#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 5 Jan 2005 (GMT)

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[10:06:51] <servus> Lookie, 3D wells that animate, and a 3D Kill Wrathy Making Machine.
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[10:16:00] <Esbee-Eks> ???
[10:16:09] <Esbee-Eks> I don't see them.
[10:19:53] <servus> Close your eyes.
[10:20:01] <servus> until the bugs are gone.
[10:22:38] <servus> Wee, segfault!
[10:23:24] <Esbee-Eks> That's what you get for coding with your eyes closed.
[10:23:36] <servus> D'oh
[10:23:45] <servus> Everything's a little... small, too.
[10:23:51] <servus> Lots of little kinks in the avatar's hair.
[10:23:59] <servus> figuratively speaking, of course.
[10:24:14] <servus> I like the look of the well, though, otherwise, and it loads just as fast as a shape :-)
[10:41:21] <Esbee-Eks> How big are the models in disk space?
[10:41:24] <servus> Segfault fixed.
[10:41:34] <servus> A full-fledged Kilrathi Death Machine is 4996 bytes.
[10:42:41] <servus> 117 vertices, 235 triangles.
[10:44:19] <Esbee-Eks> does that include textures?
[10:44:25] <servus> It does not.
[10:44:39] <Esbee-Eks> oh
[10:44:57] <servus> Well I can't be blamed for the size of a PNG, can I? :-) KillWrathy.png is 24KB
[10:44:57] <Esbee-Eks> Did you get the ship from Wing Commander?
[10:45:16] <servus> #Wing-Commander, of course, but the textures were a mess and I redid them. The actual model is great though:)
[10:45:59] <servus> http://wcmdf.solsector.net/main/pictures/1/Jalkehi.jpg closest I could find to the original..
[10:46:13] <Esbee-Eks> good
[10:46:21] <Esbee-Eks> what type of ship is it?
[10:46:21] <Esbee-Eks> oh
[10:47:11] <servus> That's a Jalkehi. Word has it the Ultima 7 ship is actually Prince Thrakash's. There's a mesh for that on the site that I got this mesh ( http://wcmdf.solsector.net/main/pictures/1/bloodfang.jpg ), but it looks *nothing* like Ultima 7's.
[10:47:16] <Esbee-Eks> Can the new models be bigger/smaller than their 2D/3D shape boxes? You did say that we can make giant trees now.
[10:47:27] <servus> Yes.
[10:47:54] <Esbee-Eks> One must be careful of the effects on the gameworld.
[10:48:01] <servus> Like what?
[10:48:20] <Esbee-Eks> Make sure you can still walk through the forest, or go up an Emp's treehouse.
[10:48:24] <servus> Only one I could think of was that I can't make mountains as huge as I wanted, because people might try to walk on the mountain top.
[10:48:32] <servus> Oh this won't affect movement at all
[10:48:34] <Esbee-Eks> :(
[10:49:05] <servus> Well what do you have in mind, then?
[10:49:37] <Esbee-Eks> So you are saying the original bounding boxes still affect movement? And if you walked on the mountain top you would go through? That is even more of an side-effect.
[10:49:51] <Esbee-Eks> I mean more of a negative effect...
[10:50:27] <Esbee-Eks> But you could still get negative effects if you made the movement clip to the 3D shapes, in places where the game expects a certain object size.
[10:50:43] <Esbee-Eks> I'm looking forward to 3D barges.
[10:53:01] <servus> Well if I make the mountains match the 2D mountains, then everything will be just fine.
[10:53:22] <servus> I was just hoping of "fudging" it and making mountains huge -- manually making all the vertices higher
[10:57:19] <Esbee-Eks> What would be wrong with people trying to to walk on the mountain top? (I don't even think they could unless they hackmove themselves there.)
[10:58:21] <servus> You can if you jump on it while your magic carpet is sinking :-)
[10:59:18] <Esbee-Eks> oops
[10:59:18] <Esbee-Eks> then what happens?
[11:01:59] <servus> You lose your carpet.
[11:02:03] <servus> :)
[11:02:28] <servus> Well, back to Windows to model some mountains
[11:02:51] <Esbee-Eks> oh the Jalkehi does look like the killwrathy machine
[11:02:54] <Esbee-Eks> except for the colorign
[11:02:58] <Esbee-Eks> coloring*
[11:03:50] <servus> I changed the colouring to silver and orange.
[11:04:31] <Esbee-Eks> great :)
[11:04:57] <Esbee-Eks> if you just make the mountains vertically bigger, and increase the carpet height accordingly, it should refuse to land on a mountain
[11:05:10] <servus> http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/Exult3D-22.jpg
[11:05:22] <servus> Increase the carpet height?
[11:05:24] * Esbee-Eks loves screenshots of Exult3D.
[11:05:31] <servus> I can't edit game content like that
[11:05:31] <Esbee-Eks> the height that it flies
[11:05:37] <servus> It's not a screenshot of Exult3D, sorry :P
[11:05:44] <Esbee-Eks> dammit
[11:05:46] <servus> Screenshot of 3D Max.
[11:08:51] <Esbee-Eks> silverleaf eating monkeys?
[11:09:08] <Esbee-Eks> They don't eat silverleaf! They talk to them.
[11:09:28] <servus> On the first date, maybe
[11:10:06] <servus> Why are you on two public IPs?
[11:10:08] <Esbee-Eks> hehe
[11:10:12] <Esbee-Eks> ... then they build houses on them
[11:10:14] <Esbee-Eks> I dont know
[11:10:16] <Esbee-Eks> I am?
[11:10:43] <servus> Esbee-Eks (~sbx@69.9.105.145) has joined #exult sbx (~sbx@69.9.104.135) has joined #exult
[11:11:28] <Esbee-Eks> I have replaced sbx.
[11:11:39] <servus> -
[11:11:48] <servus> Darn cat!
[11:12:51] <Esbee-Eks> If you're going to make mountains I have nothing to do.
[11:13:16] <servus> What do you want to do? :-)
[11:13:31] <Esbee-Eks> mountains
[11:13:39] <Esbee-Eks> but really I'm sure you'll make better mountains
[11:13:40] <servus> Mountains will be a tricky alignment problem I fear -- although, a unit in your modelling program will be equal to one tile.
[11:13:42] <Esbee-Eks> I dont have any ideas for them
[11:13:55] <servus> I have a list of Things I Want Made
[11:13:58] <servus> Wanna gander/
[11:14:10] <Esbee-Eks> Yes I'm looking at it.
[11:14:21] <Esbee-Eks> Where are there Monkeys?
[11:14:35] <servus> I couldn't remember the word Emp
[11:14:41] <Esbee-Eks> oh right
[11:14:44] <servus> Lots of stuff there, some of the stuff that needs to be remodelled most will be easiest to do
[11:15:00] <servus> Lots of those creature models seem to be repeats. I dunno why
[11:15:10] <Esbee-Eks> i could do a barrel or find one online
[11:15:16] <servus> I made a barrel for UWAdv, sorry:)
[11:15:22] <Esbee-Eks> damn
[11:15:26] <Esbee-Eks> I think barrels probably display well already
[11:15:47] <servus> Don't make anything you see here http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/LoW/muffin6.jpg
[11:15:57] <servus> Barrels look like crud
[11:16:30] <servus> What about some weapons? :-)
[11:16:50] <servus> Each weapon has 5 frames I think. Sitting. Held. Attack frames 1-3
[11:17:04] <servus> So really it's just one frame, put in different situations
[11:17:35] <servus> or rocks/monoliths?
[11:17:41] <Esbee-Eks> I can make a rock.
[11:17:41] <servus> They'll look great and be quick jobs
[11:18:03] <Esbee-Eks> Can you give a monkey (Emp) wings and pass it off as a Mongbat?
[11:18:12] <servus> Probably
[11:18:21] <servus> Oh! There are flying gargoyle animations! Are those used?
[11:18:32] <servus> Also of interest: creatures in shapes.vga are arranged alphabetically!
[11:19:16] <Esbee-Eks> You made leeks?
[11:19:30] <Esbee-Eks> or is that grass
[11:19:34] <servus> Grass.
[11:19:48] <Esbee-Eks> those are awesome tables
[11:19:50] <servus> I went through a few UW levels and made everything that caught my eye.
[11:20:12] <servus> Thanks, I think if I keep detail to around this level, I might be able to make Ultima 7 first person :-)
[11:20:27] <Esbee-Eks> you have to model roofs too
[11:20:40] <servus> Yeah... though the game expects them to be flat.
[11:21:08] <Esbee-Eks> I wish ships could be bigger than the puny ships in U7 too. But that's probably a bad idea.
[11:21:33] <Esbee-Eks> What kind of ship consists of eight dining room chairs and a sail?
[11:23:45] <servus> I can't/don't want to change fundamental facts of the game
[11:23:52] <servus> Esbee-Eks, the Titanic?
[11:24:14] <servus> 'sides, there's no water big enough for what you describe, and it'd fit in two superchunks :_)
[11:24:18] <Esbee-Eks> dlol
[11:24:30] <Esbee-Eks> ok
[11:25:43] <Esbee-Eks> so you wont make it so waves can crash onto the ship and make it rock back and forth, and a high wind can tear your sail up and make you run aground by a pirate fort where you have to fight them in their makeshift arena, two men enter one man leaves, and when you win (because you are the Avatar and have l33t 3D weapons) you take over the pirate fort and put up the flag of Britannia, then you repair the ship and sail back to Lord British to tell him of your ad
[11:25:43] <Esbee-Eks> venture?
[11:27:06] <Esbee-Eks> I will model the flag and giant kegs if you do.
[11:27:24] <servus> 3D weapons yes. Everything else... what game is this?
[11:27:47] <servus> I do want you to make me a flag though :) -- the long tapering billowy type in front of Trinisc and castle British
[11:27:52] <Esbee-Eks> what Ultima 9 should have been
[11:28:24] <Esbee-Eks> a pennant
[11:28:29] <servus> Something like that
[11:29:08] <Esbee-Eks> Of course it didn't have to be an arena. It could be an all out battle with Iolo's bolts flying and 3D magic effects.
[11:29:10] <Esbee-Eks> Thinking of 3D magic?
[11:29:23] <Esbee-Eks> And weather.
[11:29:50] <Esbee-Eks> Basically anything that's an animation like that in Exult.
[11:30:19] <servus> A particle system? Perhaps.
[11:30:51] <Esbee-Eks> Oh? That's cool. But it doesn't even begin to describe the effects you need for a rainstorm.
[11:30:56] <servus> Remember that I'm not actually making 'animations' here, but sequences of frames. Trying to make something smoother than a strict replacement of shapes is just too hairy for right now, what with usecode playing with frames and all that
[11:31:13] <Esbee-Eks> Well... at the moment.
[11:31:43] <Esbee-Eks> But you already hack something to put clouds in the proper location right?
[11:31:56] <servus> That wasn't my hack.
[11:33:21] <Esbee-Eks> Maybe the Ultima remake project(s) have models to spare.
[11:36:03] <servus> Mebbe. I tried looking some up and I got a lot of 404s
[11:55:55] <Esbee-Eks> Ultima Underworld had grass?
[11:56:04] <servus> Kinda, yeah.
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[12:51:09] <sbx> servus: can I send you a model so I can see if my modeller exports 3ds correctly?
[12:54:03] <sbx> he has 317 vertices
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[20:35:01] <Fl00der> hi
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[22:00:39] <Dominus> hi
[22:00:48] <Fl00der> hi
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[22:34:54] <Dominus> servus: : I'm reading up on the logs and found your comment that with exult 3d not all trees need to be tiny and ondred how the woody parts of u7 look in 3d right now and especially how the treehoses in the silverleaf trees look
[22:39:15] <servus> I hate my trees, so I'm remodelling them. However, they look kinda cool I think. Even with every tree being the exact same model, it's a good 'full' effect. If you want to help model those silverleaf trees... :-)
[22:39:43] <Dominus> he he
[22:39:57] <Dominus> I have never modeled anything :)
[22:40:46] <servus> OK, it'll just take longer by myself, but I like modelling :-)
[22:50:35] <servus> I did get some emails a while ago from people that expressed interest in helping me model. I'm waiting for responses now. Once I get things looking better (with lighting, smooth groups, and all that working), I will post some screenshots and try to recruit some modellers/free models :)
[22:51:55] <Dominus> nice
[22:52:30] <Dominus> I wonder when we will have an Exult3D that doesn't look like U7 anymore :)
[22:52:44] <Fl00der> :)
[22:54:01] <Fl00der> anyway exult is the best Ultima fan project so far :)
[22:54:38] <servus> The results so far look good.
[22:54:43] <servus> I have an animateable water well :-)
[22:54:49] <Fl00der> nice :)
[22:55:03] <Fl00der> do you have gif animation for that or something? :)
[22:55:10] <servus> Once I get smooth groups working, and vertex lighting, think it'll look even better. I just implemented the smooth groups in my exporter, so now I'm rebooting to Linux to try it out
[22:55:14] <servus> Nah! Model darnit :P
[22:55:20] <Fl00der> :P
[22:55:34] <servus> http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/Exult3D-22.jpg
[22:55:46] <Fl00der> add some pixel shader version 3.0 and it looks good ;)
[22:56:03] <servus> OpenGL doesn't use pixel shaders ;-)
[22:56:13] <Fl00der> right, it's openGL
[22:56:17] <Fl00der> looks very good
[22:56:52] <servus> However, I could add fragment http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/Abyss-15.jpg shaders if I wanted.
[22:56:59] <Fl00der> Can't wait to play that treasure
[22:57:08] <servus> Treasure?
[22:57:29] <Fl00der> just word for your project ;)
[22:57:39] <Fl00der> it's so good that it's treasure :)
[22:58:21] <Fl00der> I meant that can't wait to play Exult3D
[22:58:22] <Fl00der> :P
[22:58:29] <Fl00der> if you misunderstood me
[22:58:55] <servus> my kilwrathi cruiser is upside down :|
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[22:59:03] <servus> Now for 3D bunnies
[22:59:13] <Fl00der> :D
[23:04:26] <servus> http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/Exult3D-22.jpg and http://24.205.120.21:81/images/screenshots/Exult3D-23.jpg
[23:04:52] <servus> Whoops, over-wrote 22.
[23:05:04] <Fl00der> hmm...looks little weird
[23:05:15] <servus> What do you mean?
[23:05:26] <servus> It's upside-down but besides that it's how the model is :P
[23:05:29] <Fl00der> well craft looks good but others looks weird :)
[23:06:21] <servus> The Avatar and Iolo the Blockhead?
[23:06:30] <Fl00der> yea :)
[23:06:40] <servus> I should do wheat, fences, and cattails next so that I can complete this scene.
[23:08:05] <servus> A good thing is that a modelled cube actually renders a lot, lot quicker than the "general case" cube that I use for everything, even if a relatively high-res (256x256) texture is used in the model.
[23:08:53] <Fl00der> ok
[23:09:58] <servus> I don't know if I should model some mountains. SBX said he wanted to, but I'm not sure how serious he was. Mountains will be tricky:)
[23:13:49] <Fl00der> yep :)
[23:24:43] <servus> Yep what? To Me or SBX or Tricky? :-p
[23:31:16] <Fl00der> tricky :P
[23:33:00] <Fl00der> anyway
[23:33:03] <Fl00der> time to sleep
[23:33:05] <Fl00der> it's 1:33 AM
[23:33:13] <Fl00der> night and good luck :)
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