#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 7 Aug 2001 (GMT)

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[00:00:08] <Fingolfin> uhm, thoxa?
[00:00:09] <Fingolfin> well
[00:00:17] <Fingolfin> it is bad, you won't get your hourglass
[00:00:33] <realmz> Ah
[00:00:44] <Fingolfin> if you want to play the game for real, you shouldn't use the cheat as it can get you into a state where you can't solve the game anymore
[00:00:50] <Fingolfin> unless you cheat more of course ;)
[00:00:50] <realmz> The first time I played it under Exult I never even knew she existed
[00:00:57] <Fingolfin> hehe
[00:01:20] <Fingolfin> SI support still has some way to go before you can fully complete SI w/o cheating
[00:01:23] <realmz> I can't answer those questions.. I lost the documentation
[00:01:48] <Fingolfin> hm, bad :/
[00:03:16] <-- chimera|wookin has left IRC (Ping timeout for chimera|wookin[holladay.cb-travel.com])
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[00:05:18] <realmz> So anyone here, worked with SDL in Exult?
[00:11:11] <Fingolfin> uhm
[00:11:23] <Fingolfin> exult is SDL based; for sure ;)
[00:11:53] <Fingolfin> I must admit I never had to deal with our SDL code much, but what do you want to know? ;)
[00:12:55] <realmz> If Exult uses SDL_SetAlpha()
[00:13:56] <Fingolfin> nope
[00:14:40] <realmz> So how does it do transperancy?
[00:17:57] <Fingolfin> well, masks and RLE sprites
[00:18:10] <Fingolfin> we are given our graphics data already, obviously ;)
[00:18:36] <Fingolfin> take a look at shapes/vgafile.cc
[00:18:41] <Fingolfin> paint_rle_translucent
[00:19:04] <Fingolfin> and also in the imagewin subdir
[00:19:26] <realmz> I'm guessing a lot of the SDL graphics functions used are undocumented
[00:19:55] <Fingolfin> ?!? nope
[00:19:58] <Fingolfin> not at all
[00:20:11] <Fingolfin> we are not using "alpha channels" if you think of that
[00:20:17] <Fingolfin> i.e. no "half translucent" stuff
[00:20:34] <Fingolfin> if there is a part of the image that is to be translucehnt, then we simply don't draw at this sport
[00:20:38] <Fingolfin> s/sport/spot
[00:21:25] <realmz> You mean Exult does its own image loading
[00:21:48] <Fingolfin> of course
[00:21:55] <Fingolfin> it has to
[00:22:25] <realmz> I wish I could find a GOOD document on the BMP format
[00:22:41] <Fingolfin> why? unless you *have* to use it, avoid it like hell ;)
[00:23:37] <realmz> Well, I'm working on a project 'like' exult. Like exult my data is already provided as windows/dos bitmaps
[00:23:51] <Fingolfin> :/
[00:24:10] <Fingolfin> sorry, I can't point you to a good BMP ref; maybe SDL_image supports BMP?
[00:24:34] <realmz> The bad thing is that I can't figure out how the fonts and sprites are stored in the file so I had to create my own ugly font system and make my own sprites
[00:25:02] * Fingolfin discovers that SDL has built-in BMP support
[00:25:09] <Fingolfin> hmm
[00:25:11] <realmz> SDL itself supports BMP. That's all it supports but to load the image myself I need docs
[00:25:30] <Fingolfin> reverse engineering of game data is not an easy task; you need a lot patience & time for it
[00:25:50] <Fingolfin> well, SDL source is available ;)
[00:25:58] <Fingolfin> and then there is google to search for docs
[00:26:07] <realmz> I found half the useful functions in SDL by going through the sources
[00:35:03] --> Black-Thorn has joined #exult
[00:37:15] <Fingolfin> hi
[00:39:10] <Black-Thorn> hi
[00:41:38] --> Kirben has joined #exult
[00:41:55] <Kirben> Hi
[00:42:03] <Kirben> Compile problem with current CVS:
[00:42:04] <Kirben> g++ -mno-cygwin -O2 -include mingw_kludges.h -mno-cygwin -DWIN32 -DVERSION=\"0.9
[00:42:04] <Kirben> 4cvs\" -DEXULT_DATADIR=\"data\" -DDEBUG -DSIZEOF_SHORT=2 -DSIZEOF_INT=4 -I./imag
[00:42:04] <Kirben> ewin -I./shapes -I./files -I. -I./audio -I./conf -I./data -I./gumps -I./objs -I.
[00:42:04] <Kirben> /pathfinder -I./usecode -I./sdl/include -c -o combat.o combat.cc
[00:42:04] <Kirben> In file included from sdl/include/SDL_audio.h:33,
[00:42:06] <Kirben> from audio/SDL_mapping.h:26,
[00:42:08] <Kirben> from audio/Audio.h:27,
[00:42:10] <Kirben> from combat.cc:33:
[00:42:12] <Kirben> files/utils.h:34: previous declaration of `int _snprintf(char *, unsigned int, c
[00:42:14] <Kirben> onst char *, ...)' with C++ linkage
[00:42:16] <Kirben> c:/mingw/bin/../lib/gcc-lib/mingw32/2.95.3-5/../../../../include/stdio.h:199: co
[00:42:18] <Kirben> nflicts with new declaration with C linkage
[00:42:18] <Fingolfin> slow down ;)
[00:42:33] <Kirben> is mingw_kludges.h hack no longer needed ?
[00:42:33] <Fingolfin> this time it is not my faule but tristan's ;)
[00:42:44] <Fingolfin> no idea... hmm
[00:44:30] <Fingolfin> I have no idea how ming/compiling on windows works; but it seems you need to #define HAVE_SNPRINTF 1 in some header file
[00:44:42] <Fingolfin> preferably one that is included in all source files
[00:45:09] <Fingolfin> hmmm
[00:45:28] * Fingolfin reads mingw_kludges.h
[00:45:50] <Fingolfin> ok, you have two choices: remove mingw_kludges.h, or add the abovementioned #define to it
[00:47:46] <Kirben> cool, I guess that means we can finally get rid of mingw_kludges.h
[00:48:01] <Fingolfin> aye
[00:49:03] <TonyHoyt> night guys...
[00:49:07] <-- TonyHoyt has left IRC ()
[00:49:22] <Kirben> hmm another file still needs mingw_kludges.h though
[00:49:48] <Kirben> g++ -mno-cygwin -mwindows -o tools/expack.exe tools/expack.o U7file.o Flex.o IFF
[00:49:48] <Kirben> .o Table.o Flat.o utils.o listfiles.o -mconsole
[00:49:48] <Kirben> tools/expack.o(.text+0x13ac):expack.cc: undefined reference to `snprintf(char *,
[00:49:48] <Kirben> unsigned int, char const *,...)'
[00:50:22] <-- Black-Thorn has left IRC ('night)
[00:51:17] <Fingolfin> it doesn't #include utils-h ?!?
[00:51:34] * Fingolfin checks
[00:52:01] * Fingolfin wonders where snprintg is actually implemented
[00:54:35] <Fingolfin> Tristan forgot to add snprintf.cc to CVS ;)
[00:54:38] <Fingolfin> I'll email to the mailing list
[01:09:22] <Fingolfin> kirben: still there?
[01:09:27] <Kirben> yes
[01:16:17] <Fingolfin> did you get it to work?
[01:17:57] <Kirben> oh, I was going to wait until fix
[01:18:20] <Fingolfin> ok, but that will be tomorrow, when tristan is back
[01:18:55] <Kirben> only last 3 cvs updates from you since last cvs snapshots
[01:19:07] <Kirben> That be be tonight here
[01:19:12] <Kirben> That will be tonight here
[01:19:52] <Fingolfin> well, he won't be here before 8 hours from now I'd guess
[01:20:15] <Kirben> Thats fine, I can wait
[01:22:15] <Kirben> Another Ultima 7 developer dropped by forum, hopefully that will really help out.
[01:28:24] <Fingolfin> it will be
[01:28:39] <Fingolfin> I hope ;)
[01:42:04] <-- realmz has left IRC ([x]chat)
[02:08:49] <Fingolfin> night
[02:08:50] <-- Fingolfin has left IRC (42)
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[02:13:54] <hebble> hi all
[02:19:44] --> Euan has joined #exult
[02:19:50] <Euan> hello
[02:20:34] <Euan> what directory structure should i use to have black gate and serpents isle working from the same exult installation?
[02:21:09] <Kefka> you can use any structure as long as you specify the correct paths in exult.cfg
[02:21:45] <Euan> thankyou
[02:21:49] <Kefka> np
[02:24:20] <Euan> what does the addon add to SI, exactly?
[02:25:29] <Kefka> well, exult isn't really an addon per se..
[02:26:10] <Kefka> its more of an enhanced version of U7.. adds things like Keyboard shortcuts, a much better savegame system
[02:26:19] <Kefka> in BG, you can have paperdolls
[02:26:27] <Euan> oh, i know what exult is
[02:26:46] <Euan> hehe
[02:26:50] <Kefka> what addon were you refering to?
[02:26:59] <Euan> silver seed, i think its called
[02:26:59] <Kefka> the one in the forums?
[02:27:01] <Kefka> oh
[02:27:22] <Kefka> well, its just another place to go and complete more quests
[02:27:32] <Kefka> adds depth to the game
[02:28:36] <Kefka> i don't know if its playable without cheating currently though.. there may be some plot stopping bugs still
[02:28:54] <Kefka> but they're being fixed everyday
[02:29:03] <Euan> what do i have to add to exult.cfg to be able to play serpents isle?
[02:30:02] <Kefka> http://exult.sourceforge.net/docs.php#N70
[02:30:06] <Kefka> read that
[02:30:08] <Euan> thankyou
[02:30:12] <Kefka> tells you everything you need to know
[02:30:13] <Kefka> np
[02:33:33] <Euan> ok, ive just discovered the exult.cfg.example in my exult directory
[02:33:45] <Euan> hah
[02:34:52] <Kefka> ah :)
[02:37:10] <Euan> what does the following refer to?
[02:37:11] <Euan> <waves>
[02:37:11] <Euan> data/jmsfx.flx
[02:37:11] <Euan> </waves>
[02:37:18] <hebble> sound effects
[02:37:21] <Euan> (taken from exult.cfg)
[02:37:29] <hebble> you can get that file off sourceforge
[02:37:37] <Euan> ok
[02:37:41] <Euan> will do
[02:38:12] <Euan> http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/exult/jmsfx.zip for blackgate?
[02:38:58] <hebble> sounds right.
[02:39:06] <Euan> ok
[02:39:27] <Euan> now i just have to wait
[02:47:37] <hebble> one note re: where to install: if you want to use the map editor (as it is now), the filesystem in which you install must support fifo nodes.
[02:48:26] <Euan> i'm using the win32 version in this box
[02:49:08] <Euan> when i get it working smoothly i'll try exult on my linux box
[02:49:13] <Euan> is there much of a difference between the internals and game engine of BG and SI?
[02:50:16] <hebble> from what i've seen, the engines are basically the same, but SI has a lot of additional usecode hooks for its more complex plot.
[02:50:51] <Euan> what is a usecode hook, exactly?
[02:53:06] <hebble> well, my terminology isn't very good, but "usecode" is essentially the code parts of U7 that make events trigger other events. these are largely external to the executable. if you're a programmer, the map-editor demo on the sourceforge site is very enlightening in terms of understanding what usecode is. so what i meant was, SI has more of this stuff.
[02:53:45] <hebble> kindof like Quake-C, if you know what that is.
[02:54:50] <Euan> well, i'm familiar with UOX (ultima online server emulator) and it has what could be called usecodes
[02:55:57] <Euan> when a certain event occurs, it triggers something else
[02:56:24] <Euan> i.e. "using" a knife lets you cut things
[02:57:45] <hebble> it also controls all the conversations, as demonstrated by the aforementioned demo.
[02:58:40] <Euan> map editor?
[03:01:53] <hebble> "exult studio". i think it only runs on linux right now.
[03:02:16] <Euan> ok
[03:04:16] <hebble> but, lest i be misunderstood, i think the demo does not require the map editor. it is merely a demo of what can be PRODUCED WITH it.
[03:04:39] <Euan> ahh
[03:04:52] <Euan> well, i have the sound effects now
[03:14:40] <Euan> ok, i have it working
[03:14:44] <hebble> cool
[03:14:57] <Euan> where can i find the default keybindings?
[03:15:14] <hebble> if you press 'h' in the game, it tells them to you
[03:15:35] <Euan> thanks
[03:15:43] <hebble> you're welcome
[03:19:50] <Euan> i'm assuming that ultima 7 has karma like nearly every other ultima
[03:20:02] <Euan> where can i find out what my karma is?
[03:21:49] <hebble> not that i know of.
[03:23:13] <Euan> darn
[03:24:29] <hebble> i don't think 8 or 9 have karma either, but i didn't play 9 that much.
[03:24:44] <Euan> i'm pretty sure 8 doesnt
[03:25:13] <Euan> because most of the things you have to do to advance in the story are pretty evil
[03:26:17] <-- matt0 has left IRC (Laserdisc Arcade Emulation Project: http://daphne.rulecity.com , get your CVS password today! =])
[03:32:28] <Euan> ok, i'm going to play u7 now
[03:32:32] <Euan> thanks for your help
[03:32:33] <Euan> bye
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[06:10:46] --- ChanServ has changed the topic to: Exult, the open source Ultima 7 and U7 part 2 engine
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[07:50:24] <hebble> hi matt
[07:50:33] <matt0> hebble!
[07:50:56] <matt0> I am having some significant RAM problems .. :(
[07:51:04] <hebble> how so?
[07:52:30] <matt0> if I run it at 133 mhz like it's suposed to run, it fails my ram testing program pretty quickly... in addition, both sticks fail the test at 100 mhz in the center DIMM slot at 100 mhz .. I finally got stability with 1 stick in the right slot at 100 mhz which is what I'm at now
[07:52:42] <matt0> I'm woried that the motherboard might be the problem... :(
[07:53:39] <-- hebble has left IRC (Read error to hebble[c1577942-b.chmpgn1.il.home.com]: EOF from client)
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[07:54:00] <hebble> god damn it, xmms just crashed my xchat.
[07:54:44] <hebble> what kind of ram test program are you using?
[07:55:27] --> Euan has joined #exult
[07:55:33] <Euan> hello
[07:55:44] <Euan> ive just been playing black gate
[07:55:57] <Euan> and my cart is stuck
[07:56:16] <Euan> near the fellowship playhouse thingy just out of trinsic
[07:56:24] <Euan> how can i dislodge it?
[07:56:36] <Euan> i cant even get off it
[07:56:47] <hebble> you could try to hack move (alt-h) whatever is in your way out of the way
[07:57:13] <hebble> you could teleport (alt-t) away from the cart and get a new one or the flying carpet
[07:57:46] <Euan> how do i get the flying carper?
[07:58:11] <Euan> (i hackmoved the steps, now i'm unstuck, but i accidently mutilated my cart
[07:58:18] <hebble> if you don't know, you should probably pretend i didn't say that (i.e., wait for plot characters to mention it)
[07:58:26] <hebble> w/r/t the carpet that is
[07:59:03] <Euan> well, i know how to get it
[07:59:11] <Euan> but i'm in trinsic at the moment
[07:59:24] <matt0> hebble: I've been using memtest86
[07:59:32] <Euan> and i just want a mode of transport that isnt mutilated
[08:00:09] <hebble> Euan: the first thing i usually do after leaving trinsic is ride my cart straight north till i hit the fields northwest of britain, then walk through the mountains and get the carpet
[08:00:28] <Euan> ok, thanks
[08:01:24] <hebble> matt0: i don't know that much about ram, despite computer architecture classes ;(
[08:04:15] <Euan> ok, back to playing now :)
[08:04:17] <Euan> by
[08:04:19] <Euan> bye
[08:04:20] <-- Euan has left IRC (Peace & Protection 4.00 FINAL BETA)
[08:13:28] <hebble> ignore this: xchat says it'll highlight "exult" and "ultima" for me now.
[08:16:04] --> Dominus has joined #exult
[08:16:12] <Dominus> hi
[08:16:19] <hebble> hi dom
[08:16:41] <Dominus> for the logs: Colourless see http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a9848357/exult/forestmaster.jpg
[08:16:53] <Dominus> hi hebble
[08:17:04] <Dominus> so that door bug is fixed?
[08:17:26] <hebble> yeah, afaict.
[08:17:53] <Dominus> I canīt test it, Exult doesnīt compile
[08:18:06] * Dominus thinks it was Fingolfin again
[08:18:08] <hebble> check your email. :)
[08:18:31] <Dominus> thx, just saw it
[08:19:08] * Dominus remembers Kirbens snapshot page and downloads the latest built that compiled
[08:20:41] <matt0> Dominus!
[08:21:50] <Dominus> matt0
[08:25:50] <Dominus> damn, Kirbenīs snapshot was exactly the same I had before.
[08:26:06] <matt0> doh!
[08:30:02] <hebble> hey dom, what is that URL you put up about 15 minutes ago?
[08:30:52] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[08:47:28] <Dominus> hebble: that url is related to a problem that I think I allready outlined to you. Some guy (Iīll try to avoid spoilers) has another NPC in his inventory in SI. That NPC he has there only came with the Add-on Silver Seed so there must be some goof up.
[08:48:05] <hebble> ah.
[08:48:06] <Dominus> Colourless wanted to know what the guy has in his inventory when the add-on is not installed.
[08:48:24] <Dominus> hi Nadir
[08:48:27] <Nadir> hi
[08:48:41] <hebble> does Colourless regularly grep the logs for his name?
[08:48:44] <Dominus> you know why it doesnīt compile?
[08:49:00] <matt0> hebble: are you planning on gossiping? hehe
[08:49:08] <Dominus> hebble: no, but I think he reads the log
[08:49:15] <matt0> exultbot would be more appropriately named 'spybot' hehe
[08:49:30] <Dominus> matt0: he should be invisible
[08:49:33] <Dominus> :-)
[08:49:45] <matt0> ?seen wjp
[08:49:45] <exultbot> wjp left IRC around Mon Aug 6 23:00:57 2001 (GMT) ([x]chat)
[08:49:51] <matt0> ?seen fingolfin
[08:49:52] <exultbot> fingolfin left IRC around Tue Aug 7 02:08:50 2001 (GMT) (42)
[08:49:57] <Dominus> ?logs
[08:49:57] <exultbot> Logs are available at http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/exultlog.php3
[08:50:01] <hebble> ?seen hebble
[08:50:01] <exultbot> That's you!
[08:50:12] <hebble> hahaha!
[08:51:08] <Nadir> Dominus: I've just committed a fix for compiling in win32
[08:51:35] <Dominus> still it gives: bggame.cc: In method `void BG_Game::scene_butterfly()':
[08:51:44] <Dominus> bggame.cc:491: `::auto_ptr' undeclared (first use here)
[08:51:52] <Dominus> bggame.cc:491: parse error before `>'
[08:52:37] <Dominus> as Fingolfin was messing with the intro again I guess it was him that brooke it
[08:52:39] <matt0> butterfly!
[08:52:54] * matt0 wonders if fingolfin ever tries compiling before he commits
[08:52:58] <matt0> exultbot: and you can quote me on that :)
[08:53:23] <matt0> now fingolfin will have my hide hehe
[08:53:43] <Dominus> hehe
[08:55:24] <hebble> are there any other undocumented exultbot commands besides '?seen'?
[08:55:47] <Dominus> ?seen exultbot
[08:55:48] <exultbot> That's me!
[08:56:03] <Dominus> ?logs
[08:56:03] <exultbot> Logs are available at http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/exultlog.php3
[08:56:08] <matt0> I didn't know that exultbot was documented at all :)
[08:56:14] <hebble> ?help
[08:56:14] <Dominus> :-)
[08:56:17] <matt0> it's wjp's baby
[08:56:28] <hebble> dammit, it messaged me the ?help thing.
[08:56:35] <hebble> ?help
[08:56:43] <Dominus> and exultbot is the most talkative when wjp is around
[08:56:50] <Dominus> ?help
[08:56:51] <matt0> hehe
[08:57:10] <Dominus> ?faq
[08:57:10] <exultbot> You can find the semi-official FAQ at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/faq.shtml
[08:57:17] <Dominus> outdated
[08:57:36] <Dominus> ?snapshot
[08:57:36] <exultbot> You can find daily windows snapshots at: http://exult.on.openave.net/
[08:57:41] <Dominus> outdated
[08:57:50] <Dominus> ?exult
[08:57:50] <exultbot> Exult is a project to create an Ultima 7 game engine that runs on modern operating systems, capable of using the data and graphics files that come with the game. See http://exult.sourceforge.net/ for more information.
[08:58:03] <Dominus> ?exultbot
[08:58:03] <exultbot> Exultbot is written in Perl by Willem Jan Palenstijn.
[08:58:11] <Dominus> ?version
[08:58:11] <exultbot> The latest official version of Exult is: 0.93alpha4
[08:58:14] <matt0> ?Dominus - While not a member of the exult team (yet), Dominus enthusiastically reports bugs to Jack chaos's forums. - Outdated
[08:58:39] <Dominus> bah
[08:58:43] <matt0> ?matt0 - Sits in #exult and contributes nothing meaningful - Current.
[08:58:44] <Dominus> ?url
[08:58:44] <exultbot> The official Exult homepage is at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/
[08:58:45] <matt0> hehehehehe
[08:59:06] <Dominus> ?homepage
[08:59:06] <exultbot> The official Exult homepage is at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/
[08:59:15] <Dominus> ?ultima
[08:59:15] <exultbot> Ultima is an epic RPG game series created by Origin.
[08:59:22] <matt0> ?jackchaos
[08:59:30] <Dominus> is dead in the net
[08:59:55] <matt0> ?jackchaos - Using a giant green walking banana as their mascot, jack chaos is the fastest growing message board center on the net. - Outdated.
[09:00:21] <Dominus> it had a nice hints and walkthrough section for U9
[09:00:38] <matt0> have you played U9?
[09:00:44] <Dominus> yo
[09:00:56] <matt0> I haven't :(
[09:01:09] <matt0> but my brother told me that it is better on a Voodoo3 than on a GeForce 3 (!!)
[09:01:25] <hebble> i played it for a while, and then it stopped working after i installed the patch. so i found other ways to entertain myself.
[09:01:52] <Dominus> it didnīt play too bad on my Voodoo2
[09:02:02] <matt0> I wonder if they will ever release the source.. or if they'll "lose" it again this time
[09:02:07] <Dominus> it has glide support and that was the choice for U9
[09:03:28] <Dominus> matt0: donīt think it will ever get released
[09:10:49] --> Kirben has joined #exult
[09:10:53] <Kirben> Hi
[09:10:58] <Dominus> hi
[09:11:17] <Kirben> Nadir: Could you update makefile.cygwin too ?
[09:12:36] <Nadir> yes
[09:13:14] <Nadir> Note that it still won't compile though
[09:13:27] <Kirben> oh
[09:13:39] <Nadir> Fingolfin made some commits that break a few things
[09:13:55] <Nadir> It doesn't compile under Linux either
[09:14:05] <Dominus> and now he s probably sound asleep!
[09:14:09] <Kirben> Dominus: BTW there is no chance of win32 Exult Studio any time too, still need someone to add network support for mingw first.
[09:14:54] <Dominus> Kirben: I know, sorry if someone contacted you again because of my slip in the Forum
[09:15:17] <Dominus> "hopefully it will be ported to Windows soon"
[09:15:28] <Kirben> No one contacted me, just noticed your comment in logs a few days back.
[09:15:57] <Dominus> oh, okay
[09:16:00] <Nadir> Kirben: If/when I have enough time I might port everything to SDL_net
[09:16:06] <Kirben> Last build is online at http://exult.sourceforge.net/snapshots/Studio.zip though if you want to check it out, nothing works yet.
[09:16:18] <Kirben> Nadir: That would be great!!!!
[09:16:32] <Dominus> Kirben: what do you need to "run" it?
[09:16:42] <Dominus> or does it "run" out of the box?
[09:16:58] <Kirben> Dominus: Everything needed should be in the zip file.
[09:17:02] <Dominus> k
[09:18:01] <Kirben> hmm wait a sec, I think that upload failed.
[09:18:08] <Dominus> yep it did
[09:18:15] <Kirben> want me to dcc ?
[09:18:25] <Nadir> Why don't you two install Linux ? ExultStudio works there :)
[09:18:28] <Dominus> we can try
[09:18:37] <Dominus> dcc, I mean :-)
[09:20:14] <matt0> Dominus: I think you should install linux :)
[09:20:29] <Dominus> no way
[09:20:34] <Nadir> why not ?
[09:20:44] <Kirben> I would try linux if I had spare system
[09:20:51] <Dominus> same thought
[09:20:55] <matt0> bah
[09:21:00] <matt0> I have win98 installed on this system too
[09:21:01] <matt0> dual boot!
[09:21:03] <Nadir> just get an extra disk. They are cheap nowadays
[09:21:14] <matt0> win98, about to become win2k hehe
[09:21:20] <Nadir> I dual boot W2K and Linux on my notebook
[09:21:49] <matt0> of course, Kirben, if you started using linux, you would never want to build windows snapshots again
[09:21:53] <matt0> so maybe it's best that you don't try.. :)
[09:21:59] <Dominus> :-)
[09:22:22] <Kirben> Could be right, games don't interest me as much anymore.
[09:22:36] <Nadir> Apart from Exult of course
[09:22:42] <Kirben> Yep
[09:22:51] <matt0> Nadir: I think he is including exult in that category... maybe a subtle hint? hehe
[09:22:56] <Dominus> games would have been my main issue as well
[09:23:14] <Kirben> Dominus: Want me to resume ?
[09:23:29] <Dominus> yes please
[09:23:58] <Nadir> Bah, Wine runs lots of Win32 games fine under Linux
[09:24:15] <Dominus> this new IRC client I use is just not that good in some aspects
[09:24:28] <Nadir> Dominus: what are you using?
[09:24:32] <Kirben> I'm a bit disappointed in Win2K myself this time, barely a few months and it already needs a reinstall.
[09:24:32] <matt0> and there are several native ports (Tribes 2, Quake 1, 2, and 3, etc)
[09:24:52] <Nadir> Don't forget the BSD games :)
[09:24:58] <Dominus> Trillian, a multi-chat program (AIM, ICQ,IRC,Yahoo, MSN)
[09:25:15] <Nadir> A friend of mine uses that. He likes it
[09:25:21] <matt0> Dominus: I used to use Everybuddy in linux and it wasn't too great either
[09:25:42] <matt0> it could've been great, but it segfaulted a lot and the programmers didn't seem to be too concerned about that
[09:25:52] <matt0> those kind of combination is not a good thing for a project to be successful hehe
[09:25:55] <matt0> err that kind
[09:26:07] <Dominus> Trillian is nice but itīs still beta and especially the IRC stuff and Dcc
[09:26:42] <Dominus> I couldnßt even see how far the file transfer got and that it aborted...
[09:26:51] <matt0> hehe
[09:26:53] <Dominus> Kirben: thanks it got through now
[09:26:53] <matt0> time to switch to x-chat
[09:26:59] <matt0> oh wait I forgot..
[09:27:01] <matt0> nevermind :)
[09:27:07] <Dominus> LOL
[09:27:24] <Nadir> Since Fingolfin has switched to MacOS X he's using X-Chat as well :)
[09:27:35] <matt0> yes, I seem to remember that :)
[09:27:38] <Dominus> but apart from that I like Trillian as i use AIM and ICQ and IRC
[09:27:46] <Nadir> Dominus: ICQ# ?
[09:28:36] <Dominus> 51964865
[09:29:28] <matt0> Gideon?
[09:29:34] <Dominus> hehe
[09:29:51] <Dominus> thatīs my prefered name in games and Exult
[09:29:55] <matt0> cool
[09:35:14] <-- Nadir has left IRC (Ping timeout for Nadir[194.244.110.206])
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[09:43:51] <matt0> Fingolfin!!!! :)
[09:44:03] <Dominus> hi
[09:44:05] <Fingolfin> hiya
[09:44:14] <Fingolfin> ?seen nadir
[09:44:15] <exultbot> nadir left IRC around Tue Aug 7 09:35:14 2001 (GMT) (Ping timeout for Nadir[194.244.110.206])
[09:44:42] <Fingolfin> Nadir's CVS log message for vgafile.h "Assert is not a MacOS-specific thing, Fingolfin !"
[09:44:43] <Fingolfin> ha!
[09:44:47] <Fingolfin> not my fault
[09:45:04] <matt0> hohoho
[09:45:29] <Fingolfin> nobody included a header for assert, but it was used; this is at leasst a month back now! so I added the #include for MACOS only as it seemed to work for all other platforms.
[09:45:41] <Fingolfin> I had to fix this problem that somebody else caused.
[09:45:46] <Dominus> and what abot the one with bgame.cc?
[09:45:50] <Fingolfin> and now I'll use CVS blame to find out who didi it
[09:45:52] <matt0> poor max
[09:46:07] <Dominus> bggame.cc: In method `void BG_Game::scene_butterfly()':
[09:46:08] <Dominus> <Dominus> bggame.cc:491: `::auto_ptr' undeclared (first use here)
[09:46:11] <Dominus> <Dominus> bggame.cc:491: parse error before `>'
[09:46:57] <Fingolfin> hm
[09:47:34] <Fingolfin> strange that it doesn't work for ya...
[09:47:43] <Fingolfin> try adding an #include <memory>
[09:48:20] <Dominus> where in the file or just at the beginning?
[09:48:38] <Fingolfin> at the beginning
[09:48:59] <Dominus> compiling...
[09:49:53] <Fingolfin> aha! jeff added the assert() w/o adding a proper #include for it
[09:50:13] * Fingolfin is known for causing problems for his CVS checkins, sadly, but he is *not* the cause of all wrongs
[09:50:39] * Dominus pats Fingolfin on the head
[09:50:55] <Fingolfin> <sniff> thx <sniff> I needed that
[09:51:12] <Dominus> You know, Iīm always there for you...
[09:51:16] <Dominus> :-)
[09:51:33] <matt0> hehehe
[09:51:49] <Fingolfin> you are so good to me ;)
[09:52:01] <matt0> it seems freedman has had his share of CVS debacles :)
[09:52:06] <Fingolfin> nadir only wanted to retalitate for the fact that I pointed out he forgot snprintf ;)
[09:52:10] <Fingolfin> well
[09:52:18] <Dominus> :-)
[09:52:20] <Fingolfin> it is not easy to make sure it runs on all other platforms
[09:52:31] <Fingolfin> different build systems; different compilers; different libs
[09:52:43] <Dominus> seems to compile fine so far
[09:53:02] <Fingolfin> and having precompiled headers doesn't help me with that, either, as I often miss when I forget one include :/
[09:53:04] <Fingolfin> ok
[09:53:42] <Dominus> arghh
[09:53:46] <Dominus> no it doesnīt
[09:53:56] <Fingolfin> I begun enhancing the BG intro, but one problem: I don't have MIDI support on MacOS, so I am not sure I got the music right ... and I only worked on it till the beginning of the guardian scene
[09:54:02] <Dominus> #include <memory>
[09:54:03] <Fingolfin> dom: what now? ;)
[09:54:14] <Dominus> In file included from shapes/shapevga.h:30,
[09:54:16] <Dominus> from ./shapes/shapevga.cc:27:
[09:54:24] <Dominus> autoarray.h:41: parse error before `)'
[09:54:30] <Fingolfin> oh
[09:54:34] <Dominus> autoarray.h:42: `autoarray<T>::operator [](...)' must take exactly one argument
[09:54:37] <Fingolfin> are you using very very latest CVS????
[09:54:45] <Dominus> autoarray.h:42: confused by earlier errors, bailing out
[09:54:50] <Fingolfin> like from ten minutes ago?
[09:54:58] <Fingolfin> <cough>
[09:55:02] <Dominus> ah, no!!!
[09:55:07] <Dominus> oops...
[09:55:13] <matt0> which scaler is everyone's favorite?
[09:55:19] <Kirben> supereagle
[09:55:45] <Fingolfin> hm, i usually use 2xSai
[09:55:54] <Fingolfin> but I think point has its point, too... *speed*
[09:55:55] <Dominus> I like supereagle the best
[09:56:06] <Fingolfin> I noticed when I worked on teh "static" in the Guardian intro...
[09:56:21] <Dominus> definetly speed but supereagle and 2xSAi look soooo good
[09:56:35] <Fingolfin> it does display 20 frames of static. w/o a delay, and point scaler, it took less then a second to disply; with the better scalers it took several seconds
[09:56:38] <matt0> I bet that supereagle could be optimized more :)
[09:56:39] <Fingolfin> eheh
[09:56:39] <Fingolfin> yeah
[09:56:46] <Fingolfin> would be nice if we could speed up those more
[09:56:48] <Fingolfin> aye
[09:56:56] * matt0 might be up to the task
[09:57:04] <Fingolfin> we could even think about doing parts in assembly, in parallel to the C code, at least on some platforms...
[09:57:11] <Fingolfin> and/or using stuff like Altivec or MMX
[09:57:11] <matt0> I'd be using assembly though... so.. that would kind of not help you out, Max hehe
[09:57:14] <Dominus> matt0: yes, instead of useless blabbering here
[09:57:25] <matt0> Dominus: I enjoy hand-tuned assembly
[09:57:26] <Fingolfin> on MacOS, altivec code could be done even w/o assembly
[09:57:39] <Fingolfin> grrr
[09:57:44] <matt0> plus you can arrange the instructions in such a way to make it friendly for pipelining to get double the speed in some cases
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[09:57:56] <Fingolfin> assembly is only useful in rare cases in a *portable* program
[09:57:58] <Fingolfin> Nadir: no!
[09:58:03] <Fingolfin> Nadir: it was *NOT* my fault
[09:58:09] <matt0> I was checking out the scaler code .. I notice it uses templates
[09:58:09] <Fingolfin> Point! I am not guilty of everything
[09:58:10] <Fingolfin> ;)
[09:58:11] <matt0> that can't be fast.. :)
[09:58:15] <-- Nadir has left #exult
[09:58:17] <Fingolfin> matt0: dead wrong
[09:58:19] <Fingolfin> ups
[09:58:19] --> Nadir has joined #exult
[09:58:24] <Fingolfin> hey
[09:58:29] <Dominus> Fingolfin: see what you did to Nadir
[09:58:30] <Fingolfin> I didn't want to scare you off, Tristan! ;)
[09:58:42] <Fingolfin> matt0: templates are *compile* time
[09:58:49] <matt0> Fingolfin: is that so?
[09:58:57] <matt0> well that's good then
[09:59:00] <Nadir> What wasn't your fault ?
[09:59:05] <Fingolfin> matt0: in fact, you can get a lot of speed using templates if used correct; like getting automatically optimized version for fixed scales
[09:59:09] <Fingolfin> Nadir: the cassert
[09:59:23] <Fingolfin> Nadir: there was none include for that at all when Jeff added that code waaay back
[09:59:28] <Kirben> hebble: you awake ?
[09:59:33] <Nadir> ah, sorry
[09:59:38] <Fingolfin> Nadir: since nobody complained, and it didn't compile for me, I only addede the cassert for MacOS...
[09:59:50] <Fingolfin> Nadir: didn't want to break other OS es this time ;)
[09:59:53] <Fingolfin> no problem ;)
[09:59:56] <hebble> Kirben: yes, i am awake
[10:00:11] <Fingolfin> the reason it cropped up was that I fixed some include dependencies ;)
[10:00:41] <Kirben> hebble:Could you explain that exult-studio work around you mention at http://exult.sourceforge.net/forum/read.php?f=1&i=488&t=488 in more detail ?
[10:00:47] <Fingolfin> ah well, let's forget that silly nonsense, in most cases problems *are* my fault ;)
[10:00:56] <Kirben> hebble: I think win32 might be having same problem.
[10:01:58] <hebble> diff -u -r1.34 studio.cc
[10:01:58] <hebble> --- mapedit/studio.cc 2001/07/30 06:13:36 1.34
[10:01:58] <hebble> +++ mapedit/studio.cc 2001/08/06 20:27:45
[10:01:58] <hebble> @@ -203,7 +208,76 @@
[10:01:58] <hebble>
[10:01:59] <hebble> // More setting up...
[10:02:01] <hebble> // Connect signals automagically.
[10:02:03] <hebble> - glade_xml_signal_autoconnect(app_xml);
[10:02:05] <hebble> + //glade_xml_signal_autoconnect(app_xml);
[10:02:07] <hebble> +
[10:02:09] <hebble> + //glade_xml_signal_connect(app_xml, "XXX", XXX);
[10:02:11] <hebble> + glade_xml_signal_connect(app_xml, "on_edit_lift_spin_changed",
[10:02:13] <hebble> + (void(*)())on_edit_lift_spin_changed);
[10:02:22] <hebble> etc, for all signals. it's pretty long so i won't paste the whole thing to the channel.
[10:02:40] <Kirben> could you dcc that patch ?
[10:02:45] <Dominus> Fingolfin: compiled allright now, will you commit this bgame.cc change?
[10:02:51] <matt0> hehe.. dang.. supereagle is pretty long!
[10:02:53] <Fingolfin> sure
[10:03:00] <Fingolfin> matt0: it is
[10:03:01] <hebble> Kirben: sure, assuming i can figure out dcc. :)
[10:04:01] <hebble> actually, the patch isn't complete yet. i can't get 'cvs diff' to include new files, which i made for prototypes for the signal handler functions.
[10:04:44] <matt0> ** 2xSaI scaling filter source code adapted for Exult
[10:04:44] <matt0> ** August 29 2000, originally written in May 1999
[10:04:44] <matt0> ** by Derek Liauw Kie Fa (derek-liauw@usa.net)
[10:04:44] <matt0> ** Use of this source is free for non-commercial use
[10:04:58] <matt0> hehe... non-commercial? oops
[10:05:11] <Nadir> matt0: Derek GPLed it a while ago. That notice should be changed
[10:05:54] <Kirben> Fingolfin:btw win32 compiles fine again with memory added.
[10:06:03] <Fingolfin> good!
[10:06:06] <Fingolfin> I'll commit that in a sec
[10:06:35] <Nadir> what commit is that ?
[10:07:04] <Fingolfin> done
[10:07:37] <Dominus> hmm, intro should definetly change to 320x200 always
[10:07:57] <Nadir> Dominus: are you running in one of those "cheating" resolutions ??? :)
[10:08:03] <Dominus> the butterfly is all over the screen with higher resolutions
[10:08:43] <Nadir> I was just going to add #include <memory> myself...
[10:09:49] <Fingolfin> already in CVS
[10:10:11] <Fingolfin> Dom: oh hmm
[10:10:17] <Fingolfin> Dom: my fault I guess
[10:10:29] <Fingolfin> Dom I should fix that, thanks for the notice
[10:10:35] * Fingolfin doesn't use cheating resolutions ;)
[10:11:06] <Dominus> but anyway with higher resolutions you get artifacts later when the screen "moves" on at the screen with the computer
[10:17:21] <hebble> Kirben: there should be other issues with exultstudio on win32
[10:17:54] <Kirben> yes there are other issues but I get the same none responding buttons
[10:18:13] <Kirben> and complaints about signal handlers
[10:19:51] <hebble> exultstudio communicates with exult via a fifo node in the filesystem, which is not possible afaik on win32.
[10:20:34] <Kirben> I have commented that section out for now.
[10:21:14] <Kirben> Just trying to get one option working (File menu, Open Static)
[10:22:37] <Kirben> hebble:does that work around require some extra includes/libs ? I get this on link:
[10:22:37] <Kirben> studio.o(.text+0x308):studio.cc: undefined reference to `glade_xml_signal_connec
[10:22:37] <Kirben> t'
[10:25:10] <Fingolfin> dominus: I fixed the animation with bigger window sizes, but...
[10:25:49] <Fingolfin> dominus: now the butterfly appereas as it should at the edge of the "real" intro image, which means somewhere in the middle of your biggg window
[10:26:15] <Dominus> :-)
[10:26:33] <Fingolfin> dominus: I can leave it this way; or I could make it glide to "over" distance from the left windwo borderto the actual starting point
[10:26:43] <Dominus> I still think we should force the res for the intros
[10:26:47] <Fingolfin> dom: or we could try to force it to be scaled to full window size, which might look ugly, though
[10:26:55] <Fingolfin> dominus: I am not sure if that is easily possible... hmmm
[10:27:22] <Fingolfin> we'd need to add a resize() method to the various window classes
[10:27:34] <hebble> Kirben: yes, but i think i ran 'configure' since the last time, and it's not compiling for me either. i'll let you know what fixes it.
[10:27:42] <Dominus> yeah and it might break it for some people if they are in full screen and then the res of their monitor drops to 320x200
[10:29:40] <Fingolfin> dom: aye; for now I won't try to work on this
[10:30:07] <Dominus> scaling to bigger res would be better
[10:32:39] <Fingolfin> aye.... hmmm
[10:35:06] <hebble> Kirben: i think the configure script for this fails to detect glib, gtk, and glade. but it's not too hard to enable them manually for testing. i had to add a -I to the path for glibconfig.h, and a -lglade
[10:35:40] <-- matt0 has left IRC (Ping timeout for matt0[1667079149-yippy.dsl.xmission.com])
[10:35:57] <-- matt_ has left IRC (Ping timeout for matt_[holladay.cb-travel.com])
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[10:36:19] <Nadir> Matt is doing the Colurless trick
[10:36:25] <Dominus> :-)
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[10:37:23] <Kirben> win32 uses static makefile, includes and libs for glib gtk libglade are in there.
[10:37:44] <Nadir> gotta go. bbl
[10:37:47] <-- Nadir has left IRC (Pleasant dreams, Avatar... hehehehehe)
[10:37:49] --- matt0_ is now known as matt0
[10:40:55] <matt0> it must've been my ISP
[10:41:04] <matt0> since I use it at both home and work
[10:41:10] <Dominus> and what is up with matt_?
[10:41:19] <matt0> that's chimera|wookin, my work account
[10:41:49] <Dominus> then call it chimera|wookin !!! damn it!!!
[10:41:54] <Dominus> :-)
[10:42:05] * matt0 takes out a very large trout and rests it on his lap, threateningly
[10:42:09] <matt0> don't make me use this, dominus
[10:42:45] * Dominus is veeeeeeeeeeeery frightened now. Muahahaha!!!
[10:44:21] <Dominus> Now Fingolfin if you get the midi working all is fine with MacOS?
[10:44:36] <Fingolfin> aye
[10:44:57] <Fingolfin> when you say it like that it sounds so easy ,)
[10:45:19] <Dominus> Kirben: is there a way to enable timidity for Win32, btw?
[10:45:49] <Dominus> Fingolfin: I know
[10:46:18] <Kirben> I don't know
[10:46:34] <Dominus> okay
[10:50:47] <Fingolfin> why would you want to use timidity on win?
[10:53:29] <hebble> how about a channel topic?
[10:54:25] <Fingolfin> we have a channel topic
[10:55:16] <hebble> what is it?
[10:55:46] <Fingolfin> "Exult, the open source Ultima 7 and U7 part 2 engine"
[10:56:15] <Fingolfin> I am trying to install U7 + U7run on my emulator (win98 se)
[10:56:25] <Fingolfin> what soundcard should I choose I wonder.. hmmm
[10:58:38] <Kirben> There is no glade_xml_signal_connect in libglade here only glade_xml_signal_connect_data and glade_xml_signal_connect_full
[10:59:18] <Kirben> Can I use either of those instead ?
[11:01:23] <hebble> try it. i don't have the docs handy.
[11:03:13] <Dominus> Fingolfin: timidity - because I read that it sounds way better and wondered if it could be used for the Winport of Exult
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[11:03:36] <Fingolfin> hi willem
[11:03:38] <Fingolfin> dom: ah ok
[11:03:41] <wjp> hi
[11:03:45] <Dominus> hi wjp
[11:04:03] <Dominus> wjp: see
[11:04:05] <Dominus> http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a9848357/exult/forestmaster.jpg
[11:04:27] <wjp> 'unnamed' ?
[11:05:04] <-- Kirben has left IRC (Read error to Kirben[co3007967-a.brasd1.vic.optushome.com.au]: Connection reset by peer)
[11:05:51] <Dominus> wjp: the U7 Wizard guy (oliver) sent it (because of our request in the newsgroup)
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[11:06:09] <wjp> weird thing he has there
[11:08:07] <Dominus> maybe the Pagan Silver Seed?
[11:08:40] <Dominus> or a rock from his homeland?
[11:09:56] <hebble> Kirben: i can't tell from the gladeXML docs whether those functions will work. but it is now 6:10 AM in my timezone, and i bid thee all a good night.
[11:10:07] <Dominus> he he
[11:10:08] <Kirben> ok night
[11:10:11] <Dominus> bye
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[11:12:59] <Fingolfin> cool to see U7 original again! yeahg
[11:13:06] <Fingolfin> and there is red plasma when you start a new game!
[11:13:12] * Fingolfin adds that to his TODO
[11:13:35] <Dominus> the plasma is actually always in when you journey onward or load a saved game from within the game
[11:13:36] <Fingolfin> but it runs way too fast, despite U7run.. hm I sure made a mistake launching it
[11:13:46] <Fingolfin> cool
[11:13:55] <Fingolfin> oh, I didn't run u7run by accident! 8-)
[11:13:59] <Dominus> in SI there is a blue frost plasma
[11:14:09] <Dominus> hehe
[11:14:19] <wjp> palette cycling will be tricky to do while loading
[11:14:52] <Dominus> well it would be nice at least for "journey onward" and "new game"
[11:15:07] <Fingolfin> wjp: hm... well
[11:15:23] <Fingolfin> wjp: we could interleave calls to the the rotation code into the loading code maybe...
[11:15:38] <wjp> as I said... tricky :-)
[11:16:03] <Dominus> to make Exult more authentic we should built in a half a minute dleay anyway between loading :-)
[11:16:15] <Dominus> dleay=delay
[11:17:12] <Dominus> fingolfin, do you get sound?
[11:18:38] <Fingolfin> yes
[11:18:47] <Dominus> cool
[11:18:58] <Dominus> better than my bad W2k :-(
[11:19:12] <Dominus> try u7dpmi to see how "fast" it is for me
[11:20:33] <Fingolfin> hm, the butterfly moves very very fast
[11:20:35] <Fingolfin> also the static is very quick
[11:21:07] <Dominus> because it is a flic, I presume
[11:21:59] <Fingolfin> damn
[11:22:05] <Fingolfin> it crashes on the guardian voice :/
[11:22:18] <matt0> curses!
[11:22:21] * matt0 slams fist into palm
[11:22:28] <Fingolfin> and no flice for the butterfly, it is hand code I think
[11:22:47] <Fingolfin> but probably using a delay loop and not a proper timer or so :/
[11:23:09] <Fingolfin> hmm
[11:23:15] <Fingolfin> I have a dilemma with our "static"
[11:23:30] <Fingolfin> I optimized wjp's original code, it is now quite fast, but the real speed hog is the scaler
[11:23:48] <Fingolfin> now, I need to get it at the same speed on fast & slow machines, with all scalers... hrmmm
[11:23:49] <matt0> that dang scaler!
[11:23:50] <matt0> hehe
[11:24:04] <wjp> Fingolfin: that code is Nadir's, I just fixed it up a bit
[11:24:08] <matt0> that shouldn't be too hard, max
[11:24:10] <Fingolfin> or nadirs
[11:24:19] <Fingolfin> the static code never was the problem
[11:24:19] <matt0> sleep if it's going to fast, drop frames if it's going to slow
[11:24:23] <Fingolfin> matt0: ah yes?
[11:24:31] <Fingolfin> yeah
[11:24:33] <matt0> yes I have dealt with that issue a lot recently in my daphne project
[11:24:39] <Fingolfin> possible, but sooo messy ;)
[11:24:53] <Fingolfin> the problem is that I really don't know just how long the static is supposed to be
[11:25:03] <matt0> I can give you a quick idea of how it might look :)
[11:25:06] <matt0> pseudo code or something
[11:25:09] <Fingolfin> very very short, or full second? for the initial static
[11:25:15] <Fingolfin> matt0: no need
[11:25:28] <Fingolfin> matt0: I perfectly know this technique, I was to lazy to add this in yet, but still
[11:25:40] <matt0> ok
[11:27:20] --- wjp is now known as wjp|work
[11:27:50] <Fingolfin> the real reason: I forgot that I could use this technique ;) so thnx for setting my head right
[11:27:54] * Fingolfin should go to work in a few, too
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[11:32:15] <Fingolfin> hm, the scroller could be nicer, too, like fading the text in/out at the bottom/top ;)
[11:32:54] <matt0> fading the text, eh?
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[11:35:08] <Fingolfin> hm, and I didn't properly time sync the butterfly either...
[11:35:25] <Fingolfin> well, not that it was before i touched the code ;)
[11:39:39] <Dominus> argh, browsing the pages from friends I found this veeery bad photo of me http://www.zabergoi.de/pics/zipfparty/13.jpg
[11:51:58] <matt0> cool!
[11:52:35] <matt0> looks like you took that picture yourself :)
[11:53:41] <Dominus> actually I donīt know anymore :-) That was taken last december
[11:55:23] * wjp|work has to go install RH71 on this machine
[11:55:27] <wjp|work> I might be back later :-)
[11:55:32] <wjp|work> bye
[11:55:33] <Dominus> might!!!
[11:55:35] <Dominus> bye
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[12:16:41] <Fingolfin> hi
[12:16:50] <Colourless> hi
[12:17:00] <Dominus> hi
[12:17:18] <Dominus> Colourless: http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a9848357/exult/forestmaster.jpg
[12:18:14] <Colourless> heh
[12:20:11] <Dominus> the author of U7wizard sent this
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[12:26:19] <Fingolfin> ok, just commited a slightly changed version of the intro. The butterfly should now fly at the same speed with any machine/scaler; and still should be mostly "smooth" (at least for me it is). Likewise, the static at the beginning of the guardian part has the same duration
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[12:41:24] <Dominus> Fingolfin: the timing butterfly/music is not right, butterfly starts too soon
[12:41:42] <Fingolfin> hmmm
[12:41:56] <Fingolfin> maybe I disabled the delay and forgot to reenable it before commiting
[12:42:24] <Fingolfin> hm, no I didn't hmmm
[12:42:32] <Fingolfin> 12.5 secs delay before it starts
[12:42:40] <Fingolfin> can you tell me how much it starts to soon?
[12:42:45] <Fingolfin> a sec, more, less?
[12:42:57] <Fingolfin> hard to debug this w/o midi music :/
[12:43:35] <Dominus> 3 seconds or so too soon
[12:43:47] <Fingolfin> oh, not 4 by chance? ;)
[12:43:52] <Fingolfin> 3.5 maybe? ;)
[12:44:04] <Dominus> 3.5 sounds nice
[12:44:12] <Fingolfin> wasn't there a black break between the "Lord British presents" and the butterfly scene?
[12:44:13] <Fingolfin> hehe
[12:44:29] <Fingolfin> in the original I mean?
[12:44:42] <Dominus> yes, I think
[12:44:51] <Fingolfin> 3.5 secs maybe? or less ? ;)
[12:44:51] <Dominus> start it up
[12:46:11] <Dominus> 3 I think (counting eineintausend, 2eintausend, dreieintausend9
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[12:49:06] <Dominus> and there is adfinetly a black scrren between logo and butterfly screen
[12:49:11] <Fingolfin> yeah
[12:49:15] <Dominus> in the original
[12:49:15] <Fingolfin> and it is about 4 secs as I said
[12:49:28] <Fingolfin> and I already have that code in there, only commented out ;)
[12:49:49] <Dominus> hm, and in the original you could skip part of the intro with return
[12:50:01] <Fingolfin> yeah
[12:50:06] <Fingolfin> I thought about adding that, too
[12:50:09] <Fingolfin> and the red plasma ;)
[12:50:25] <Dominus> the red plasma would be great
[12:50:44] <Dominus> do you hear static actually in Exult?
[12:50:56] <Fingolfin> no sound except speech during intro for me
[12:51:07] <Fingolfin> we have no SFX at all during intro I think, only speech & midi
[12:51:09] <Fingolfin> which is wrong
[12:51:19] <Fingolfin> we definitly want SFX, it is marked in the source as TODO ;)
[12:51:36] <Fingolfin> and adding skipping of intro parts shouldn't be too hard
[12:52:06] <Fingolfin> but right now I have to reboot and get some real work done, I must work on some TCP Code which requires me to go offline as I have no Ethernet HUB atm (will get it back in the evening)
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[12:52:38] <Euan> hello
[12:52:42] <Fingolfin> hi
[12:52:44] <Dominus> hi
[12:52:52] <Colourless> hi
[12:52:55] <Euan> i'm having a little trouble with ultima 7: the black gate
[12:53:10] <Dominus> what kind?
[12:53:43] <Euan> i just went to jhelom, and i had a fake honor flag made up, and i took it to sprellic, but now the armourer, the mayor, and Vokes, are all fighting each other
[12:53:51] <Euan> and i dont think they are meant to
[12:53:57] <Euan> :)
[12:54:03] <Fingolfin> gotta go, cya folks
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[12:54:06] <Dominus> arenīt they just training?
[12:54:25] <Dominus> are they actually "dying"?
[12:54:28] <Euan> well, the mayor died, so i had him resurrected
[12:54:34] <Dominus> oops
[12:54:40] <Euan> hehe
[12:54:49] <Dominus> is this with lates code or alpha3?
[12:54:55] <Dominus> latest
[12:55:23] <Euan> i got a win32 exult update yesterday
[12:55:29] <Euan> (not sure what to call it)
[12:55:34] <Dominus> snapshot?
[12:55:37] <Euan> thats the one
[12:55:53] <Dominus> do you have a savegame at this point?
[12:56:08] <Euan> would you like me to make you one?
[12:56:15] <Euan> i hadnt saved in a while
[12:56:22] <Euan> i'll save now
[12:56:57] <Dominus> only if they are still fighting
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[12:57:30] <Euan> yes, they are
[12:57:41] <Dominus> and still after restoring?
[12:57:45] <Euan> Vokes and the armourer
[12:57:55] <Euan> well, the armourer hasnt been killed yet
[12:57:59] <Euan> so they are still at it
[12:58:18] <Dominus> can you zip it and dcc it?
[12:58:23] <Euan> ok
[12:58:28] <Euan> well, the armourer is dead
[12:58:39] <Euan> so i'll just quickly res and test it
[12:58:51] <Dominus> if the save is from before it might be okay
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[12:59:31] <TonyHoyt> Hello people. What's new?
[12:59:53] <Euan> well, it would appear that vokes has gone insane, dominus
[13:00:06] <Euan> he is attacking the recently resurrected mayor
[13:00:23] <TonyHoyt> Eh?
[13:00:39] <Dominus> so sent me the savegame
[13:01:01] <Dominus> TonyHoyt: just some problem Euan has with Exult
[13:01:15] <TonyHoyt> Okay.
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[13:01:51] <Euan> are you getting a dcc send request?
[13:01:59] <Euan> ahh, apparently so
[13:02:39] <TonyHoyt> How much has exult become client/server based recently? Are the plans to make it truely client/server in the future (ie, quake like) Or that just a dream for the people who want to make an online game out of it?
[13:02:39] <Dominus> :-)
[13:03:19] <Euan> hmm, Dominus: it would seem that all the students of the library of scars are attacking NPCs
[13:04:02] <Colourless> tonyhoyt: client server in exult is only a dream of people who want to make an online game out of it.
[13:04:14] <TonyHoyt> Gotcha.
[13:04:17] <Colourless> th: we are doing nothing regarding such things
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[13:04:53] <Dominus> Euan: oops, this savegame throws me out immediaetely
[13:04:59] <Euan> hmm
[13:05:04] <Euan> how so?
[13:05:26] <Euan> have you got forge of virtue?
[13:05:29] <TonyHoyt> Then what would be the best solution for such an idea? Convert Exult into a client/server based application and then grow from there to some online game functionality? Or design the online functionality from scrach, using exult say for only graphics and map reading?
[13:06:03] <Dominus> Euan: donīt know but might be a corrupted one. Does it work for you when you close Exult now and then journey onward it doesnīt crash for you?
[13:06:13] <Colourless> th: start motly from scratch would probably be best.
[13:06:16] <Dominus> Euan: yep, got FoV
[13:06:33] <Euan> i'll try that
[13:06:44] <TonyHoyt> Sounds it.
[13:06:55] <TonyHoyt> Hmmmm.
[13:08:02] <TonyHoyt> I was thinking of using the SI artwork and map as a base for some kind of online game. The main thing is it's a perfect array of artwork to make a world, and the map is suitable but I have ideas to expand and edit it.
[13:08:47] <Euan> damn, dominus, it throws me out too
[13:08:52] * Euan sighs
[13:08:55] <Dominus> :-)
[13:09:07] <Euan> well, i'll be back in tomorrow
[13:09:11] <Euan> i have to sleep
[13:09:14] <Dominus> start a new game and go to a savegame before that than
[13:09:17] <Dominus> see you
[13:09:19] <Euan> ok
[13:09:20] <Euan> bye
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[13:11:22] <Dominus> got to go as well!
[13:11:25] <Dominus> bbl
[13:11:30] <TonyHoyt> bye
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[13:14:26] <TonyHoyt> Jeeze.. everyone's leaving.
[13:14:38] <TonyHoyt> Oh well might as go as well later
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[13:25:55] <Kirben> hmm intro crashes
[13:27:36] <Kirben> as soon as guardian is about to speak in Black Gate intro
[13:28:19] <Colourless> hmm
[13:29:51] <Kirben> I guess Fingolfin's last changes might have broke it.
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[13:30:30] <Nadir> b
[13:30:35] <Colourless> hi
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[13:40:39] <Nadir> b
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[15:15:16] <fingolfin> lo
[15:16:21] <Colourless> hi
[15:17:09] <Nadir> hi fingolfin
[15:24:57] <Nadir> ta
[15:25:08] <Colourless> you could have done that yourself you know :)
[15:25:38] <Nadir> how ? :)
[15:26:48] <Colourless> "/msg chanserv op #exult nadir" perhaps?
[15:26:56] <Colourless> :)
[15:29:47] <fingolfin> learning by doing?
[15:30:57] <Nadir> bwahahahha !
[15:32:01] <Colourless> having fun? :)
[15:34:13] <fingolfin> ;)
[15:34:30] <fingolfin> nadir! how could you!
[15:34:34] <fingolfin> <g>
[15:35:08] <fingolfin> hm, I gotta go again
[15:35:18] <fingolfin> before I fall victim to a deopping ;)
[15:35:20] <fingolfin> cya
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[15:38:45] <Nadir> bye
[15:38:53] <Colourless> cya
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[15:48:19] <wjp> hi
[15:48:30] <Colourless> hi
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[17:25:40] --- wjp|dinner is now known as wjp
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[17:40:20] <Dominus> hi again
[17:40:35] <Colourless> hu
[17:41:11] <wjp> hi
[17:41:15] <Dominus> wjp, Colourless, did that jpg help with what is going wrong with the Forest master?
[17:42:07] <Dominus> ?faq
[17:42:07] <exultbot> You can find the semi-official FAQ at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/faq.shtml
[17:42:09] <wjp> Dominus: nothing is going wrong, we were just curious ;-)
[17:42:38] <Dominus> but is shouldnīt be the madman, right?
[17:42:51] <Dominus> (in his hand)
[17:42:54] <wjp> yeah; probably an oversight of the SS team
[17:42:58] <Colourless> it shouldn't actually
[17:43:05] * Colourless checked the original
[17:43:08] <Dominus> yup
[17:43:10] <Colourless> it should be a second wand
[17:46:32] <Dominus> wjp: some if exultbots answers are outdated, btw
[17:46:54] <Colourless> ?version
[17:46:54] <exultbot> The latest official version of Exult is: 0.93alpha4
[17:47:21] <Dominus> the faq url for example
[17:47:28] <Dominus> ?help
[17:47:40] <Dominus> ?snapshot
[17:47:40] <exultbot> You can find daily windows snapshots at: http://exult.on.openave.net/
[17:47:42] <Colourless> ?faq
[17:47:42] <exultbot> You can find the semi-official FAQ at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/faq.shtml
[17:47:44] <wjp> faq.php3, right?
[17:48:05] <Dominus> just faq.php
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[17:50:01] --- Topic for #exult is: Exult, the open source Ultima 7 and U7 part 2 engine
[17:50:01] --- Topic for #exult set by ChanServ at Tue Aug 7 06:10:46 2001
[17:50:06] <wjp> ?faq
[17:50:06] <exultbot> You can find the official FAQ at: http://exult.sourceforge.net/faq.php
[17:51:00] * Dominus throws exultbot a cookie
[17:51:03] <Dominus> good boy
[17:51:50] <wjp> bah... wud is really out of synch with exult
[17:51:52] * wjp fixes that
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[17:55:24] <TonyHoyt> Hello people.
[17:55:34] <wjp> hi
[17:55:41] <Dominus> hi again
[17:55:42] <TonyHoyt> How are thing going?
[17:56:06] <TonyHoyt> You guys do something funky dealing with memset recently?
[17:56:17] <wjp> ?
[17:56:22] <wjp> what do you mean?
[17:56:40] <TonyHoyt> I can't compile exult due to it not finding the declairation of memset.
[17:56:40] <wjp> I didn't know you could do funky things with memset ;-)
[17:56:49] <wjp> which file?
[17:57:01] <TonyHoyt> Compileing VideoOptions_gump.c
[17:57:13] <TonyHoyt> in gump_utils.h
[17:57:18] <TonyHoyt> Function void Delay()
[17:57:26] <TonyHoyt> memset undeclared
[17:57:40] <wjp> there's no memset in there
[17:58:11] * wjp does a CVS update to make sure
[17:58:11] <TonyHoyt> Line 91?
[17:58:17] <TonyHoyt> in gump_utils.h?
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[17:58:22] <wjp> oh, there's a macro there
[17:58:49] <TonyHoyt> Hi Colourless.
[17:58:57] <Colourless> hi
[17:59:04] <Dominus> wb
[18:00:23] <TonyHoyt> Any ideas wjp?
[18:00:48] <wjp> I guess you could try #include <cstring>
[18:01:34] <TonyHoyt> makeing now... this could take a while.
[18:02:30] <TonyHoyt> Hmmmm Let me try again.
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[18:05:10] <TonyHoyt> Okay I think I got it.. thanks.
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[18:15:29] <wjp> wb
[18:15:31] <Colourless> thx
[18:15:48] <Colourless> not sure what happened then.
[18:15:52] <Dominus> olease stay
[18:15:59] <Dominus> please even
[18:16:03] <Colourless> :)
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[19:01:33] <Dominus> have to go again
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[19:48:25] <wjp> I have to go
[19:48:28] <wjp> see you later
[19:48:36] <Colourless> cya
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[20:39:07] <TonyHoyt> later guys
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[20:56:40] <chimera|wookin> bah
[20:58:44] <Colourless> what
[20:59:03] <chimera|wookin> our main internet is down here.. I'm using a pathetic substitute
[21:12:30] <hebble> wow, i'm finally far enough in SI that i can't go any further yet. :(
[21:12:56] <chimera|wookin> how far did you get?
[21:13:37] <hebble> i'm at the moonshade trial, where https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=446553&group_id=2335&atid=102335 takes effect.
[21:24:26] <Colourless> hebble: try this. save a game when you are in the mountains of freedom, and the reload it. It might make you become unstuck (can't be sure though). Of course, you'll still have all your items
[21:31:53] <wjp> hmm, I can't even wake Frigidazzi up at night... when I walk around a bit she just vanishes
[21:34:20] <wjp> in fact, she turns invisible
[21:34:28] <hebble> Colourless: Yes, I got unstuck after loading
[21:35:42] <wjp> hehe, Iolo, Dupre and Shamino sure aren't in a hurry to get out when I tell them to leave :-)
[21:36:40] <Colourless> wjp: check under the bed covers for figidazzi
[21:36:48] <wjp> yeah, I just found her
[21:36:55] <wjp> that NPC tool is useful :-)
[21:37:12] <Colourless> heh, only Iolo left :)
[21:37:27] <Colourless> no, they have now all left
[21:37:34] <wjp> yeah, it just takes a while :-)
[21:40:45] <Colourless> hehe. filbercio teleported in sitting down. :-)
[21:41:01] <wjp> Bucia and Flindo teleported in sleeping here :-)
[21:41:18] <Colourless> hehe
[21:42:55] <hebble> Ralph Nader just said on the radio that Western Europe has eliminated poverty. Is this true?
[21:43:10] <wjp> we have?
[21:43:26] * wjp didn't know that
[21:43:40] <wjp> it probably all depends on your definition of poverty
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[21:50:41] <fingolfin> hiya
[21:50:47] <hebble> howdy
[21:50:49] <Colourless> hi
[21:51:12] <fingolfin> can you please enlighten me, folks: Iīd like to add a couple of OS X specifc files to a new subfolder, macosx, and also a Makefile.am
[21:51:39] <fingolfin> how would I integrate it into the automake buildsystem, in such a way that it is only used ins OS X builds?
[21:52:03] <fingolfin> I mean, no problem to set up the sub dir to build a lib or so, like the others do. but you donīt want this on linux/bsd to happen
[21:55:48] <chimera|wookin> I can never understand that automake stuff
[21:56:49] <hebble> Who set it up originally?
[21:57:00] <fingolfin> <sigh>
[21:57:11] <fingolfin> I really ought to learn it properly...
[21:57:42] <fingolfin> ah
[21:57:49] <fingolfin> but I found the (simple) solution
[21:58:22] <fingolfin> wjp: is Makefile.be needed? is the automake version not good?
[21:58:56] <wjp> fingolfin: yes, no, respectively
[21:59:07] <fingolfin> what is the problem? just being curious
[21:59:22] <wjp> it's not installed on my beos system ;-)
[21:59:58] <fingolfin> oh!
[22:00:11] <wjp> so I didn't try if it might work
[22:00:16] <fingolfin> hm... is it a big problem to install it? was pretty simple on my OS X box to install it
[22:00:26] <wjp> I vaguely recall failing at installing autoconf/automake
[22:00:30] <fingolfin> (OS X comes with autoconf but not with automake)
[22:00:41] <wjp> now that's strange
[22:00:56] <fingolfin> well, not my problem anyway, but it would make it simpler to keep all those Makefiles/projects in think ;)
[22:01:02] <fingolfin> wjp: what?
[22:01:25] <wjp> (autoconf but no automake)
[22:01:40] <fingolfin> nah... it is more strange that they ship autoconf at all ;)
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[22:02:57] <fingolfin> the reason for this is that the mainstream autoconf that many many apps were using had no OS X support, so the OS X version ships two files, config.guess and config.sub, which you can drop into many packages to get them running
[22:03:11] <fingolfin> current autoconf comes with OS X support, though
[22:03:14] <chimera|wookin> aaaahhhhh
[22:03:16] <wjp> ah, I see
[22:03:25] <fingolfin> but ac 2.5 has some compatibility problems for some apps
[22:04:03] <hebble> Jesus Christ: the ACLU sued to include the KKK in Missiouri's adopt-a-highway program. Successfully.
[22:04:24] <wjp> is KKK what I think it is?
[22:04:29] <hebble> Yes.
[22:04:34] <wjp> and ACLU?
[22:04:41] <fingolfin> hm, I need to give my own definition of SDL_LIBS... guess I should change configure.in to check if this is already defined before trying to get the value via sdl-config
[22:04:47] <Colourless> American Civil Liberties Union?
[22:04:48] <wjp> (I mean, what's ACLU?)
[22:05:00] <hebble> American Civil Liberties Union. They act as general advocates of freedom and equality.
[22:05:16] <fingolfin> eeek
[22:05:31] <wjp> umm...
[22:06:10] <chimera|wookin> I think a lot of the things the ACLU sues for are rather awful
[22:06:32] <chimera|wookin> I mean.. it seems like the ACLU could be a good thing, but in practice I have been rather disappointed in them
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[22:07:08] <Colourless> hi
[22:07:14] <fingolfin> ho
[22:07:16] <Nadir> hi
[22:07:30] <wjp> hi
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[22:15:02] <Nadir> fingolfin: automake help ?
[22:19:14] <fingolfin> Nadir: sure
[22:19:44] <fingolfin> Nadir: I want to do some stuff only for os x builds...
[22:19:55] <fingolfin> what I did is that I addede to SYSLIBS -lmacosx
[22:20:11] <fingolfin> and in my macosx subdir I have a Makefile.am
[22:20:26] <fingolfin> right now I am happy to get all compiling, but later I need to do some special stuff....
[22:20:49] <wjp> is '-lmacosx' built from the macosx subdir?
[22:21:02] <fingolfin> for OS X, real apps are actually folders, so called packages. Such a folder has a subdirs for the actual executable, for resources, plugins, data etc.
[22:21:09] <fingolfin> wjp: ?
[22:21:19] <wjp> fingolfin: apparently not, never mind :-)
[22:21:21] <fingolfin> wjp: libmacosx.la is built in the macosx subdir
[22:21:29] <fingolfin> wjp: nothing in cvs yet anyway ;)
[22:21:29] <wjp> oh, it is
[22:22:01] <wjp> I'd add a 'SYS_DIRS' variable, I guess
[22:22:09] <Nadir> If you look at mapedit/Makefile.am, configure.in and acconfig.h it should give you some insight into building conditionally
[22:22:12] <wjp> with SYS_DIRS added to SUBDIRS
[22:22:15] <fingolfin> waht I want to say: to get a full OS X build system, after I made the executable, Iīll have to make an Exult.app folder, the proper subfolder for it, and move some files to the right spots in there - some fixed files, the executable, icon, resource
[22:22:25] <fingolfin> Nadir: thx for the pointer
[22:22:44] <wjp> I guess you could hook into a special install target for that
[22:22:56] <Nadir> wjp: agreed
[22:23:07] <fingolfin> wjp: Iīd know how to do it in a plain Makefile, but I am not sure about automake...
[22:23:17] <fingolfin> is there some sort of tutorial or quick reference or so for automake?
[22:23:38] <wjp> cat `find -name "Makefile.am"` ;-)
[22:23:40] <Nadir> automake/autoconf are hard to work out but they are very flexible
[22:23:57] <Nadir> info -f automake
[22:24:07] <fingolfin> in our master Makefile.am, it has "EXULTLIBS" which lists all the sub dir libs
[22:24:15] <fingolfin> this is then added to exult_DEPENDENCIES
[22:24:37] <fingolfin> I think that Iīll have to add macosx/libmacosx.la there, too, but only for OS X... or am I wrong here?
[22:24:42] <fingolfin> Nadir: he ok
[22:25:16] <Nadir> That is assuming you have texinfo installed under MacOS X
[22:25:32] <fingolfin> I have
[22:25:38] <Nadir> good
[22:25:50] <fingolfin> just like I have X-Window installed, running xchat, which I ported myself ;)
[22:26:01] <Nadir> wjp: what about srcdir!=builddir ?
[22:26:04] <chimera|wookin> you ported x-chat?
[22:26:26] <chimera|wookin> hoho! Darwin!
[22:26:29] <wjp> Nadir: that shouldn't be a problem here, I think
[22:26:30] <fingolfin> ok, so in configure.in I can define something like SYS_SUBDIRS, and then use that in Makefile.am, adding it to the end of SUBDIRS
[22:26:37] <Nadir> expack ?
[22:26:46] <fingolfin> chimera|wookin: wasnīt hard to port, quite portable, only had to work around a bug in MacOS X in mkdir()
[22:26:54] <chimera|wookin> :)
[22:27:01] <fingolfin> I *can* build exult on OS X at the moment
[22:27:01] <wjp> expack currently builds things in the srcdir, which may not be how we want it
[22:27:12] <Nadir> exactly
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[22:28:00] * wjp also makes a note of the new 'documentation' section
[22:28:13] <Nadir> hi k
[22:28:20] <Colourless> hi
[22:30:05] <Kirben> Hi
[22:30:31] <wjp> hi
[22:30:51] <fingolfin> lo
[22:31:09] <Kirben> bbl
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[22:55:45] <wjp> hmm, 1am already; I have to go
[22:55:51] <wjp> g'night
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[23:05:47] <ice_cream> hello
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[23:12:17] * fingolfin yawns
[23:12:21] <fingolfin> good night, folks
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