#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 5 Jul 2001 (GMT)

Archive Today Yesterday Tomorrow
Exult homepage

[00:42:08] --> Kirben has joined #exult
[02:15:46] --> marian has joined #exult
[02:16:15] <marian> help
[02:17:14] <-- marian has left IRC ()
[02:41:24] --> Dominus has joined #Exult
[02:41:31] <Dominus> hi
[02:41:40] <Dominus> Kirben?
[02:41:52] <Kirben> Hi
[02:42:36] <Dominus> Q: why do you set the path in your exult.cfg file to the keybinding files and not to (default)?
[02:43:25] <Kirben> To allow people to just alter them, the files no longer use default filenames
[02:44:30] <Dominus> I know but they donīt need to have them set as these files are in the flx, right?
[02:44:55] <Kirben> Yes thats is right
[02:45:23] <Dominus> John Doe normally doesnīt edit the files anyway and the others are smart enough to read the FAQ or get the idea :-)
[02:46:10] <Dominus> I also wonder whatīs up with those people who donīt get it to work at all (Jackchaos.com)
[02:48:20] <Kirben> Still I prefer it make it as easy as possible...
[02:48:35] <Kirben> Yes, a few strange reports on forum
[02:48:50] <Dominus> I just wondered, leave it as it is in your exult.cfg :-)
[02:49:10] <Dominus> seems like some screwed up Windows systems
[02:50:19] <Kirben> maybe
[02:50:28] <Dominus> just strange
[02:51:03] <Dominus> oh, I wondered if I should include in known issues the thing with those Vortex (?) soundcards
[02:52:50] <Dominus> what was your final verdict on those?
[02:52:51] <Kirben> Yes would be good idea, although might be small change that last audio fix might have helped the issue...
[02:53:45] <Kirben> I still think it might have been a part Exult problem, since speech used to work but never got the chance to look into it more...
[02:54:32] <Dominus> but those cards face some problems anyway ... so itīs one of those mysterious problems
[02:54:49] <Kirben> So no digital sound effects or speech when using Vortex series sound cards under Win9x/ME
[02:55:01] <Dominus> and W2k?
[02:55:15] <Kirben> fine under W2K so far
[02:55:19] <Dominus> ah, ok
[02:55:23] <Kirben> I"m currently using Windows 2000 with Vortex 2
[02:56:11] <Dominus> I take that is working for you :-)
[02:56:58] <Dominus> ah, and was it you that got mentioned on http://alive.singnet.com.sg/ some time ago?
[02:57:03] <Kirben> Yes all working fine in Exult
[02:57:15] <Kirben> Yes
[02:57:57] <Dominus> Iīm always struggling with my "§"$§&%%)()=@ Live! card as well
[02:58:22] <Dominus> Oh, do you get that popping sound starting up Exult with the Vortex card?
[02:59:03] <Kirben> yes, using audio WDM drivers seem to be the cuase of that.
[03:00:15] <Dominus> so itīs not limited to the Live! card, though the ME Wdm drivers donīt produce the pop, and setting the sound hardware accelaration to none eliminates the pop as well
[03:00:49] <Kirben> I still can't believe how Creative Labs are ignoring all those drivers issues for so long...
[03:01:30] <Dominus> me neither, but with the 5.1 Liveware and those 3300 drivers it seems to work ok
[03:01:57] <Kirben> That is strange, I used to get the same pop in Exult when using WDM drivers under WinME.
[03:02:46] <Dominus> I never got it in ME, but then I have a very stripped down ME system (Lite!) as it is only for testing stuff
[03:05:34] <Dominus> the 5.1 Liveware contains newer versions of the AudioHQ and Mixer, enabling a much bigger soundfont cache (for me at least) and can be installed on older Live! cards via a switch (/w I think) (if that is of interest to you)
[03:07:09] <Kirben> Well my main issue with current SB Live WDM drivers is the huge amounts of CPU they waste and there is no sign of fix for that in any official or unofficial drivers released so far...
[03:07:50] <Kirben> I would not mind seeing Creative Labs die off myself
[03:08:03] <Dominus> that is certainly true, and their lack of interest in their customers complaints drives me mad
[03:09:11] <Kirben> Creative Labs just has to much of sound card market (Many store only sell their sound cards) and they don't seem to care about their older sound cards at all
[03:10:00] <Kirben> Would have been simple for CL to adjust those 5.1 drivers to install on all SB Live series sound cards for example
[03:11:16] <Dominus> or that S/PDIF problem that they did blame solely on MS , their damn Dos drivers that need emm386 (argh)
[03:11:39] <Dominus> CL has older soundcards?
[03:12:08] <Dominus> oh, thatīs right I have one but no newer drivers or software to make use of their features in W2k
[03:12:40] <Kirben> I mean the older SB Live sound cards (Non 5.1) when I say older sound cards. Plus they are still selling those PCI 64/128/512 sounds cards
[03:13:32] <Kirben> CL could not even produce their own dos drivers and had to buy Ensoniq for that, so no chance of that changing...
[03:13:34] <Dominus> where was that advertisment for the Live! cards ? something about you are set for the future and such :-(
[03:14:51] <Dominus> well CLīs awe drivers were great. I recently wondered what was up with those drivers that came from Ensonic
[03:15:10] <Kirben> Yes that the main selling point (Liveware upgrades) but I don't remember where I saw them. Funny part if that point was often used when comparing the sound card to Aureal's and yet Aureal's sound card had much more added over time.
[03:15:57] * Kirben wonders what ever happened to EAX 3 that was due months/years ago
[03:16:45] * Kirben then remembers that now the Aureal is gone, CL no longer need to improve their 3D Sound to keep up
[03:16:51] * Dominus wonders what is up with the new liveware that is old as smelling cheese
[03:17:43] * Dominus hates when he gets screwed by big companies
[03:18:07] * Dominus promises never to buy a CL product again
[03:19:41] <Kirben> Only reason I bought this SB Live Value sound card was that is only one with W2K drivers at time.
[03:21:00] <Dominus> I didnīt want to go without soundfonts feature
[03:21:52] * Dominus wonders why Jeffīs posts to the mailinglist are often from one day in the future
[03:22:09] <Kirben> different timezone I guess
[03:22:21] <Kirben> A few other sound cards do soundfonts
[03:22:39] <Kirben> I know Vortex 2 has some support for them
[03:22:52] <Dominus> hmm, couldnīt find them at that time
[03:24:49] <Dominus> about jeffīs, itīs strange that some posts like Re: [Exult-general] Future plans?? have a send time from him of 1 day in the future and others are just from the right time
[03:25:14] <Dominus> this is one of the big problems I spend my time pondering on
[03:25:21] <Dominus> :-)
[03:25:40] <Dominus> maybe itīs just sourceforge
[03:28:16] <Dominus> speaking of them, it seems their file server is down! the download counter of the alpha 4 release stays the same now for almost two days and I am unable to download the actual release
[03:30:24] <Kirben> I can dcc copy
[03:31:31] <Kirben> BTW would be worth adding will there be an Exult for Ultima 8 to FAQ too.
[03:31:58] <Dominus> or better will there be Exult for any other Ultimas
[03:32:00] <Dominus> :-)
[03:32:09] <Dominus> thx, good point
[03:33:48] <Dominus> about the release, itīs not urgent, I got the newest snapshot from you anyway, I just want it for comparing errors and such
[03:34:21] <Dominus> your new host doesnīt like my firewall (atguard)
[03:35:08] <Dominus> as it filters out java scripts and ads :-)
[03:36:08] <Dominus> but when I disable it, the download works fine and at a normal to slow speed (thank god the snaps are not big)
[03:36:37] <Kirben> At least it has less ads than spaceports and no pop up ads
[03:36:55] <Kirben> Odd part is I can't download from my own site
[03:37:28] <Dominus> do you have some java script filter or cookie filter or disabled it in the browser?
[03:37:50] <Kirben> no filters, let me double check ie settings...
[03:37:58] <Dominus> I only saw the ads on spaceport when I accessed it from my mothers pc
[03:39:26] <Kirben> looks fine, although my ISP has weird double transparent proxy setup which could be the cause.
[03:39:34] <Dominus> could be
[03:48:22] <Kirben> hmm got exult compiling again but I'm still not sure if server section should be used on win32
[03:50:17] <Kirben> I was right, jeff just fix it. Time to recompile
[03:52:41] <Dominus> Kirben: did you include the newest FAQ in the new built?
[03:53:58] <Kirben> yes
[03:54:06] <Dominus> :-)
[03:54:41] <Dominus> though I wonder if anybody bothers with the txt version (as it is rather ugly)
[03:56:18] <Kirben> Text version is still as readable
[03:57:08] <Dominus> it is but I rather read the html one .-)
[03:58:50] <Kirben> Well could always include html FAQ file instead of text FAQ file...
[04:00:06] <Dominus> the people have to download Exult anyway from the web so they should have a browser, donīt they?
[04:01:26] <Kirben> Yes they should have one, browser is really standard in any operating system now
[04:06:47] <Dominus> well, letīs ask the others some time
[04:07:09] <Dominus> exultbot: what do you think?
[04:09:42] <Kirben> New exult snapshots online
[04:21:45] <Dominus> have to go, cu
[04:21:47] <-- Dominus has left #Exult
[05:57:47] --> matt0 has joined #exult
[07:44:46] --> Kirben2 has joined #exult
[07:44:50] <-- Kirben has left IRC (Read error to Kirben[co3007967-a.brasd1.vic.optushome.com.au]: Connection reset by peer)
[07:46:37] --> urgepompa has joined #exult
[07:46:43] --- urgepompa is now known as sty_
[07:47:14] <sty_> ave
[07:54:51] --> Kirben has joined #exult
[07:55:53] <-- Kirben2 has left IRC (Read error to Kirben2[co3007967-a.brasd1.vic.optushome.com.au]: Connection reset by peer)
[08:08:11] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[08:15:20] <Nadir> hi all
[08:21:25] <sty_> hi
[08:41:07] <Nadir> kirben: prohosting is awfully slow...
[08:42:02] <Kirben> how slow ?
[08:44:40] <Nadir> 6K/sec
[08:45:59] <Nadir> spaceports was about 30/40 K/src
[08:46:06] <Nadir> sec
[08:46:53] <Kirben> Well which is better ? more speed more ads or less speed less ads ?
[08:47:20] <Nadir> :)
[08:47:27] <Nadir> xoom?
[08:48:16] <sty_> kewl! i've killed batlin with a fellowship staff!
[08:48:31] <Kirben> I got kicked off there once
[08:48:55] <Kirben> Never found out why, http://members.xoom.com/Kirben/
[08:50:37] <Kirben> What is xoom speed like now ?
[08:53:41] <sty_> free webspaces are often too restrictive, if you're not getting deleted probably you have a classic "hello my name is bob, check my photo then piss off"
[08:54:07] <sty_> :)
[08:54:56] <Kirben> Yep my last xoom site would have eaten up alot of bandwidth which is why I think it went down. I had all of Aureal's drivers on there for awhile...
[08:55:10] <sty_> no politic stuff, no sex, no drugs, no zips, no mp3s , no discriminating docs: NO LIFE :)
[08:55:48] <Kirben> Ended up moving it to my personal space with no files, sites rarely changed now http://members.optushome.com.au/kirben/
[08:57:09] <Kirben> The worse part of those free site is most don't make all limitations clear either, many limit file sizes or file types but it is only mentioned in the fine print or hlep section.
[08:58:14] <sty_> they're quite unuseful, also if you consider the transfer rate of the uploading
[08:59:03] <Kirben> hmm that old site still gets almost 100 hits a day
[08:59:16] <Kirben> Might have to end up moving that again too
[09:01:17] <Kirben> 100 hits a day x 30 days, I wonder how much bandwdith that would use
[09:02:58] <Kirben> hmm would be about 45MB I think, that isn't too bad
[09:03:26] <Kirben> I'm stuck with 300MB bandwidth per month on personal web space
[09:05:35] <Kirben> hmm exult and windrop sites get 100-150 a day unique, 300-500 a day raw.
[09:06:18] <Kirben> For June 2001 the total bandwidth of those 2 was 1642MB
[09:06:47] <Kirben> Not bad for a free site
[09:07:23] <Nadir> http://exult.sf.net is over 100000 page views...
[09:07:45] <Kirben> per week/month ?
[09:08:59] <Nadir> since restyling
[09:09:28] <Kirben> Thats a huge amount of views
[09:09:40] <Kirben> hmm this looks bad:
[09:09:42] <Kirben> (d) By submitting your content to NBCi through the Storage Services, you grant NBCi a world-wide, royalty-free, perpetual, irrevocable, nonexclusive, unrestricted license to use, copy, transmit, publicly display, publicly perform, create compilations including, and distribute such content, and any associated content, for the purposes of publishing and promoting such content in connection with the NBCi Site and the Storage Services, and
[09:09:59] <Nadir> http://sourceforge.net/project/stats/index.php?report=months&group_id=2335
[09:16:46] <Kirben> Shame more people didn't click on those spaceports ads, if there had been 500 clicks I could have used exchange click for no-ads option
[09:24:06] <Kirben> any other suggestions of free sites ?
[09:25:36] <Nadir> sf
[09:26:03] <Kirben> But isn't sf usually even slower speed ?
[09:28:34] <Nadir> maybe
[09:38:12] <Kirben> Plus Dominus mentioned earlier that the alpha4 download seems to have been down a few days (counter doesn't change) and it is on SF
[09:43:49] --> wjp has joined #exult
[09:43:54] <wjp> hi
[09:44:34] <wjp> Kirben: I think just the SF d/l stats are broken (again). I can download alpha4 just fine
[09:44:35] <Kirben> I think I will end up paying for no-ads option at spaceports when I can afford it, doesn't seem any good option. Shame there are no decent resonably priced Australin web site hosts
[09:44:37] <sty_> hi
[09:44:43] <Kirben> Hi wjp
[09:45:05] <Kirben> doesn't seem any other good option Imean
[09:45:27] <Kirben> doesn't seem to be any other good option I mean
[09:45:39] * Kirben slaps Kirben around a bit with a large trout
[09:47:46] <Nadir> wjp: I've done a bit of work on the Video Options gump
[09:48:16] <wjp> how is it coming along?
[09:49:32] <Nadir> Well. I have a question though. Is it better to have the multiple choices activated as toggles (like the conversion in MIDI) or with left/right arrows
[09:49:40] <Nadir> I prefer the latter.
[09:50:06] <wjp> hmm
[09:50:42] <Kirben> I like the first option, uses less screen space
[09:50:49] <wjp> I think arrows would be nice for the resolution,
[09:51:06] <wjp> but for others it a simple toggle would do just fine
[09:51:11] <wjp> s/it //
[09:52:22] <Nadir> ok
[09:54:57] <Nadir> What do you think about Dominik's idea on Exult Isle?
[09:55:11] <wjp> pretty cool :-)
[09:55:41] <Nadir> Actually it should be called "Sourceforge Isle" as a homage.
[09:56:14] <wjp> hmm, it should?
[09:56:25] <Kirben> Exult Isle? where was that mentioned ?
[09:57:01] <Nadir> on the mailing list
[09:57:41] <wjp> it's in the 'keyring' thread
[09:57:50] <Nadir> http://www.geocrawler.com/lists/3/SourceForge/3108/0/6106419/
[09:59:36] <Kirben> ah yes, good idea for sure
[10:00:14] <Nadir> Kirben the artist ? :)
[10:00:16] <sty_> hey, there are a snes version of ultima 7
[10:00:41] <Nadir> it's horrible
[10:00:46] <Kirben> No, I'm terrible a drawing
[10:00:55] <Nadir> Ah, but you take snapshots !
[10:01:14] <Nadir> sty_: the only good thing about u7/snes is smooth scrolling
[10:01:19] <Kirben> programming will be by area one day....
[10:01:26] <sty_> nadir: but it's the same engine, or it isn't ?
[10:01:42] <Nadir> not really. It's a cut down version
[10:02:43] <sty_> uh ...
[10:02:50] <sty_> damn , i'm curious
[10:03:05] <sty_> :)
[10:04:28] <Kirben> Personally I would rather be an animal, any type
[10:05:05] <Nadir> like sherry the fox
[10:05:28] <Kirben> Is there any unused graphics in Ultima 7 BG/SI maybe that could be used ?
[10:05:31] <wjp> sherry the fox?
[10:05:41] <Kirben> Thats sherry the mouse
[10:05:52] <Kirben> and there is that talking horse and fox
[10:06:00] <sty_> unicorn
[10:06:03] <wjp> or Frank the fox
[10:06:13] <sty_> the virgin detector :)
[10:06:21] <Nadir> Frank !
[10:07:18] <Nadir> If you are playing the SNES version of Ultima 7, please do yourself a favor, and throw that piece of garbage away. It is by far the WORST game port that I have ever seen. So throw it away, and go buy the Ultima 7 Complete, or the Ultima Collection to play the actual game the way it was meant to be played.
[10:07:32] <Nadir> That is from one of the u7 walkthroughs
[10:08:10] <Nadir> kirben the donkey
[10:08:16] <wjp> hmm, those prerendered chunk flats help quite a lot in normal gameplay
[10:08:31] <Kirben> There are donkey's in Ultima 7 ?
[10:08:34] <sty_> nadir: for god's sake, i've already got the pc version of bg and si !
[10:08:44] <Kirben> Reminders me of Shrek
[10:08:59] <Nadir> I know. I was just pointing it out
[10:09:01] <sty_> i was just curious to see that conversion to have a laugh :)
[10:09:35] <sty_> i miss the add-ons ...
[10:09:40] <sty_> :(
[10:10:23] <Kirben> I thought an extra isle would have to stick to Ultima 7 parts only ? or could extra graphics be added too ?
[10:10:44] <wjp> we can do anything we want :-)
[10:10:49] <wjp> it's our engine ;-)
[10:11:35] <Kirben> cool
[10:11:51] * Nadir the amoeba
[10:13:57] <Kirben> Talking of editing, has exult_studio code changed to linux only ?
[10:14:04] <wjp> Exult now uses about 40% CPU in (point) scaled mode, and about 10% unscaled on my athlon 700
[10:14:30] <Kirben> Last I tried, I got some errors about exult_server
[10:16:40] <sty_> this snes version is f**** politically correct
[10:18:48] <sty_> ghaw , this version is retarded :))
[10:20:29] <Nadir> The best move would be to use SDL_net and port GTK+ to use SDL. That would give us auto-porting :)
[10:21:51] <Kirben> let me get exact error again, been awhile since I last tried...
[10:22:17] <Kirben> Would TCL be of any use ? it has many ports
[10:24:26] <Nadir> Kirben: give up on Exult Studio for the moment
[10:25:08] <Nadir> We'll worry about porting later
[10:25:15] <Kirben> ok I just like to try and keep the makefile current if possible
[10:28:34] <Kirben> x-server is always progressing over time too, so more chance of working
[10:30:01] --> Wumpus has joined #exult
[10:32:52] <sty_> 'seeyaa
[10:32:53] <sty_> :)
[10:32:59] <-- sty_ has left IRC ()
[10:33:42] * Kirben just can't resist experimenting with Exult_Studio
[10:33:50] <Nadir> install Linux :)
[10:40:26] <Kirben> Cygwin is close enough for me
[10:43:25] <Nadir> Why don't you use an X server then
[10:45:12] <Kirben> I have the Xfree86 port installed too
[10:47:36] <Kirben> ok this was the error:
[10:47:37] <Kirben> g++ -O2 -DSIZEOF_SHORT=2 -DSIZEOF_INT=4 -DCYGWIN -I.. -I../shapes -I../mapedit -
[10:47:37] <Kirben> I../imagewin -I../files -I../server `gtk-config --cflags` `libglade-config --cfl
[10:47:37] <Kirben> ags` -c -o studio.o studio.cc
[10:47:37] <Kirben> studio.cc: In method `ExultStudio::ExultStudio(int, char **)':
[10:47:37] <Kirben> studio.cc:127: implicit declaration of function `int getopt(...)'
[10:47:39] <Kirben> studio.cc: In method `void ExultStudio::read_from_server()':
[10:47:41] <Kirben> studio.cc:596: `Exult_server' undeclared (first use this function)
[10:47:43] <Kirben> studio.cc:596: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once
[10:47:45] <Kirben> studio.cc:596: for each function it appears in.)
[10:48:32] <Nadir> Kirben: Is it that important ?
[10:50:03] <Kirben> wait just a minunte...
[10:51:00] <Kirben> Yes there is quite a large interest
[10:51:29] <Wumpus> hehe you went off for a minute to generate it ? ;-p
[10:51:56] <Kirben> no
[10:51:58] <Nadir> Is it quite important to sort out these bugs NOW ? ExultStudio isn't really that functional to justify the work that goes into verifying that it works on other platforms.
[10:53:08] <Nadir> Sorry for being blunt, but the source is there. If you want it to work on your system, do it.
[10:53:14] <Kirben> Well if I eventually get a working build it could save work later adding in extra libraries to allow porting
[10:54:38] <Kirben> ok just one quick question then, is config.h generated by exult configure ?
[10:57:25] <Wumpus> /* config.h. Generated automatically by configure. */
[10:57:32] <Wumpus> that would suggest so, hmm?
[10:58:11] <Kirben> ok was just looking at server.cc
[10:58:30] <Kirben> Time to compile sdl first then
[11:00:43] <Kirben> I guess that problem is caused by trying to compile just the studio instead of whole exult
[11:01:04] <Nadir> kirben: no it's caused by not including some header
[11:01:19] <wjp> or by said header being #ifdef XWIN'ed
[11:02:41] <wjp> take a look at servemsg.h
[11:05:09] <Kirben> ok looks like I still need to buld whole exult to get required config.h for server.cc though
[11:07:16] <wjp> just running configure will generate config.h
[11:07:38] <wjp> but it shouldn't really need config.h
[11:08:04] <wjp> take a look at the top of some other .cc file; that's how config.h should be included
[11:08:59] <wjp> (above all other includes, and #ifdef HAVE_CONFIG_H'ed)
[11:10:18] <Kirben> Thanks, found it
[11:18:06] <Kirben> odd, server.cc includes config.h twice
[11:19:31] <wjp> hmm, yeah, that's weird
[11:30:33] <Kirben> Could you fix server.cc in cvs ? add the #ifdef HAVE_CONFIG_H and remove the extra config.h
[11:30:48] <Kirben> other than that it still seems to compile file
[11:30:52] <Kirben> file=fine
[11:33:45] <wjp> done
[11:37:36] <Nadir> bbl
[11:37:48] <-- Nadir has left #exult
[11:41:18] <Kirben> exult_studio sure needs a stack more compiled in now.
[12:03:10] <wjp> I have to go
[12:03:12] <wjp> see you later
[12:03:20] <-- wjp has left IRC ([x]chat)
[12:18:16] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[12:18:49] <Nadir> b
[13:18:36] --> fingolfin has joined #exult
[13:18:40] <fingolfin> hiya
[13:19:50] <Nadir> hi
[13:20:11] <Nadir> Have you decided what you're going to be in Exult Isle ?
[13:21:13] <fingolfin> huh?
[13:21:29] <fingolfin> ah ok
[13:21:35] <fingolfin> you talk about domīs email! ;)
[13:21:42] <fingolfin> hmmmmmmm
[13:23:31] <fingolfin> maybe a hermit who is erratically coming to town? or a crazy mathemagician? uhmm... ;) "Fingolfin" is a high lord of the high-elves... there are no elves in U7, thoug...
[13:23:55] <Wumpus> worse luck :| ;-p
[13:24:12] <fingolfin> Fingolfin also was a brave warrior that fought with evil Morgoth, who eventually killed him, but not before Fin inflicted seven painful lasting wounds... ;) still not very helpful, I think
[13:24:39] <fingolfin> tristan: what about you? do you already have something?
[13:25:01] --> Colourless has joined #Exult
[13:25:08] <fingolfin> hi ryan
[13:25:12] <Nadir> Well, Nadir could be an astronomer
[13:25:12] <Colourless> hi
[13:25:15] <fingolfin> Mr "Invisible" ;)
[13:25:21] <fingolfin> Nadir: right
[13:25:22] <Colourless> lots of people tonight
[13:25:30] <fingolfin> tonight??? it is bright day ;)
[13:25:31] <Colourless> yeah, it's Mr Invisible
[13:25:35] <Nadir> wjp was here earlier
[13:25:44] <fingolfin> ?seen wjp
[13:25:44] <exultbot> wjp left IRC around Thu Jul 5 12:03:20 2001 (GMT) ([x]chat)
[13:25:46] <Colourless> tis 22:54 here
[13:25:55] <fingolfin> 15:24 here
[13:26:11] <fingolfin> and I will have a soccer match in one hour (students vs. profs/assistants ;)
[13:26:28] <fingolfin> and I write an exam tomorrow, now that I think of it... and I am supposed to learn, not to chat here, but
[13:26:43] <fingolfin> thanx to GhostView, I can do both at the same time - reading the lecture notes and chatting in x-chat ;)
[13:27:05] <Wumpus> :)
[13:27:05] <Wumpus> in the meantime, i have nothing to do, but its bed time all the same :)
[13:27:14] <-- Wumpus has left IRC (zZzZzZ)
[13:33:40] <-- Kirben has left IRC (System Meltdown)
[13:34:49] <Colourless> fingolfin: i've been looking at the new scale code, i've been thinking, it may be possible to make it even faster. Of course, first I would prefer your opinion on one aspect
[13:35:07] <Colourless> You are doing the following:
[13:35:08] <Colourless> data = *source2++;
[13:35:08] <Colourless> *dest2++ = data;
[13:35:08] <Colourless> *dest2++ = data;
[13:35:38] <Colourless> do you think that it would be faster to have dest2 and data being uint16s and doing the following?
[13:35:43] <Colourless> data = *source++;
[13:35:51] <Colourless> data |= data << 8;
[13:35:58] <Colourless> *dest2++ = data;
[13:36:29] <fingolfin> wait a sec, I do what???? maybe wjp changed the code later?
[13:36:30] * fingolfin looks
[13:39:00] <fingolfin> ah, wjp added special code for n=2
[13:39:57] <fingolfin> Colourless: Iīd say itīs hard to tell which is faster, but I guess you might be right
[13:40:05] <fingolfin> one would have to actually try it out
[13:40:31] <fingolfin> donīt forget, if you change the definition of data2, then do it locally to the case n=2 ;)
[13:40:58] <Colourless> yeah
[13:42:22] <fingolfin> I knew youīd know, but I prefer mentioning it, before we discover some time later that n=3 doesnīt work anymore, and then wonder why ;)
[13:42:30] <Colourless> i've also been thinking that it should be possible to remove y and x and instead check against the pointer, rather than a seperated incremented value. That would reduce a cupple clocks per pass
[13:42:38] <fingolfin> hm
[13:42:44] <fingolfin> In fact, I thought about that too
[13:42:54] <fingolfin> let me relook at it and then Iīll tell you why I didnīt do it (yet) ;)
[13:44:16] * Colourless waits for a reason
[13:45:00] <fingolfin> I think I didnīt do it because in order to prevent loop end conditions like dest < (srcx+foo), we would either have to hope the compiler optimizes it, or add yet another variable
[13:45:00] <fingolfin> but
[13:45:20] <fingolfin> since we in turn get rid of a variable (x,y,off_x,off_y), it should be fine, so go ahead
[13:45:46] <fingolfin> I didnīt do it because I first wanted to see if my code run at all (which it did! surprisingly, I had no way to test it here, not even to compile it ;)
[13:47:17] <fingolfin> ..and I still canīt run ./configure here :/ who is respsonsible for configure.in, wjp? I guess I need some help fixing this
[13:48:33] <Colourless> i'll go ahead and make the changes to the scaler, though I'll probably wait till wjp is here so he can profile it
[13:48:51] <fingolfin> sounds fine
[13:49:13] <fingolfin> how fast/slow are the other scalers, anyway?
[13:50:13] <Colourless> pretty slow in comparison.
[13:50:34] * Colourless has conflicts to go find
[13:50:57] <Nadir> Fingolfin: See previous discussion on Exultbot's logs. I think they are 4/5 times slower, with SuperEagle being the slowest
[13:53:21] <fingolfin> compared to our original point blitter or the new one? =]
[13:55:28] <Colourless> i would guess the old one. the new one is much faster
[13:55:52] <fingolfin> our new point scaler is over 10 times faster than the old AFAIK...
[13:56:13] <fingolfin> of course, a lot of time is used up by SDL blitting around graphics, so the real speed up is not as high
[13:56:20] <Nadir> any way to improve 2xSaI ? (that's the one I use :)
[13:56:37] <fingolfin> optimizing the point scaler any more is probably not as helpful as optimizing other stuff, now
[13:56:54] <Colourless> yeah, there could be someways to improve it, but they are not exactly 'clean'
[13:57:04] <fingolfin> 2xSaI -> much more complicated, but I am not sure how optimizied it already is - need to look at it
[13:57:08] <fingolfin> yeah
[13:57:12] <fingolfin> obfuscated in fact ;)
[13:57:19] <fingolfin> BTW, what about the RLE stuff, did anybody look at it yet?
[13:57:22] <Colourless> yeah
[13:57:39] <Colourless> i've looked at the rle stuff, it can be improved a little bit fairly easily
[13:57:56] <Colourless> there are WAY WAY too many function calls
[13:58:05] <Colourless> they are even virtual functions as well!
[13:58:11] <fingolfin> maybe wjp can do an in-detail profiling of paint_rle? So we see whih parts of it are slowest..
[13:58:18] <fingolfin> ok ;)
[13:58:38] <Colourless> there is no need to call those functions
[13:59:48] <fingolfin> if you say it, I belive you!
[14:00:10] <fingolfin> improving the RLE code will help speed up exult regardless of the blitter, so Iīd deem it more important for now, just my two cents
[14:03:02] <fingolfin> I gotta go now, cya folks, happy coding ;)
[14:03:05] <-- fingolfin has left IRC (Client Exiting)
[14:07:53] <Nadir> bbl
[14:07:53] <Nadir> bbl
[14:07:57] <-- Nadir has left IRC (Read error to Nadir[natmi130.etnoteam.it]: Connection reset by peer)
[14:20:38] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[14:22:15] <Nadir> I'm having problems with the Video Options gump...
[14:22:39] <Colourless> explain?
[14:23:27] <Nadir> The red tick on the left is positioned about 100 pixels above the green tab
[14:23:56] <Colourless> you'll need to modify one of the methods in gumps.cc
[14:24:07] <Nadir> I cut and pasted the AudioOptions_gump.* files, removed some bits and added others
[14:24:10] <Colourless> it has all the check mark positions for the shapes
[14:28:05] <Nadir> That is ugly. Shouldn't the Gumps themselves have this info ?
[14:28:46] <Colourless> perhaps
[14:29:40] <Nadir> ok
[14:29:43] <Nadir> it works
[14:35:48] <Nadir> video options: res, scaler, scaling, fullscreen. Anything else ?
[14:35:59] <Colourless> gamma correction
[14:36:09] <Nadir> aha.
[14:36:31] * Colourless just did a rather large commit
[14:37:59] <Nadir> cvs update hangs at the end for me...
[14:40:16] <Colourless> that's bad
[14:40:31] <Nadir> also no mail from sf
[14:42:15] <Nadir> so it finally compiles with MSVC
[14:42:21] <Colourless> yeah
[14:42:45] <Nadir> MSVC should generate slightly better code than gcc
[14:42:59] <Colourless> yeah, it should
[14:43:15] <Nadir> but then again it's mono-cpu, mono-platform, mono-language.
[14:43:27] <Nadir> whereas gcc is not
[14:46:58] <Colourless> true. But MSVC still compiles Exult much faster than gcc.
[14:48:07] <Nadir> PCH
[14:48:13] <Colourless> yeah
[14:48:21] <Nadir> PCH is coming to gcc in 3.1
[14:58:10] <Nadir> Can we now do more than x2 scaling ?
[14:58:25] <Colourless> not yet. exult is broken in other places
[14:59:20] <Colourless> i'm probably going to fix that tonight
[15:00:34] <Nadir> and allow 2x and 3x ?
[15:00:46] <Colourless> yeah
[15:08:17] <Nadir> 4x?
[15:08:26] <Colourless> that too
[15:08:28] <Nadir> not useful maybe...
[15:08:58] <Colourless> perhaps not, but any factor will be allowed
[15:09:17] <Colourless> integer factor that is
[15:18:16] <Nadir> did you receive mail from exult-cvs-logs ?
[15:18:46] <Colourless> no
[15:20:13] <Nadir> odd. SF's mail server seems screwed
[15:26:30] <Colourless> yeah, I just got an email from my mail server saying it couldn't deliver an email to exult-general
[15:26:40] <Colourless> i sent that email 2 hours ago
[21:09:30] --> exultbot has joined #exult
[21:09:30] --- Topic for #exult is: Exult, the open source Ultima 7 and U7 part 2 engine
[21:09:30] --- Topic for #exult set by ChanServ at Tue Jul 3 22:55:32 2001
[21:12:20] <wjp> hmm... big commit :-)
[21:12:30] <Colourless> yep
[21:26:19] <wjp> hey, it still compiles ;-)
[21:26:42] <Colourless> what did you expect? ;-)
[21:28:49] <sty> seeya people
[21:28:53] <wjp> bye
[21:28:58] <Colourless> bye
[21:29:02] <-- sty has left IRC ()
[21:30:40] <wjp> hmm, I should go too
[21:30:44] <wjp> night
[21:30:47] <Colourless> night
[21:30:51] <-- wjp has left IRC ([x]chat)
[22:48:52] <-- Colourless has left IRC (Got Coloured)