#exult@irc.freenode.net logs for 8 Jan 2002 (GMT)

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[00:03:26] <wjp|afk> hehe... read Dancer's last emai?
[00:03:29] <wjp|afk> email, even
[00:03:34] <wjp|afk> (the SLOCcount one)
[00:03:44] <wjp|afk> "
[00:03:44] <wjp|afk> Total Estimated Cost to Develop = $ 3,080,278"
[00:04:00] <wjp|afk> (sorry about the formatting)
[00:04:32] <wjp|afk> apparently we've been working on it with 13 people, too
[00:04:50] <Dominus> he he
[00:06:41] <Dominus> now who do we present this data to get our salary? EA?
[00:07:46] <wjp|afk> I wouldn't really mind that $56286/year... :-)
[00:08:31] <Dominus> nope, me enither (though I would take less for my job)
[00:29:38] <Dominus> that's one way to put it. we wasted 3M :-)
[00:31:17] <wjp|afk> heh :-)
[00:31:29] * wjp|afk wishes he had 3M to waste :-)
[00:31:59] * Dominus hands wjp|afk $3M to waste
[00:32:18] * wjp|afk decides not to waste the $3M
[00:32:36] <wjp|afk> OTOH...
[00:32:53] * Dominus takes away the $3M - these were meant to be wasted
[00:33:34] --- Dominus has changed the topic to: USECODE! the secret Power of Ultima 7 (and Ultima 8!) and Exult! Or how to waste $ 3,080,278 !
[00:38:41] <Fingolfin> haha great, SLOCount lol
[00:38:49] <Fingolfin> I want to have my payment now! :)
[00:42:04] <wjp|afk> just did a quick calculation... if I got paid fulltime for what my last 'job on the side' paid, I would actually make that salary yearly...
[00:42:12] <wjp|afk> didn't realize the pay on that job was that good :-)
[00:42:46] <wjp|afk> (pity it was only 15 hours, instead of 40*52 :-) )
[00:43:50] <Fingolfin> working 52 weeks/year? hmm no good
[00:44:28] <wjp|afk> heh, no, not really :-)
[00:44:29] <Dominus> he
[00:44:40] <wjp|afk> all that money, and no time to spend it :-)
[00:45:01] <Fingolfin> yeah
[00:55:05] <-- Fingolfin has left IRC ("night folks")
[01:17:20] <wjp|afk> hmm... have to get up in 5 1/2 hours... yay :/
[01:17:26] <syke> oops
[01:17:27] <wjp|afk> (and homework still isn't finished... grr)
[01:17:28] <Dominus> cool
[01:17:33] <syke> I'll be running insure++ on exult tonight
[01:17:57] <wjp|afk> you're Matt on the ML?
[01:18:27] <syke> yes
[01:18:38] <Dominus> good to know :-)
[01:20:35] <syke> I do'nt have much time to devote, but I'd been meaning to run some of my QA tools on this project :)
[01:20:44] <syke> I'm focusing on FreeSCI for the moment
[01:20:47] <syke> and my real job ;>
[01:21:26] <matto> syke! you keep following me around :)
[01:21:53] <syke> matto: perhaps ;>
[01:22:07] <syke> I found out about this through Christoph, actually
[01:22:48] <syke> I was alsdo going to do a little work on FreeCNC, but it looks like it's not very far along
[01:23:18] <wjp|afk> the purify results you mailed look like they could be useful
[01:23:30] <wjp|afk> it'll take some time to get through them all, though :-)
[01:24:06] <matto> syke: hehe... he goes by Jameson around here :)
[01:25:28] <syke> I know :)
[01:25:35] <syke> had a chance to play with FreeSCI 0.3.3 yet?
[01:26:15] <wjp|afk> haven't played with FreeSCI at all, actually :/
[01:26:39] <wjp|afk> maybe I should dig up some old adventures
[01:26:48] <matto> syke: Hero's Quest!
[01:26:53] <matto> So you want to be a hero, eh?
[01:26:55] <wjp|afk> Hero's Quest was cool :-)
[01:29:01] <wjp|afk> *sigh*... I have a theorem that says something should be at least 9, and I have an example of it being 8...
[01:29:22] * wjp|afk wonders if he should disbelieve the theorem or the example
[01:34:42] <wjp|afk> phew, example is wrong
[01:34:52] * wjp|afk shouldn't be doing math at 2:40am
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[01:40:35] <syke> wjp: a lot of the purify warnings are related, it looked to me
[01:40:56] <wjp> could be; I haven't yet properly looked at most of them
[01:41:01] <syke> so fixing one would fix several
[01:41:07] * wjp nods
[01:41:08] <syke> I'm just not sure of the "proper" fix
[01:41:55] <syke> I would start with the array bounds read, which is could be bad
[01:42:00] <syke> er
[01:42:07] <syke> which is bad, no getting around it.
[01:46:01] <wjp> hmm, a lot of these seem to be in audio code
[01:48:36] <wjp> s/a lot/some/ :-)
[01:52:33] * wjp thinks it's getting a bit late
[01:52:38] <wjp> bye
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[02:01:38] <Dominus> got to go tpo bed as well
[02:01:40] <Dominus> bye
[02:01:46] <-- Dominus has left IRC ("Exult! Exult! Exult!")
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[02:15:15] <EazyCheez> hello :)
[02:15:20] <EazyCheez> weird stuff now
[02:15:50] <EazyCheez> when I try to put the teeth in the jawbone (that I get in Moonshade) it says they won't fit... do I already have them or what?
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[02:24:59] * ashp posts to r.c.g.u.d for the first time in ever
[02:25:10] <ashp> someone mentioned my dragon name there, frightening that people _remembered_ me
[02:33:33] <ashp> I wish there was a cheat option to render all text into english
[02:33:37] <ashp> I hate trying to decipher stuff
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[05:01:44] <EazyCheze> ashp
[05:01:55] <EazyCheze> I can understand druidic fine :)
[05:02:08] <EazyCheze> I have no life, I studied up quite a bit on it :)
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[06:07:53] <EazyCheez> hello
[06:09:23] <EazyCheez> committing this to the exultbot for reference: I got an expression error, simply when walking around looking for the Death Knight in Moonshade (Stefano has already told me about him of course). It occurred in line 81 of file gamemap.h, and the expression was: expression: (cx >= 0) && (cx < c_num_chunks) && (cy >= 0) && (cy < c_num_chunks)
[06:09:44] <EazyCheez> This information came by way of a standard C++ error dialog.
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[11:23:45] * Darke bows. "Hi all."
[11:27:38] <Kirben> Hi
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[11:28:51] <Dominus> hi
[11:29:19] <Darke> Hello.
[11:29:30] <Dominus> ashp? are you still there?
[11:31:58] <Dominus> well, nethertheless, there is an option to instantly "learn" Druidic and ophidian language. Press F2,n,0,enter,n,4, esc,esc (until you are back in the game)
[11:36:30] <Kirben> a config option for that would be useful.
[11:36:47] <-- matto has left IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
[11:36:58] <Dominus> I think we discussed this at some time and decided to leave it out :-)
[11:37:14] <Dominus> also problem in SI is that you can't set it permanent
[11:37:58] <Dominus> it stays if you set it but when you use the spelling device on monk island and the spell fades you loose the read ability again
[11:39:53] <Kirben> Well could always make it BG only for now.
[11:40:13] <Dominus> true
[11:40:28] <Dominus> personally I wouldn't mind either way
[11:55:51] <Kirben> hmm anyone tried contacting u8 developers yet ?
[11:55:58] <Dominus> me
[11:56:08] <Kirben> any response ?
[11:57:25] <Dominus> I contacted Jason Ely if I/we could ask him some questions and he answered what I wanted to know. I wrote him, explaining a bit about Exult and Pentagram and he never replied (I didn't ask for the source, btw) back
[11:57:57] <Kirben> I just noticed his posts on usenet, thats why I was asking.
[11:58:02] <Dominus> but that was just before xmas and I guess eventually he will reply
[11:58:54] <Dominus> I don't think he is opposed to something like Exult for U8, after all he sounded a bit disappointed that U8 has such a bad rep
[11:59:06] <Dominus> (sounded like that in the usenet group)
[11:59:57] <Kirben> Never played Ultima 8 much myself but it was sure different, I was turned offm ainly by jumping.
[12:00:32] <Kirben> Does music actually play in pentagram viewer now ?
[12:00:37] <Dominus> I only played in 96 with the patch already in it and I liked it
[12:00:42] <Dominus> music:yes
[12:01:10] <Dominus> but compared to the other ultimas I think U8 is not too god
[12:01:13] <Kirben> pentagram seems to be progessing quickly already.
[12:01:49] <Dominus> but now looking at the maps and shapes I would really like to see it with scalers. It just has beautiful art
[12:02:26] <Dominus> Kirben: did you try out the latest cvs yet? (or wait didn't you say you don't have u8 anymore?)
[12:03:46] <Dominus> anyway Ryan hacked in an avatar shape under the mouse pointer. It is progressing fast indeed
[12:05:03] <Dominus> I think all the experience that the team gained with U7 helps a lot already. After all the wheel is already invented for most of the stuff
[12:05:20] <Dominus> scratch most of, say some
[12:06:06] <Dominus> The only "problem" I see with Pentagram is that people will eventually ask for Crusader support :-)
[12:06:52] <Dominus> he, I'm going to look for my copy and see if by chance the viewers work :-)
[12:07:39] <Kirben> I have compiled latest cvs but no I don't have Ultima 8 anymore, used to have disk version a few years back.
[12:08:28] <Dominus> as I offered a while back if you can't get a copy of the UC I can offer you my spare one
[12:09:34] <Dominus> now where is my crusader copy...
[12:16:44] <Dominus> he he, shpdisp works kind of, a bit distorted
[12:19:17] <Dominus> had to rename a couple of files to have u8 in the name
[12:19:41] <Dominus> display doesn't work (no surprise - no nonfixed.dat)
[12:20:21] <Dominus> globdisp works kind of as well
[12:22:02] <Dominus> I'm going to reboot to dos to see if it generates a gamedat dir then
[12:22:19] <Kirben> try u8 in windows program
[12:22:38] <Kirben> that might work too.
[12:22:46] <Dominus> don't believe it will work
[12:22:50] <Dominus> I#ll try
[12:25:51] <Dominus> u8win9x doesn't work for the crusader exe
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[12:28:26] <Colourless> has someone been talking about me recently?
[12:28:40] <Dominus> me, it was me, me, me
[12:29:07] <Colourless> :-)
[12:29:43] <Dominus> I tried pentagram viewers with crusader :-)
[12:30:30] <Colourless> you were complaining about no nonfixed?
[12:30:38] <Dominus> yep
[12:30:52] <Dominus> no gamedat in crusader
[12:31:07] <Colourless> had crusader been run yet?
[12:31:16] <Dominus> and with the u8 one, display just crashes
[12:31:31] <Dominus> no, that's the problem, I have to dos boot for it
[12:31:54] <Dominus> there is no handy crusader for win9x program :-(
[12:32:08] <Colourless> ok, i take it there is a savegame dir?
[12:32:32] <Colourless> the .000 save contains nonfixed.dat
[12:33:53] <Colourless> question is, how to get it out
[12:33:58] <Dominus> okay (arj it was right?)
[12:34:26] <Colourless> no, the savegames aren't arjed
[12:34:40] <Dominus> maybe flexed
[12:34:49] <Colourless> not flexes either :-)
[12:35:10] <Dominus> :-(
[12:35:49] <Darke> The .000 save isn't arjed. Yesterday's log should have a `dd` command to extract it, but it probably won't work under 'doze unless there's a copy of it to compile under cygwin.
[12:36:37] <Dominus> Darke: so you could do it?
[12:36:50] <Dominus> I can dcc you the savegame :-)
[12:38:23] <Darke> Theoretically, yes. <grin> It depends if the 'savegame' bit is the same size in crusader, as it is in u8.
[12:38:45] <Colourless> heh, it would probably be faster for me to write a program to extract it
[12:38:52] <Dominus> so I'll just try and dcc it to you, okay?
[12:39:27] <Darke> That's the command, `dd if=u8save.000 of=nonfixed.dat skip=47 bs=1 count=242096` anyway.
[12:39:42] <Colourless> i don't think that will work
[12:39:47] <Darke> Dominus: <nod> Feel free to try, I'm not sure how well dcc works for me.
[12:39:49] <Colourless> let me write the program ok :-)
[12:39:59] <Darke> Colourless: If you wish. <grin>
[12:40:09] <Dominus> I'll let Colourless write the program then :-)
[12:42:22] <Dominus> care for a screenshot of shpdisp?
[12:42:42] <Colourless> ok
[12:45:18] <Dominus> http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a9848357/exult/crusader.jpg
[12:48:28] <Dominus> music files are different to u8s
[12:48:53] <Colourless> hm, doesn't seem to work :)
[12:49:19] <Dominus> that program?
[12:49:55] <Colourless> no, the shape viewer with crusader
[12:50:28] <Dominus> no not really but you can see some colors with it sometimes (like that blueisch in the screener)
[12:52:24] <Colourless> ok, lets see if it works with crusader
[12:53:57] <Colourless> gee, the speed i get to you is impressively slow :-)
[12:54:05] <Dominus> oh, why is my dcc receive not working again?
[12:54:12] <Dominus> connection lost
[12:54:18] <Colourless> http://www.users.on.net/triforce/u8savextract.exe
[12:54:23] <Colourless> i disconnected it
[12:57:09] <Dominus> not working (the program)
[12:57:19] <Colourless> hmm, what happens?
[12:57:49] <Dominus> nothing
[12:57:59] <Dominus> works with u8 saves
[12:58:04] <Colourless> hmm, want to give me the file
[13:00:35] <Dominus> http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a9848357/exult/savegame.zip (shortly)
[13:00:38] <Dominus> not yet
[13:00:40] <Colourless> ok
[13:00:55] <Colourless> probably has a different header size of something
[13:00:56] <Dominus> as another upload is taking up all my upload speed
[13:01:55] <Dominus> puh, my speed sucks big time right now
[13:02:35] <Dominus> he he the origin support site is funny
[13:02:52] <Dominus> support for UO or support for all other origin products
[13:03:14] <Dominus> Colourless: you can download now
[13:03:17] <Colourless> ok
[13:04:23] <Dominus> hmm, the crusader save looks totally different
[13:08:20] <Colourless> thats cause it's a flex
[13:08:43] <Dominus> muawahaha
[13:09:00] <Colourless> entry 0 is probably non fixed
[13:10:55] <Colourless> actually, it looks like that file savegame.1 is actually nonfixed.dat itself
[13:12:16] <Colourless> it is
[13:12:19] <Dominus> crashes with either one (probably due to some nice avatar hack in the latest display?)
[13:12:31] <Colourless> no, i wouldn't think so
[13:13:17] <Dominus> always crashes on 0, 96: 29887, 0 in stderr
[13:14:02] <Colourless> try using the crusader nonfixed.dat with all the other files being u8
[13:14:18] <Colourless> no, i mean use cursader fixed.dat
[13:15:03] <Dominus> you mean the crusader fixed with the u8 files?
[13:15:07] <Colourless> yeah
[13:16:27] <Dominus> crashes at 73, 170: 0, 0 (but it is funny as you can hear the sound for a moment)
[13:17:03] <Colourless> i think the object format for crusader is different to u8
[13:17:23] <Dominus> ok, lets end this, I think
[13:17:38] <Dominus> I was actually just rying it for fun :-)
[13:17:44] <Dominus> trying
[13:18:10] <Colourless> at least now we could say. No crusader, it's just too different :-)
[13:18:40] <Colourless> now, running the crusader usecode with disasm would be interesting :-)
[13:18:53] <Dominus> he he
[13:19:25] <Dominus> the crusader usecode contains also two more files
[13:19:39] <Dominus> overload.dat
[13:19:48] <Dominus> unkds.dat
[13:20:18] <Dominus> eusecode.flx is nearly a third the size of u8s
[13:21:24] <Dominus> but fixed.dat is more than double than u8s :-)
[13:31:12] <Dominus> http://www.review-zone.com/software/reviews/win_xp/page3.shtml says he got crusader running on XP... strange...
[13:35:14] <Colourless> come on, everyone know that Ultima 8 doesn't play fine
[13:35:25] * Colourless points to U8 being on the list
[13:35:42] * Dominus didn't even notice this
[13:37:07] <Dominus> yeah, unless there is a similar patch for crusader it won't run (same fatal error as U8)
[13:50:13] <Kirben> what is full screen switch for u8 viewer ?
[13:50:29] <Colourless> there isn't one at the moment
[13:51:00] <Kirben> oh I thought one had been added the other day
[13:51:53] <Colourless> if you want fullscreen edit line 81 of display.cc and change it to a res you can run and add |SDL_FULLSCREEN
[13:52:17] <Dominus> oh, I just remember, Colourless, yesterday I wasn't able to start u9 in glide with your 1006 glidexp :-(
[13:52:45] <Colourless> you werent?
[13:52:54] <Dominus> nope
[13:53:00] <Colourless> hmm
[13:53:37] <Dominus> when it initialised the glide the screen went dark (switching to glide, i guess) then it crashed without any error ro the desktop again
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[14:03:04] <Dominik> argh
[14:03:08] <Dominik> he he
[14:03:20] <Colourless> yes?
[14:03:48] <Kirben> I found glib/gtk+ dev libs again and Exult Studio still compiles but doesn't do much. http://members.optushome.com.au/veemon/studios.jpg
[14:03:55] <Dominik> Colourless: hoe's driver loaded the game but then later on it crashed it but that was probably due to loading one of the old/hidden maps in U9
[14:04:23] <Colourless> hoes driver uses the normal glide2x dll. I don't
[14:04:31] <Dominik> i know
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[14:05:04] <Colourless> what version of u9?
[14:05:09] <Dominus> 1.19f
[14:05:23] <Colourless> that's final isn't it?
[14:05:32] <Dominus> the fan patch
[14:05:45] <Dominus> but it wasn'T working with the final as well
[14:05:55] <Colourless> ok
[14:06:02] <Colourless> so it didn't work with 1.17?
[14:06:18] <Dominus> 1.18
[14:06:21] <Dominus> that's the final
[14:06:32] <Dominus> I have gotten one of the updated install discs
[14:06:38] <Colourless> yeah, me too
[14:06:52] <Colourless> i can't rember the version numbers
[14:07:07] <Colourless> hmm, looks like i missed a few letters there
[14:07:35] <Dominus> btw, works with the 1003
[14:08:10] <Dominus> but not the 1006
[14:08:37] <Colourless> want to try with 1004 and 1005 for me?
[14:08:56] <Dominus> are these still on the site?
[14:09:22] <Colourless> no, just uploading them
[14:09:33] <Dominus> I can try as it only crashes the game and not the whole OS :-)
[14:10:04] <Colourless> it might be due to some state change stuff I put in
[14:11:28] <Colourless> 1004 is up
[14:11:40] <Dominus> can you give me the url again :-)
[14:12:01] <Colourless> http://www.users.on.net/triforce/glidexp/glidexp_build1004.zip
[14:13:30] <Colourless> 1005 is up now too
[14:13:44] <Colourless> http://www.users.on.net/triforce/glidexp/glidexp_build1005.zip
[14:14:10] <Dominus> 1004 works
[14:15:25] <Colourless> i'm guessing 1005 should work too
[14:16:18] <Kirben> GlideXP needs voodoo chipset ?
[14:16:24] <Colourless> yeah
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[14:21:38] <Dominik> 1005 works :-)
[14:21:52] <Colourless> ok
[14:22:29] <Dominik> cool, even though I crashed the whole OS Dominus was still in the channel :-)
[14:22:46] <Dominik> major corruptions though if you alt tab out and into the game
[14:23:23] <Dominik> I crashed before because I was using an odd map agin
[14:25:33] <Kirben> hmm what is most cause of a parse error ?
[14:26:14] <Colourless> of what?
[14:26:30] <Kirben> gcc -mno-cygwin -mpentium -fnative-struct -O -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I . -I .. -I ../..
[14:26:30] <Kirben> /intl -I ../../glib -I ../../glib/gmodule -I ../../gtk+/gdk -I ../../gtk+ -I ../
[14:26:30] <Kirben> ../libxml-1.8.7 -c -o glade-sax.o glade-sax.c
[14:26:30] <Kirben> glade-sax.c:250: parse error before `*'
[14:26:51] <Colourless> what's on that line?
[14:26:53] <Kirben> that line is:
[14:26:54] <Kirben> static void gladeStartElement(GladeParseState *state, const CHAR *name,
[14:27:10] <Kirben> next after that is:
[14:27:10] <Colourless> the 'CHAR' probably isn't define
[14:27:11] <Colourless> d
[14:27:12] <Kirben> const CHAR **attrs) {
[14:27:37] <Kirben> #define CHAR ?
[14:27:53] <Colourless> #define CHAR char
[14:28:29] <Kirben> worked, thanks
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[14:33:00] <Colourless> welcome :-)
[14:33:22] <Nadir> you knew I was coming ?
[14:33:48] <Colourless> some strange spirt told me
[14:34:02] <Colourless> or a spirit even :-)
[14:34:36] <Colourless> so, what about the midi?
[14:35:18] <Nadir> seen my work on the CVS modules ?
[14:35:24] <Colourless> yeah I have
[14:35:54] <Nadir> It is a better way of sharing code between the two than maintaing separate copies :)
[14:36:16] <Colourless> yeah it is. audio needs other files though that are only part of exult
[14:37:16] <Colourless> so, i can't use the versions straight from exult
[14:37:25] <Nadir> yes, I know. We need to factor those out into specific files outside of audio
[14:37:47] <Colourless> all of the file utils should be shared
[14:37:48] <Kirben> Nadir: did you ever attempt to port exult/exult studios network code to sdl_net ? I remember you mentioned you might a few months ago
[14:38:43] <Nadir> no, sorry, didn't have time
[14:39:15] <Nadir> Colourless: but u7 flexes are different from u8 flexes. can we add support for the variants in "files" ?
[14:39:49] <Colourless> yeah, they are different
[14:40:58] <Colourless> we can just have a different class for u8 flexes
[14:41:31] <Nadir> good
[14:41:50] <Nadir> so expack could handle u8 flexes automatically ?
[14:42:03] <Colourless> expack doesn't use the classes
[14:42:45] <Colourless> expack has the u7 format hardcoded into it
[14:42:54] <Colourless> the u8 format isn't much different
[14:44:41] <Nadir> my bad
[14:46:49] <Colourless> that is, it wouldn't be able to create them, but it would be able to extract them
[14:47:12] <Colourless> just noticed myself that it does use the u7filemanager to extract
[14:48:06] <Kirben> it works :)
[14:48:08] <Dominik> there is already an u8flx "expack" based on the U9 flexes btw :-)
[14:48:24] <Dominik> Kirben. Studio ?
[14:48:59] <Kirben> yes, workaround mentioned by hebble fixes those signal not handled errors
[14:49:12] <Kirben> can't do much without server support though
[14:49:24] <Dominik> u8flx builder/extract can be found at http://www.iinet.net.au/~larcombe
[14:49:53] <Nadir> Kirben: the only thing missing is connection between Exult and Studio?
[14:50:28] <Dominik> Kirben: Jeff thought this could help with it: As an alternative to dragging objects, you can now select a shape, then insert it into the game window by left-clicking while holding the Shift key down
[14:50:40] <Colourless> hmmm, it appears that there is virtually no different between u8 flexes and u7 flexes
[14:50:49] <Kirben> yes seems to be, wait until I finish work around and check other options.
[14:50:59] <Nadir> gtk version ?
[14:51:24] <Kirben> 1.3.0 I think, works so far though
[14:52:39] <Nadir> 1.3.0 ?
[14:52:42] <Colourless> hmmm, commenting out lines 61 and 62 of flex.cc will allow expack to load u8 flexes
[14:53:22] <Kirben> thats what dlls say
[14:53:41] <Kirben>
[14:55:17] <Nadir> latest should be 1.3.12
[14:55:34] <Kirben> is safe to update ?
[14:55:41] <Nadir> But I believe incompatibilities are much greater
[14:56:15] <Nadir> Kirben: 1.3 is a development branch of GTK+ which is not source-compatible with 1.2. If you managed to compile ExultStudio with it it's only by luck
[14:58:00] <Kirben> I have not seen win32 versions of gtk+ 1.2.x around
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[15:03:50] <Nadir> yes there were, but I guess they are not official
[15:05:36] <Kirben> if you know of any site with them let me know
[15:06:56] <Colourless> nadir, do you want to add the entire file dir to common?
[15:07:50] <Nadir> do you want me to ?
[15:07:57] <Colourless> yeah
[15:08:03] <Nadir> ok
[15:08:59] <Colourless> the only different between u7 and u8 flexes appears to be the the u8 flexes don't have the 'magic' number in them
[15:13:21] <Colourless> ok thanks.
[15:13:36] <Nadir> cvs -z3 co pentagram
[15:13:52] <Nadir> I haven't modified exult yet, but will do if people are ok with it
[15:15:35] <Nadir> as soon as I do that, any changes made to files under "files" will be shared by the two
[15:15:37] <Colourless> ok, what should be done with exceptions.h and exult_types.h.
[15:16:00] <Colourless> they are used by most everything really
[15:16:01] <Nadir> aha, the "difficult question(tm)
[15:16:28] <Kirben> hmm file selector crashes it
[15:16:57] <Nadir> we should have a "files_exception.h" with specific stuff in there
[15:19:51] <Kirben> http://exult.sourceforge.net/snapshots/Studio.zip
[15:19:53] <Darke> As a random thought, conf/ should also be in the common tree.
[15:20:01] <Nadir> it is
[15:20:15] <Kirben> if anyone wants to check it out
[15:20:28] <Nadir> Darke: conf is in the common tree
[15:20:43] * Darke gets the feeling he should update.
[15:20:51] <Darke> Thanks.
[15:20:53] <Colourless> you need to do a checkout
[15:21:01] <Nadir> yes, update is not enough
[15:21:42] <Nadir> actually, conf is standalone
[15:21:52] <Nadir> (it doesn't require other bits)
[15:22:01] <Darke> files/ at least IIRC.
[15:22:48] <Colourless> the other things all need 'those' 2 files
[15:23:22] <Nadir> conf doesn't need files
[15:23:43] <Nadir> It needs exceptions.h
[15:24:28] <Colourless> i say exceptions.h stays as is, except with 'exult_exception' possibly renamed to something else
[15:24:36] <Nadir> and utils.h
[15:24:43] <Colourless> utils.h is part of files
[15:24:54] <Nadir> ok, I was wrong. conf depends on files
[15:24:55] * Darke nods. U7Open or something is the function it needs.
[15:25:06] <Nadir> so the first task to do is make files independent
[15:25:14] <Darke> No problem. <grin> I wasn't all that sure myself.
[15:26:38] <Dominik> Kirben: is there anything you can do with it?
[15:27:06] <Dominik> Kirben: it crashes when I open static...
[15:27:09] <Kirben> can't see anything
[15:27:42] <Kirben> open static should work but will crash when you select /
[15:27:45] * Darke thinks that anything handling files 'should' be using U7open, just for all it's file/pathname fiddling. Perhaps a rename is in order? <grin>
[15:28:06] <Colourless> there are lots of things with u7 in their name
[15:28:07] <Dominik> Kirben: that's what I mean
[15:28:28] * Darke guessed that.
[15:28:29] <Colourless> mostly, if not all are in files
[15:28:50] <Kirben> was file selector in exult studio designed for unix only ? / isn't good for win32
[15:29:01] <Colourless> i vote the u7 be replaced with something else
[15:29:26] <Dominik> Kirben: probably
[15:29:30] <Darke> Colourless: 'Ex'? 'Exult'?
[15:29:49] <Colourless> i would think Ex should be ok
[15:30:06] <Darke> Colourless: Or perhaps just 'File', at least for that particular function. <grin>
[15:30:34] * Colourless could imagine calling something File is asking for trouble :-)
[15:30:44] <Kirben> I compiled earlier exult studio version (before server stuff was added) and file selector didn't seem to recognise win32 directories at all. That one didn't crash though
[15:31:05] <Kirben> couldn't get beyond /
[15:31:15] <Darke> Colourless: 'StreamOpen' then? <grin>
[15:31:22] <Dominik> :-)
[15:32:13] <Colourless> i think a unified scheme would be best.
[15:32:14] * Darke was actually suggesting 'FileOpen' rather then just file... but if you 'class-ified' it, it might work. <grin>
[15:32:28] <Dominik> ex seems to be best bet
[15:34:02] <Colourless> Nadir: your opinion?
[15:36:04] <Dominik> Kirben: and file->exit doesn't work
[15:36:40] <Kirben> odd it was before
[15:37:41] <Dominik> Kirben: I had an experimental version studio from you (from about end of july) and with that one it only seemed to work. The app was still running in the background
[15:39:19] <Kirben> I think that problem is due to work around I had to use
[15:39:28] <Dominik> ah
[15:39:52] <Kirben> I have to do a :
[15:40:04] <Kirben> glade_xml_signal_connect(app_xml, "on_main_window_delete_event",
[15:40:07] <Kirben> (void(*)())on_main_window_delete_event);
[15:40:14] <Kirben> for each function
[15:41:29] <Kirben> instead of the current autoconnect
[15:41:52] <Dominik> we should release it saying you ported it now but the only thing you can do is crash it :-)
[15:42:41] <Darke> Dominik: Probably a bad idea, you can their reaction can't you? <grin>
[15:43:29] <Dominik> User: it's not working only crashing; WE: read the readme; User: ah, that's why
[15:44:06] <Nadir> you're talking about our users as if they were illiterate morons
[15:44:40] <Darke> No, you'd reignite interest, and we'll get even more "When's it going to be working? Properly!?" questions. <grin>
[15:44:54] <Dominik> nope, I only mean the ones who really are ilitterate
[15:45:12] <Nadir> rm -rf users
[15:45:14] <Darke> Nadir: Nah, if they were illiterate, then the third step wouldn't occur.
[15:45:51] * Darke wishes all of lifes 'little' problems were that easy to solve.
[15:47:23] <Dominik> the good thing is most of them tend to read the manual after all. And most of them who don't seldom ask another question that is in the FAQ
[15:47:28] <Dominik> or the docs
[15:48:44] <Dominik> btw, someone asked for keybaord movement long time ago. Do you think that will be put in again (and arrow cheat changed to some combination)?
[15:48:57] <Nadir> keyboard movement is good
[15:49:33] <Dominik> or maybe kexbaord movement with the numpad...
[15:49:37] <Nadir> I don't think arrow cheats should be changed
[15:49:48] <Nadir> cheating off: move avatar, cheating on: move screen
[15:49:55] <Dominik> really?
[15:50:08] <Dominik> I seem to remember now...
[15:50:44] <Dominik> whoops someone forgot to put this into the docs
[15:51:36] <Dominik> ah, it's not in already
[15:52:05] <Dominik> we only talked abot it some time ago
[15:56:14] <Nadir> yes
[15:56:31] <Nadir> has fingolfin fixed beta1 on macosx?
[15:58:32] <EazyCheze> ARGH! I can't find that one serpent tooth Stefano just gave me
[15:58:53] <EazyCheze> isn't there a way to automatically fit the teeth into the jawbone? That would've been cool
[15:59:25] <Dominik> Nadir: afaik no
[15:59:53] <Dominik> EazyCheze: you can create the teeth with the shape browser
[16:01:31] <Dominik> EazyCheze: objects 559 are the serpent teeth
[16:02:50] <EazyCheze> all righty
[16:02:52] <EazyCheze> hehe thanks
[16:03:02] <EazyCheze> I will create myself a nice set of teeth
[16:03:04] <EazyCheze> thanks
[16:03:11] <Dominik> he he
[16:03:17] <Dominik> you are welcome
[16:09:11] <EazyCheze> I now have a full jawbone... thank you :)
[16:09:22] <Dominik> :-)
[16:09:39] <Dominik> what about that crash you mentioned earlier today?
[16:09:59] <EazyCheze> It hasn't happened again... weird
[16:10:38] <-- Kirben has left IRC (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[16:14:34] <EazyCheze> hmmm
[16:14:56] <EazyCheze> where is that closet where Stefano put the blackrock order (I believe) serpent?
[16:17:02] <Dominik> search the western forests of Moonshade
[16:22:12] <Nadir> i'm off
[16:22:15] <Nadir> bye
[16:22:17] <Colourless> cya
[16:22:21] <-- Nadir has left IRC ("Client Exiting")
[16:22:21] <Dominik> bye
[16:26:22] <EazyCheze> you guys are a real great help to me... thanks :)
[16:27:33] * Darke wonders why there's no destructor for XMLnode... I guess Configuration has only ever been used as a 'global' variable. Easy enough to fix anyway.
[17:06:50] <Dominik> got to go
[17:06:53] <Dominik> bye
[17:06:56] <-- Dominik has left IRC ("Exult! Exult! Exult!")
[17:06:59] <Colourless> cya
[17:11:26] * Darke makes and commits changes to conf/. He _really_ hopes he doesn't break anything relating to that. <grin>
[17:12:41] <Darke> In any event, I must disappear, my bed is calling me. <grin> Night all!
[17:13:01] <-- Darke has left #exult ("And then there was one...")
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[17:47:27] --> wjp has joined #exult
[17:47:38] <wjp> hi
[17:47:43] <lennert> wjp!
[17:48:08] --- ChanServ gives channel operator status to wjp
[17:49:19] <wjp> hoi :-)
[17:50:17] <matto> wjp!
[17:54:16] * wjp looks at tons of cvslogs mails...
[17:54:26] <Colourless> hi
[18:17:02] <wjp> hmm, why do I only get the 'common' module if I check out the 'pentagram' module?
[18:23:12] <lennert> --- Ping reply from wjp : 54.22 second(s)
[18:23:13] <lennert> whee
[18:23:33] <wjp> oh my...
[18:23:36] <wjp> that bad?
[18:23:52] <lennert> yup
[18:24:02] <lennert> was a min ago or so though
[18:24:10] <lennert> back to ~1 sec now
[18:30:49] <ashp> Hmm.
[18:31:01] <ashp> Is there an NPC flag I can set on Dupre (in serpent isle) to make him join the party
[18:31:15] <ashp> he didn't turn up at the beginning when he should have done. I tried 'n' for npc flags, then set 'party', but that fails to set.
[18:31:19] <Colourless> no
[18:31:58] <ashp> That druken sod, I wonder where he actually is then
[18:32:11] <ashp> Loc (4080, 4080, 00)
[18:32:19] <ashp> I'm guessing that's some code for "nowhere, hahahaha"
[18:35:37] <-- wjp has left IRC (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
[18:37:59] --> wjp has joined #exult
[18:38:05] <lennert> wb wjp
[18:38:08] --- ChanServ gives channel operator status to wjp
[18:38:11] <wjp> thx
[18:38:18] * lennert still waiting for wjp to join his quake game.. tap tap tap
[18:38:18] <Colourless> w
[18:38:22] <wjp> how long was I gone?
[18:38:28] <Colourless> 3 minutes
[18:38:51] <ashp> Hmm. I wonder if I can teleport around until I get to those 4080,4080 coords and find him.. :/
[18:39:03] <wjp> nope, map only goes up to 3072
[18:39:56] <wjp> hmm, why do I only get the 'common' module if I check out the 'pentagram' module?
[18:40:27] * Colourless too
[18:40:43] <ashp> wjp: dammit :(
[18:40:44] <wjp> mind if I play with the CVSROOT a bit?
[18:40:49] <ashp> I hate dupre. I wonder why the hell he failed to show up
[18:40:53] <Colourless> no :-)
[18:41:10] * Colourless is currently attempting to improve pentagram sorting
[18:42:52] <wjp> please don't do anything to the pentagram module for a few minutes :-)
[18:43:06] <Colourless> i wont
[18:43:26] * lennert observes human lock management
[18:43:44] <Colourless> hehe
[18:44:28] <wjp> :-)
[18:50:54] * wjp is confused by this
[18:51:18] <wjp> & apparently "interpose[s] another module into the current module"
[18:53:06] <lennert> http://3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944592.jp/
[18:53:39] <wjp> yeah, I knew that one :-)
[19:29:37] <Colourless> hmm, the method that we are using to get the 3d coords of the shapes is wrong.
[19:30:29] <Colourless> sometimes the height of the shape is being given as being < 0
[19:30:40] <Colourless> this makes it impossible to properly sort by z
[19:31:28] <Colourless> the 'bottom' of the shape then becomes above the top
[19:32:48] <Colourless> from an initial look, it appears that the 3d dimentions of the shapes is stored as part of the data in TYPEFLAG.dat
[19:35:00] <Colourless> anyway, i have to go now. i'll attempt to work out more of typeflag.dat tomorrow
[19:35:12] <-- Colourless has left IRC ("bye")
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[19:35:50] <Fingolfin> lo
[19:36:00] <Fingolfin> pentagram CVS is borked it seems
[19:36:10] --- ChanServ gives channel operator status to Fingolfin
[19:37:52] <Fingolfin> so how do I get any pentgram source from CVS? :)
[19:39:15] --- Fingolfin is now known as Fingolfin|dinner
[19:40:07] <Fingolfin|dinner> maybe we have to put the pentagram code into another module, and then import that into the actual pentagram module?
[19:40:16] * Fingolfin|dinner goes looking for some docs on this... after dinner :)
[19:47:20] <wjp> Fingolfin|dinner: yes, that was what I was thinking too
[19:47:28] <wjp> sounds a bit complicated, though
[19:47:35] --- wjp is now known as wjp|quake
[19:49:55] <ashp> I have another semi-bug. In moonshade, (serpent isle), an automaton is supposed to approach you with a scroll so you can communicate with its master. However, it fails to come find me, getting me a little stuck :)
[20:05:39] <-- lennert has left #exult ("Client Exiting")
[20:20:17] <EazyCheze> welp, I'm off to find Lady Yelinda, who as I recall from my previous playings, has lost her skin (EWWW)
[20:22:52] <ashp> EazyCheze: I've given up for now, due to the moonshade bug.
[20:23:00] <ashp> I'll start playing if it ever gets fixed :)
[20:24:11] <EazyCheze> well, I got past that part fine... the automaton seems to come soon after Fedabiblio finishes talking about the spellbook. Or! You can go straight to Rotoluncia's house and talk to him there!
[20:30:55] <ashp> hmm
[20:30:59] <ashp> I thought rotoluncia was female?
[20:31:03] <ashp> which house is it? I went looking..
[20:31:29] --- wjp|quake is now known as wjp
[20:31:39] <wjp> 'him' = the automaton, I think
[20:32:10] <ashp> ahhh. I'm with you.
[20:32:28] <ashp> I'll try talking to all the automaton's I find, I can hack mover myself into the houses if required.
[20:33:52] * ashp makes plans to nuke canada from orbit :/
[20:34:42] <EazyCheze> hehe
[20:34:44] <EazyCheze> ash
[20:34:54] <EazyCheze> Rotoluncia's house is unlocked
[20:35:01] <EazyCheze> so don't worry :)
[20:35:25] <ashp> Which house is it? I'm still struggling around looking for it :)
[20:35:34] <EazyCheze> Northwest corner
[20:35:37] <EazyCheze> erm
[20:35:40] <EazyCheze> northEAST
[20:35:46] <EazyCheze> next to Stefano's
[20:36:03] <ashp> Hmm, found it
[20:36:09] <EazyCheze> erm, I ran out of picks trying to open all the chests in Fawn
[20:36:11] <ashp> the automaton just gives me the "I'm a servent" crap :/
[20:36:19] <EazyCheze> there are two
[20:36:41] <ashp> Hmm, not in my save. ahaha, that means the other one is wandering around somewhere :)
[20:37:20] <ashp> AHA
[20:37:28] <ashp> It got trapped inside the necromage's building
[20:37:32] <ashp> dumbass automaton :)
[20:38:43] <EazyCheze> haha
[20:38:44] <EazyCheze> weird
[20:38:55] <EazyCheze> I'm looking through the shape browser
[20:39:01] <EazyCheze> and I see the arachnians
[20:39:08] <EazyCheze> they look damn funny
[20:39:14] <ashp> I wish I had the ability to attach my party to me via a rope
[20:39:22] <ashp> as they are so slow, they lag behind.
[20:39:30] <EazyCheze> they're a mix of a long-haired pale man and a spider
[20:39:42] <ashp> I'm hoping dupre isn't important in the plot (apart from at the banes, that's all I recall), as he's not in my party
[20:39:53] <ashp> Actually, he's the guy who dies. I wonder how that'll work out.
[20:40:01] <ashp> EazyCheze: did dupre join your party? He just never appeared for me
[20:40:19] <EazyCheze> um
[20:40:24] <EazyCheze> that's a major bug
[20:40:39] <EazyCheze> all the monks say your three companions must be with you at all times
[20:40:45] <ashp> I figured as much, but I'd completed silver seed before I even noticed he hadn't appeared :)
[20:40:54] <ashp> He's in some crazy location, and there appears to be no way to shift him so I can speak to him
[20:41:00] <ashp> so I expect I'll run into issues later
[20:41:00] <EazyCheze> he should join you after you talk to Marsten originally
[20:41:13] <ashp> yeah, for some reason I thought he appeared in fawn so I didn't worryh at the time
[20:41:25] <EazyCheze> I mean, in the catacombs, when he talked about burying Pikeman Groat
[20:41:29] <EazyCheze> I remember that
[20:41:47] <ashp> I just set dupre to be able to fly/swim etc, maybe he'll magically run across the map to get to me :)
[20:41:52] <EazyCheze> hey willem which shape number is the lockpick? :)
[20:45:55] <EazyCheze> #627, I found it!
[20:46:01] <EazyCheze> woo hoo!
[20:47:40] <ashp> I normally just hit chests till they bust ;)
[20:50:08] <EazyCheze> well these are those indestructible fortified chests
[20:50:14] <EazyCheze> the ones with metal bracings
[20:50:32] <ashp> yeah, true
[20:50:51] <ashp> Pothos is an idiot
[20:51:01] <EazyCheze> hehe yeah
[20:51:13] <ashp> "I couldn't get blood moss"
[20:51:18] <ashp> "Just walk into the swamp, you dumb bastard"
[20:51:24] <EazyCheze> and the stuff's in his chest anyway
[20:51:29] <EazyCheze> I thought I saw it
[20:51:40] <ashp> ahaha, sounds about right
[20:51:49] <ashp> I completed the silver seed, so I have the ring of shal anyway
[20:51:52] <ashp> Screw reagents :)
[20:52:05] --- Fingolfin|dinner is now known as Fingolfin
[20:52:07] <EazyCheze> that'd be about right
[20:52:18] <EazyCheze> I have enough reagents though
[20:52:32] <EazyCheze> to where I can cast each spell an average of 30 times I think
[20:52:37] <ashp> It's a shame I can't just give you the number code to generate the ring
[20:52:45] <EazyCheze> more than I need
[20:52:45] <ashp> but unless there's a way to take an item and find out more info, just by clicking :)
[20:53:19] <wjp> if you compile in debugging mode, clicking on a shape will give you _tons_ of info
[20:53:37] <wjp> (well, 5 or 6 lines, anyway)
[20:53:48] <ashp> wjp: Actually, unless he has the silver seed addon, just knowing that info won't help too much, I'm assuming :)
[20:53:59] <wjp> no, you need the SS
[20:54:33] <wjp> ring is at 0bd7, 0b99, btw
[20:54:42] <ashp> You know, I think when exult studio fleshs out some more, I'll try to create Ultima 4 with it, just for fun. :)
[20:54:49] <ashp> The rings on my finger *grin* :)
[20:54:56] <wjp> no it isn't :-)
[20:55:20] <wjp> it's lying on the floor under some rocks right here :-)
[20:55:20] <ashp> I haven't actually got as far as a spellbook yet, so admittedly it's useless :)
[20:55:51] <ashp> :)
[20:56:04] <ashp> I'm glad my first post in r.c.g.u.d in a long time went ok
[20:56:07] <ashp> and nobody flamed me. . :)
[20:56:20] <wjp> s/c\.g/g.c/
[20:56:28] <EazyCheze> wow
[20:56:39] <ashp> See, it really _has_ been a long time :)
[20:56:47] <EazyCheze> they made full rotating sprites for the juggernaut hammer
[20:56:57] <ashp> I only posted because when playing with deja, I noticed someone had mentioned me recently
[20:58:16] <EazyCheze> What's your handle on there ashie
[20:59:00] <ashp> twilight dragon
[21:00:04] <wjp> hm, sounds familiar
[21:00:21] <ashp> I used to post, back in 97 or so
[21:01:32] <EazyCheze> haha sounds funny enough
[21:02:18] * Fingolfin now reads through http://www.cvshome.org/docs/manual/cvs_18.html#SEC155
[21:02:25] <wjp> C.1?
[21:02:34] <wjp> not much info there :/
[21:03:00] <EazyCheze> so did y'all find out what was causing that infinite recursion?
[21:03:27] <EazyCheze> It's no problem NOW of course, but I was wondering if you would choose to fix that rare bug that I got
[21:03:34] <EazyCheze> the caltrops was it?
[21:03:39] <EazyCheze> hmm, weird
[21:03:47] <Fingolfin> wjp: and following of course :)
[21:04:03] <EazyCheze> I was carrying caltrops all through my bg game and no problems... but then, si is a VERY different game :)
[21:04:09] <wjp> well, I consider C.1.* to be a part of C.1 :-)
[21:04:21] <ashp> I ring the bell to summon the turtle, and shamino vanishes. Uh oh. I hope that's part of the plot :)
[21:04:30] <wjp> ashp: huh?
[21:04:30] <EazyCheze> ash
[21:04:38] <EazyCheze> yes he is supposed to vanish
[21:04:46] <wjp> coincidence, probably
[21:04:50] <EazyCheze> you go back to town and ask Filbercia about it
[21:04:56] <EazyCheze> FilberciO
[21:04:57] <EazyCheze> hehe
[21:05:02] <Fingolfin> wjp: I think it gives enough information
[21:05:06] <ashp> Ok, I just couldn't recall if it was a plot device, or something crazy :)
[21:05:14] <wjp> Fingolfin: well, it's kind of vague
[21:06:05] <Fingolfin> I think it quite clearly says what we want to do is not possible, except maybe by trickery
[21:06:08] <wjp> it doesn't really explain the relation between the normal modules we usually work with and the things described there
[21:06:22] <wjp> hmm, it does? where?
[21:07:03] <Fingolfin> hmmm that is... I was reading it like that. Re-reading C.1.3, I am not really sure anymore. It says it creates a sub-dir for each ampersan module. But it doesn't mention anything about the contents of the module itself
[21:08:11] <wjp> so what if we create a "regular module" named pentagramX, and include that as an ampersand module in pentagram?
[21:08:30] <wjp> hmm, no, that will create a pentagramX dir behind the pentagram dir, nm
[21:08:40] <Fingolfin> yeah :/
[21:08:52] <Fingolfin> maybe we should look at the CVS source to figure it out? =)
[21:08:58] <wjp> :-)
[21:10:27] <wjp> ok, let's comment out this pentagram modules line, to begin with
[21:12:39] <wjp> funny
[21:12:43] <wjp> it still doesn't work
[21:13:07] <wjp> cvs server: existing repository /cvsroot/exult/CVSROOT/Emptydir does not match /cvsroot/exult/pentagram
[21:13:14] <wjp> cvs server: ignoring module pentagram
[21:15:07] <wjp> hmm, never mind... forgot to delete existing directory
[21:15:36] * wjp isn't particularly awake this evening
[21:15:38] * Fingolfin hopes somebody has backup of the pentagram source =)
[21:15:47] <wjp> making one right now :-)
[21:16:28] <Fingolfin> good... cause I deleted my checkout
[21:16:39] <Fingolfin> maybe we should send a warning mail around (or did you already? didn't check my email)
[21:16:41] <wjp> yeah, I did that too earlier today
[21:17:06] <wjp> you can check it out properly now, though
[21:17:44] <EazyCheze> what is the Pentagram viewer?
[21:17:46] <wjp> warning mail?
[21:25:37] * wjp has to go
[21:25:38] <wjp> bye
[21:25:39] <-- wjp has left IRC ("[x]chat")
[22:06:17] <-- Fingolfin has left IRC ("bbl")
[22:30:05] --> Fingolfin has joined #exult