjp> now, press Esc
[12:28:54] <wjp> and then shift-ZZ
[12:28:57] <Nadir> Kirben, you can change editors.
[12:29:04] <Nadir> export EDITOR=emacs
[12:29:08] <Nadir> export VISUAL=emacs
[12:29:58] <Kirben> that worked
[12:30:12] <Kirben> is there any way to have it remember password ?
[12:30:18] <wjp> yeah
[12:30:43] <wjp> you have to generate an RSA/DSA key, and put it on SF somewhere
[12:31:00] <wjp> (the public key section of your account management)
[12:31:21] <Nadir> wjp: I've never managed to get that to work
[12:31:28] <Nadir> does it work for you ?
[12:31:35] <wjp> well, it did until I broke it :-)
[12:31:55] <Fingolfin> it works superb for me
[12:31:57] <wjp> but I know how to fix it
[12:32:07] <wjp> in fact, I'll go fix it right now
[12:32:28] <Kirben> how to remove cvs file ?
[12:32:30] <wjp> Nadir: you need to generate a DSA key, which isn't the default for openssh
[12:32:34] * Nadir rushes off to read some docs on how to do it
[12:32:37] <wjp> Kirben: what cvs file?
[12:32:47] <Kirben> makefile.studio.cygwin
[12:32:52] <wjp> Kirben: oh, in general :-)
[12:33:55] <wjp> remove the file from the directory, and then 'cvs remove <file>' followed by 'cvs commit <file>'
[12:34:04] <Kirben> ok
[12:34:12] <Nadir> Kirben: donwload wincvs, it will be much easier for you :)
[12:34:17] <wjp> Kirben: I just got the cvs-log mail, btw. (there's no log message, but the commit went ok)
[12:34:38] <Kirben> I didn't include a log
[12:34:48] <wjp> ok, then it worked :-)
[12:35:04] <wjp> you should add a log message though, makes it easier for us too see what changed
[12:35:21] <wjp> (just a few words is usually enough)
[12:35:26] <Kirben> I checked out wincvs once, but prefer command line
[12:35:35] <Kirben> ok
[12:36:51] <wjp> Nadir: 'ssh-keygin -t dsa', I think. (and then put id_dsa.pub on SF)
[12:37:22] <wjp> s/keygin/keygen/
[12:37:25] <Nadir> http://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=765&group_id=1
[12:37:45] <Nadir> It says that if you generate a key with a passphrase it will always ask for the passphrase
[12:37:58] <wjp> so don't use a passphrase ;-)
[12:38:29] <Nadir> I'll regenerate my key then
[12:43:19] <Nadir> Do I have to wait for the 6 hour cron job thing ?
[12:43:34] <wjp> yeah
[12:44:00] <Nadir> Because it's still asking for the passphrase
[12:44:57] <Nadir> It's done
[12:46:58] <Fingolfin> and donīt forget to update the key via the web page, too!
[12:47:05] <Fingolfin> if you donīt it wonīt be transfered to the CVS server
[12:48:47] <Kirben> Is that better log ?
[12:49:09] <wjp> yeah
[12:49:58] <Nadir> Fingolfin: done that
[12:52:06] <Kirben> now I can fix that missing config.h in a few files
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[12:55:12] <Colourless> whoa
[12:55:18] <Colourless> hi all
[12:55:41] <Colourless> all we need is Jeff and we've got like a full house or something
[12:56:53] <Kirben> Does it matter commiting files one by one ? or should I do bunch ?
[12:56:57] <Nadir> hi colourless
[12:56:58] <Kirben> Hi Colourless
[12:57:13] <Nadir> bunch
[12:57:15] <Colourless> if you do all files one by one it will send one email per file
[12:57:35] <Nadir> otherwise you get what is known as the "Fingolfin effect", which is just as bad as the "Slashdot effect"
[12:57:54] <Kirben> ok
[12:58:02] <Nadir> :)
[12:58:10] <Colourless> Fingolfin has since upgraded to an improved operating system and no longer has that problem
[12:59:06] <Kirben> Should usecode compiler and ucxt be win32 compatible ?
[12:59:11] <Nadir> Ah, but since his commits have been much rarer recently, it's hard to tell :)
[12:59:27] <Kirben> I might attempt to compile them next
[12:59:27] <Nadir> Kirben: they should be made to, if they aren't
[12:59:33] <Nadir> Kirben: good idea
[12:59:50] <Kirben> any other tools I have missed ?
[13:01:17] <Colourless> it should be possible to compile ucc on win32
[13:04:02] <Nadir> patrick's stuff is not integrated in the automake/autoconf build
[13:04:29] <Colourless> i would guess you'd probably need to speak to him about it
[13:06:12] <Nadir> I wrote the .am file but I don't think anyone maintained it from there
[13:09:58] <Kirben> hmm compiles but link fails:
[13:09:59] <Kirben> g++ -mno-cygwin -mwindows -o ucc.exe ucexpr.o ucfun.o ucloc.o ucstmt.o ucsym.o -
[13:09:59] <Kirben> lmingw32
[13:09:59] <Kirben> /usr/lib/mingw/libmingw32.a(main.o)(.text+0x8d):main.c: undefined reference to `
[13:09:59] <Kirben> WinMain@16'
[13:09:59] <Kirben> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
[13:10:01] <Kirben> make: *** [ucc.exe] Error 1
[13:10:01] * Fingolfin notes that he still uses OS 9, and if people keep mocking him he will change the header of all source files and commit them using MacCVS ony OS 9 ;)
[13:10:25] * Fingolfin uses OS X / Unix ATM, thoug, thus you all luck out - for now ;)
[13:11:01] <wjp> Kirben: replace -mwindows by -mconsole, I think.
[13:11:32] <Kirben> no difference
[13:11:52] <Colourless> don't you need to compile the uclex.ll and ucparse.yy files?
[13:12:14] <Kirben> oh didn't know
[13:12:27] <Kirben> so just uclex.o and ucparse.o ?
[13:13:26] <Colourless> those require other tools, and I can't remember the names
[13:13:36] <wjp> flex, bison
[13:13:48] <wjp> (respectively)
[13:15:49] <Nadir> flex rulezx
[13:18:46] <Kirben> I have no idea how to add those in
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[13:40:02] <wjp> Kirben: I think you're not supposed to include config.h in header files
[13:40:25] <Kirben> ??
[13:40:39] <wjp> only in the .cc files
[13:40:54] <Kirben> I didn't add any config.h to files just added if/end if around it in 2 files.
[13:41:11] <wjp> hmm... then it shouldn't have been there :-)
[13:42:16] <Kirben> ok
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[14:05:13] <Nadir> b
[14:05:27] <Colourless> wb
[14:07:53] <Nadir> router dropped all connections
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[15:47:53] <Nadir> gotta go
[15:47:55] <-- Nadir has left IRC (Pleasant dreams, Avatar... hehehehehe)
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[17:31:02] <Fingolfin> wb colourless ;)
[17:31:13] <Colourless> wb yourself
[17:37:52] <Fingolfin> ohhh, sweet, thanks ,)
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[18:45:33] <Fingolfin> woa
[18:45:39] <Fingolfin> #openprojects sure is full ;)
[18:46:20] <Colourless> that is a few
[18:47:31] <Fingolfin> well
[18:47:38] <Fingolfin> the point is, that every few seconds somebody joins, and talks
[18:47:43] <Fingolfin> ;)
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[19:45:30] <Colourless> wb
[19:45:43] <wjp> thanks
[19:47:43] <Fingolfin> wb
[19:50:10] * wjp wonders whether he should go read some more or play some D2
[19:50:33] <wjp> (or maybe even do something vaguely useful... *shudder* ;-) )
[19:50:45] <Colourless> you think?
[20:09:37] <chimera|wookin> what are you reading now, wjp?
[20:12:26] <wjp> Wheel of Time
[20:16:11] <Colourless> woohoo. i've now got a really really terrible implimentation of my portrate stats in place :)
[20:17:02] <wjp> any screenshots? :-)
[20:17:15] <Colourless> no ;-)
[20:17:33] <Colourless> I still need to do quite a bit more work
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[20:17:49] <sty> 'sera :)
[20:17:57] <chimera|wookin> sty!!!
[20:18:07] <Colourless> at the moment only the avatar is shown, and then, only the hp is shown.
[20:18:22] <Colourless> the alignment is pretty bad
[20:19:50] <wjp> as long as the rendering system works, the rest should be easier, right?
[20:19:55] <sty> kimera
[20:20:01] <wjp> hi
[20:20:52] <Colourless> pretty much
[20:21:32] <Fingolfin> you only need to shift it around then?
[20:21:38] <Fingolfin> or is the code very "hacky" ATM? ;)
[20:22:00] <Colourless> the code is pretty neat, because i haven't put any hacks in yet ;-)
[20:22:21] * Fingolfin imagines this would be done using a general widget that can display the char portrait & hp stats for any given NPC... and which checks for the acvatar to also display mana
[20:22:54] <Colourless> that's pretty much it
[20:23:58] <Colourless> the big issue that i've yet to come up with a good solution for is simply notification of when the structure of the party has changed and when an NPCs stats have changed which would require the bars to be repainted
[20:26:36] <Colourless> i was thinking the easiest way would just be to get the gump to remember it's state last time and to ask the gump to set it's dirty region if it needs to
[20:27:35] <Colourless> i think I'll do that
[20:27:57] <Fingolfin> signal & slots would be neat for that... ;)
[20:28:06] <Fingolfin> just think OO ;)
[20:28:07] <Colourless> :) yeah
[20:28:56] <chimera|wookin> gumps!
[20:29:44] <Fingolfin> btw, how was the term gumps coined?
[20:30:08] <Colourless> you had to ask.... just wait a bit
[20:30:17] <chimera|wookin> I think I asked that question before, and I think the answer was that one of the U7 files is called gumps
[20:30:51] <chimera|wookin> (or if not ... it has something to do with the original u7 data hehe)
[20:31:41] <Colourless> http://www.ttlg.com/articles/WSint.asp - Search for "Why do you call them "gumps"?
[20:31:59] <Colourless> remove the " before why
[20:32:25] <Colourless> that's a interview with Warren Spector about Serpent Isle
[20:33:17] <Fingolfin> cool
[20:33:19] <Fingolfin> thx
[20:35:20] <chimera|wookin> gumps!
[20:35:55] <chimera|wookin> this interview must be quite old
[20:36:04] <Colourless> Hehe. I like this quote... "I would kill to be able to ship the 21 Mb intro to SI that some people saw
[20:36:04] <Colourless> at the trade shows.
[20:36:31] <chimera|wookin> hehehe
[20:36:34] <Colourless> the interview is old, it's from before SI was released
[20:36:38] <sty> "One change we're making in SI is that we're going to be a
[20:36:38] <sty> little more realistic than Ultima 7. The grass isn't flourescent green."
[20:36:49] <chimera|wookin> someone asked him about a windows port and he said the main problem was speed hehe
[20:36:55] <sty> wow man, orgasmic realism :DDD
[20:36:58] <chimera|wookin> I remember those days .. the Windows 3.1 days
[20:37:23] <chimera|wookin> sty: hehe.. do you mean organic realism? hehe
[20:37:41] <sty> yep sure ;)
[20:41:57] <sty> it was after the great Britannia nuclear meltdown
[20:42:05] <Fingolfin> win 3.11, yeah ;)
[20:43:12] <chimera|wookin> sty: Pensi che qualcuno in questo canale si incavoli se iniziamo a parlare in italiano ?\
[20:44:05] <chimera|wookin> Fingolfin: I hated win 3.1 ... ugh .. hehe... I never thought any games would run fast in it!
[20:44:15] <sty> se coloriamo troppo il canale qualcuno si troverbbe fuoriposto :)
[20:44:17] <Colourless> and they never did
[20:44:36] <chimera|wookin> remember Myst? that game was basically.. well.. Mist.. hehe
[20:46:27] <Fingolfin> myst is a great game; not not my type of game, but I know many ppl who loved it
[20:46:31] <Fingolfin> the mac version at least ;)
[20:46:55] <Fingolfin> and I didnīt like win 3.11 either, being a mac user, but somehow I always had to help my friends who had troubles with their win installs ;)
[20:47:04] <Fingolfin> this didnīt change much for win 95, though =)
[20:49:45] <chimera|wookin> Fingolfin: I don't care if it was for Mac, Win3.1 or whatever.. Myst just plain sucked :)
[20:49:55] <chimera|wookin> ok I am kind of joking hehe
[20:50:11] <chimera|wookin> I just thoguht the win 3.1 version was apalling (sp?)
[21:17:36] <sty> does the current CVS compile under linux ?
[21:19:35] * wjp compiles
[21:20:29] <sty> i've just updated my mandrake ... but this error is strange
[21:20:50] <sty> ucparse.yy: In function `int yyparse ()':
[21:20:50] <sty> ucparse.yy:444: `sprintf' undeclared (first use this function)
[21:21:42] <wjp> might be missing a header
[21:36:58] <sty> byez, time to sleep
[21:37:11] <Colourless> cya
[21:37:37] <-- sty has left IRC (anyone can play guitar ...)
[22:13:53] <Colourless> Oi! You two, take a look at this: http://www.users.on.net/triforce/port.png
[22:13:57] <Colourless> opinions?
[22:14:48] <Fingolfin> mom
[22:14:55] <wjp> looks great
[22:15:32] <wjp> clicking on the faces opens up inventory/stats windows?
[22:15:38] <Colourless> yeah
[22:16:37] <Fingolfin> beautiful ;)
[22:16:59] <Fingolfin> iolo is almost dead, though
[22:17:09] <Colourless> yeah
[22:17:44] <Colourless> i changed their stats. they all had full, and that doesn't make an interesting screenshot, so I F2'd their stats down
[22:17:52] <Fingolfin> ;)
[22:18:09] <wjp> is that virtuous? ;-)
[22:18:26] <Colourless> who knows
[22:22:29] <Fingolfin> Colourless -- ;)
[22:22:45] <Colourless> hmmmm
[22:37:12] <Fingolfin> Colourless ++ ++
[22:37:25] <Fingolfin> happy again? I didnīt want to leave your karma negative
[22:37:33] <Colourless> hehe
[22:39:48] <-- chimera|wookin has left IRC (So many rubes in this world who need to be dealt with ... and I don't have time to do the dealing. http://www.rubecity.com)
[23:06:09] <Colourless> i'm also going to make it so that you can drag an object to the faces and it will add the object to that party members inventory.
[23:07:01] <Fingolfin> yeah, good!
[23:07:05] <Fingolfin> go ryan go! ;)
[23:31:26] <Colourless> I also have made it outline the faces when you are poisoned or protected, or were just hit
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[23:41:15] <wjp> I'm going to bed
[23:41:16] <wjp> goodnight
[23:41:18] <Fingolfin> you rule! if you were visible, weīd make
[23:41:20] <Fingolfin> night
[23:41:25] <Colourless> cya
[23:41:29] <Fingolfin> weīd make biiig pictures for our walls & ceilings
[23:41:38] <wjp> Colourless: these ideas sound great!
[23:41:42] <Fingolfin> (you = ryan ;)
[23:41:48] <wjp> bye
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[23:42:04] <Colourless> good thing I'm not visible then
[23:43:36] <Colourless> another thing i'm also going to allow you to do is to be able to use potions and similar on the faces and it will effect that person
[23:44:42] <Colourless> i'm thinking of also adding that to just general inventory and paperdoll gumps because in the original you could click on thte gump and the effect would be applied
[23:47:49] <Fingolfin> hm
[23:47:59] <Fingolfin> sounds pretty good to me
[23:48:19] <Fingolfin> and maybe an option were the faces appear, in which corner of the screen? ;)
[23:48:25] <Fingolfin> how do you order them , BTW?
[23:48:44] <Colourless> the order that they were added to the party.
[23:49:22] <Colourless> i was thinking of adding different options to how the faces should be aligned on screen
[23:49:48] <Colourless> at the moment each face is 40 pixels to the right of the previous one
[23:53:00] <Fingolfin> ok
[23:56:50] <Colourless> i'll be going now
[23:58:47] <-- Colourless has left IRC (me probably should have gone to bed hours ago)