#gemrb@irc.freenode.net logs for 27 Jan 2011 (GMT)

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[01:24:37] <vible> i love pst so i would like to try to make atleast a temporary floating-text system, as i cant really find any info on where to begin, could you give me a hint?
[01:26:38] <Textmode> the source has no structure that I can decern. :3
[01:27:21] <vible> haha, thats why im asking ;)
[01:37:53] <Textmode> what files have you checked?
[01:39:51] <vible> well i guess that it wouldnt bee in the GUIScript files as itisnt actuall part of the gui, and all the other stuff isnt categorized by game
[01:40:17] <vible> so i felt that i should just ask ehre
[01:44:22] <Textmode> not exactly peak time here :/
[01:44:37] <vible> nah, its pretty late
[01:44:50] <vible> but im a nighttimecoder .)
[01:45:12] <Textmode> now that you mention it...I don't think I can recall seeing any rendering code on my sojourns through the code...
[01:47:05] <vible> i havent either, but it has to be somewhere ;)
[01:51:57] <Textmode> one hopes.
[01:52:32] <vible> haha :)
[01:55:38] <Textmode> vible: here, make note of anything you find, I'll do the same... http://ietherpad.com/gemrb-org
[01:56:53] <vible> haha allright :)
[02:01:39] <vible> notice that the object core is used everywhere? im looking for it right now
[02:02:03] <Textmode> I could sware I saw a file with that name...
[02:02:25] <Textmode> core/Core.cpp
[02:02:51] <vible> yeah but its a instanceobject called core im looking fore
[02:03:17] <Textmode> hmm...
[02:03:17] <vible> core.cpp doesnt even have a Core class
[02:03:37] <Textmode> 'cause not, that would make sense.
[02:03:44] <Textmode> :3
[02:04:09] <vible> haha
[02:06:34] <Textmode> tell me if you find externs.h
[02:07:37] <vible> there is no file called externs in the whole source :P
[02:07:45] <vible> find | grep externs gives nothing
[02:07:52] <Textmode> cool.
[02:08:55] <vible> i found core!
[02:09:06] <vible> its an instance of the class Interface
[02:09:14] <Textmode> ...
[02:09:35] <vible> haha
[02:10:31] * Textmode wonders about GEM_ENCRYPTION_KEY in globals.h
[02:11:37] <vible> haha, yeah xD
[02:11:57] <vible> randomnumber
[02:12:07] <Textmode> where?
[02:12:26] <vible> GEM_ENCRYPTION_KEY :D
[02:15:20] <Textmode> 10 genders
[02:17:03] <vible> haha what? :D
[02:17:39] <Textmode> male, female, other, neither, both, summon, illusion, extra, extra2, maxextra.
[02:17:58] <vible> haha :D
[02:18:13] <vible> extra2 and manextra sounds great :D
[02:18:29] <Textmode> heh
[02:19:24] <vible> i like how they did the loggingshit, just defining some nice functions
[02:19:29] <vible> just to make it look nicer
[02:20:29] <vible> have you worked anything on gemrb?
[02:22:29] <Textmode> no, not yet.
[02:23:02] <vible> trying to?
[02:23:04] <Textmode> tell me if you find anythign relating to the rule mechanics
[02:23:41] <Textmode> yeah, I was considering using it to make a new game. and maybe get PsT and the IWDs running native.
[02:23:53] <vible> like D&D rules?
[02:24:05] <Textmode> yeah, the dnd rules.
[02:24:14] <Textmode> I'm not fond of them :P
[02:24:37] <vible> allright
[02:24:52] <vible> im mainly here for the todo: PST floating text
[02:25:01] <vible> but tell me if you want to try to make a new game ;)
[02:25:38] <Textmode> I feel like I'm completely missing something wrt sprite2d.cpp...
[02:25:46] <vible> what dist are you using?
[02:25:56] <Textmode> ubuntu
[02:26:31] <vible> allright
[02:28:39] <Textmode> ..."projectileServer.cpp"
[02:29:02] <vible> what are you missing with sprite2d.cpp?
[02:30:00] <Textmode> there doesn't seem to be anything in there to actually draw it...are you supposed to just GetPixel it on to the screen?
[02:31:07] <Textmode> theres really no comment in here, is there?
[02:31:13] <Textmode> comments*
[02:31:16] <vible> sprite2d seem to be more about handeling the sprite then drawing it
[02:31:32] <vible> like palletteswap and stuff like that
[02:31:42] <Textmode> what does LRU mean?
[02:32:10] <vible> what context?
[02:32:20] <Textmode> LRUCache.cpp
[02:34:12] <vible> looks like a heap
[02:34:34] <vible> and according to google LRU means least recently used, which makes sense
[02:34:52] <Textmode> ah, that makes sense.
[02:35:46] <vible> and no, theu dont ssem to use comments, but most of it looks pretty straight forward
[02:36:23] <Textmode> "Multiple Quick saves is an experimental GemRB feature. [...] There is an algorithm which keeps about log2(n) slots alive."
[02:37:40] <vible> does it say anywhere what the default value of n is? D
[02:37:50] <Textmode> no.
[02:39:17] <vible> strange that they would use log2 if n isnt used?
[02:39:57] <vible> and alot of renderingstuffs is in the GUI folder
[02:40:10] <Textmode> the entire function in question seems to ammount to the line "mqs=arg==1;"
[02:40:50] <vible> ==1? so its basicly 1 or 0? xD
[02:40:57] <Textmode> GUI/GameControl.cpp seems relevant, but I can't decide what exactly to label it as...
[02:41:28] <Textmode> I think its merely setting a flag indicating if the feature is to be used...
[02:41:56] <vible> yeah, so the logarithm is just waste xD
[02:42:20] <tomprince> The drawing code is in the SDLVideo plugin.
[02:42:33] <Textmode> idk, it might be using the logarithm elsewhere, this obviously isn't the workhorse function.
[02:43:43] <vible> hahah
[02:44:17] <tomprince> I think most of the rules rules code is probably in core/GameScript and probably some in the Effect code.
[02:44:45] <vible> tomprince, yeah core->GetVideoDriver points to it
[02:47:00] <Textmode> why is SDLVideo handling keyboard events?
[02:47:38] <tomprince> Because all the SDL aware code was in SDLVideo.
[02:48:59] <tomprince> The code has grown very organically., and the focus has been on getting all the games work, rather than making the code pretty.
[02:49:20] <vible> Textmode, some rules are in core/GameScript/Actions.cpp
[02:49:22] <vible> as tomprince said
[02:49:46] <vible> tomprince, couldve been much worse :D
[02:49:52] <vible> this code is actually readable
[02:55:32] <vible> its 4am here now, and i have an exam tomorrow
[02:55:34] <vible> so goodnight
[02:56:09] <Textmode> rest well
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[07:47:26] <lynxlynxlynx> vible: maybe a good start would be DisplayStringHead
[07:47:53] <lynxlynxlynx> http://log.usecode.org/gemrblog.php <-- also check yesterday's discussion, you'll see there was talk exactly about floating text :)
[07:49:09] <lynxlynxlynx> files of interest are also Actor.cpp/ActorBlock.cpp and Map.cpp
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[08:31:44] <Textmode> lynxlynxlynx: I don't see the dicussion aobut floating text, maybe I didn't go back far enough...
[08:32:10] <lynxlynxlynx> then you didn't
[08:32:21] <lynxlynxlynx> other stuff was discussed too
[08:33:53] <Textmode> ah, I think i see it.
[08:43:36] <edheldil> Textmode: majority of active people here is from Europe, so you will have better luck somewhere between 7:00 - 12:00 UTC
[08:44:02] <edheldil> except of tomprince :)
[08:47:08] * Textmode huuggles edheldil
[09:04:58] <edheldil> Hi, Textmode :)
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[16:38:47] <vible> im from europe but i think i got on irc a little late :D
[16:39:48] <fuzzie> hehe
[16:40:17] <vible> what does GemRB stand for?
[16:42:46] <wjp> game engine with prerendered background or something like that
[16:43:11] <vible> haha swweet :D
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[16:44:51] <Avenger> haha, i found the most ludicrous infinity engine quirk so far
[16:45:53] <Avenger> each scriptable object has 6 script levels, just like in our engine, but the IE area's script runs on the default level, while all other scriptables single script runs on the override level
[16:46:20] <fuzzie> interesting
[16:46:24] <Avenger> theoretically you could have 6 scripts running as area script
[16:46:39] <Avenger> or 6 scripts running as a door script, etc
[16:46:56] <Avenger> i found this by planescape's ar0102 script
[16:47:19] <Avenger> maybe other engines safeguard the changeaiscript method
[16:48:10] <Avenger> our mebbeth duplication bug happens because we assign the ar0102 script to the override level (0), but it should be assigned to the default level
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[16:48:25] <Avenger> the script replaces the default level with another script, but remains in effect in our engine
[16:48:37] <Avenger> so mebbeth duplicates like crazy
[16:49:27] <fuzzie> hehe
[16:49:28] <Avenger> ok, if all engines work the same way, we can fix this easily by assigning the area script to the correct slot
[16:49:44] <fuzzie> or just GF_ it
[16:50:15] <Avenger> when i first made all scriptables have all 6 script levels, i did it out of laziness :)
[16:50:22] <Avenger> i didn't expect the original engine doing the same
[16:51:59] <Avenger> heh, if i knew this multiple scripts feature earlier, it is actually very useful. i cannot believe no one found it out earlier
[16:53:29] <vible> its freakin hard getting into the src of gemrb ^^
[16:53:38] <fuzzie> ask questions :)
[16:53:56] <fuzzie> it is a lot easier if you already know much about infinity engine modding
[16:54:05] <vible> yeah i bet ^^
[16:54:12] <vible> which i dont ;)
[16:54:16] <Avenger> well, it is even harder to get into the src of the original engine :P
[16:54:17] <fuzzie> yeah, i didn't either :)
[16:54:23] * wjp still doesn't :-)
[16:54:45] <fuzzie> yes, but you are the magic wjp of many hats, you're special
[16:55:38] <Avenger> to tame the gemrb sources, first start with the python scripts
[16:56:05] <Avenger> and learn at least some ie modding from iesdp
[16:56:23] <vible> allright ;)
[16:56:28] <Avenger> the python script stuff is documented too
[16:56:33] <Avenger> so it is easy learning
[16:56:47] <fuzzie> i like linking people to that DLTCEP tutorial
[16:57:02] <fuzzie> not for them to learn DLTCEP, but i think it is nice overview of how everything works
[16:57:24] <Avenger> is there a dltcep tutorial for more than areas?
[16:57:41] <fuzzie> no, but the area one is really goo
[16:57:43] <fuzzie> d
[16:57:50] <vible> fuzzie link? :)
[16:58:01] <Avenger> yes, it is really good, but it is 'only' area stuff
[16:58:04] <fuzzie> yeah
[16:58:09] <fuzzie> but it teaches you what the rest *is* :P
[16:58:14] <fuzzie> http://www.simpilot.net/~sc/dltcep/index.htm
[16:59:23] <vible> looking for projects to do on my free time, and this looks rewarding
[16:59:48] <Avenger> are you a coder?
[17:00:07] <Avenger> i mean, you know c / c++ / python well?
[17:00:10] <fuzzie> there's huge amounts of fairly obvious fixes in GemRB, if you have time and vaguely know code
[17:00:24] <Avenger> yeah, lots of stuff to fix
[17:00:54] <vible> yeah im a coder, and i im really good at C/C++ and know some python
[17:00:59] <vible> prefer c over c++ tho
[17:01:03] <Avenger> that's great
[17:01:21] <Avenger> even preferring c over c++ ;)
[17:01:42] <vible> haha :)
[17:01:42] <Avenger> i prefer using less convoluted constructs whenever possible
[17:01:57] <vible> yeah same here
[17:02:12] <fuzzie> Just as long as you don't use more convoluted constructs just because it's not C++. :P
[17:02:19] <Avenger> :P
[17:02:23] <vible> haha
[17:02:49] <Avenger> you have to give it to me, passing those weak pointers to and from python and around the world is not the best idea
[17:02:57] <Avenger> or smart pointers?
[17:03:00] <Avenger> whatever they are
[17:03:03] <fuzzie> well, smart pointers are nice
[17:03:07] <vible> got beer and snus, now im ready to learn stuff
[17:03:09] <fuzzie> passing them to python, yes, i agree :P
[17:03:47] <fuzzie> and i'm not convinced they're really working out so well everywhere else, but meh, no-one else is fixing it
[17:04:11] <fuzzie> it's really difficult to work on some parts of GemRB because we're still not quite sure how the original works
[17:04:18] <fuzzie> but there's plenty of obvious stuff
[17:04:31] <fuzzie> and Avenger or other people can usually work things out, with enough time
[17:04:34] <Avenger> well, that's why i got two instances of ida open all the time :P
[17:04:36] <vible> what documentation do you have from the original?
[17:04:38] <fuzzie> although apparently details of how instant works are still beyond everyone
[17:04:44] <Avenger> iesdp
[17:04:50] <fuzzie> i have 5 different incorrect explanations of instants, now
[17:04:51] <Avenger> iesdp is our IE documentation
[17:05:16] <vible> yeah ive looked into it
[17:05:17] <fuzzie> http://iesdp.gibberlings3.net/ and http://forums.gibberlings3.net/index.php?showforum=54
[17:05:28] <fuzzie> the forums can have a lot of stuff which never went into the official version
[17:05:29] <vible> lots of stuff up for the imagination tho ;)
[17:05:37] <Avenger> well, yes
[17:05:56] <Avenger> today i found a new field, in pst doors :)
[17:06:02] <Avenger> pst doors got hitpoints
[17:06:08] <fuzzie> ok
[17:06:12] <fuzzie> i will regret asking this
[17:06:16] <fuzzie> but, why do pst doors have hitpoints?
[17:06:34] <Avenger> no idea, Damage(DOOR) handles it
[17:06:45] <Avenger> there is a damage action
[17:06:50] <Avenger> it works on actors and doors
[17:06:56] <fuzzie> ok
[17:06:58] <fuzzie> not containers?
[17:07:03] <Avenger> no
[17:07:24] <Avenger> and the damage field is in one of those unknowns (0x54)
[17:07:33] <Avenger> this is unique to pst, btw
[17:07:47] <fuzzie> yes
[17:07:48] <vible> you guys should get a website
[17:07:50] <fuzzie> i figured :P
[17:08:22] <fuzzie> Avenger: you think it's called internally?
[17:08:30] <Avenger> btw, even bg2 sets this field to 20 if it was 0
[17:08:36] <Avenger> but nothing uses it in bg2
[17:08:41] <Avenger> no
[17:08:51] <Avenger> i looked for all accessing instances
[17:09:05] <Avenger> i guess it is an undeveloped feature
[17:09:06] <fuzzie> there's nothing in the script under Damage, but i don't know which aliases
[17:09:51] <Avenger> 259 Damage(O:Target*,I:Delta*Delta,I:Modifier*) ?
[17:10:00] <Avenger> use dltcep to look for the opcode
[17:10:20] <Avenger> looks like unused
[17:10:33] <Avenger> ah no, there are 4 uses
[17:10:36] <fuzzie> yes, i don't see any relevant uses
[17:10:40] <fuzzie> there's a *lot* of uses in dialog
[17:10:53] <fuzzie> but none of them are on doors
[17:11:22] <Avenger> yes
[17:11:53] <Avenger> well, you were just always puzzled about 0x54 :) so i thought you might find this interesting
[17:12:00] <fuzzie> yes
[17:12:03] <fuzzie> it is interesting
[17:12:06] <fuzzie> it is just weird
[17:12:12] <fuzzie> why are game developers all crazy?
[17:12:14] <Avenger> yeah, totally
[17:12:27] <Avenger> i consider this only a half-developed feature
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[17:12:42] <Avenger> they got an empty field, and a good idea, but didn't finish it
[17:13:08] <Avenger> did you know prybars got a +10 on bend bars checks?
[17:13:17] <Avenger> so basically you can open anything with prybars
[17:13:38] <Avenger> it is a good idea, but they screwed this up by hardcoding
[17:13:52] <fuzzie> yeah
[17:14:05] <Avenger> i will implement this with the itemspec table, and a new item field
[17:14:06] <fuzzie> have you looked at the fixpack source?
[17:14:12] <Avenger> hmm
[17:14:15] <Avenger> no
[17:14:19] <fuzzie> you should
[17:14:25] <Avenger> do you think this is an .exe mod by fixpack?
[17:14:47] <fuzzie> hmm
[17:14:52] <fuzzie> where is the check?
[17:14:54] <Avenger> because the code looked like a patched in code, done in low level language
[17:15:25] <fuzzie> the one in BashDoor() is fixpack
[17:15:41] <Avenger> 0043A2ED
[17:15:49] <fuzzie> and there's one at 0x0003A2ED
[17:15:56] <fuzzie> so, well :P
[17:15:58] <Avenger> in bashdoor
[17:16:10] <fuzzie> it says 'prybar fix'
[17:16:10] <Avenger> so that's a fixpack hackery?
[17:16:14] <Avenger> meh
[17:16:24] <fuzzie> yes, it is indeed fixpack hackery
[17:16:30] <fuzzie> you shouldn't be IDAing a fixpacked binary i guess :P
[17:16:37] <Avenger> well yeah
[17:16:47] <fuzzie> i think this one was something they forgot to put in the game
[17:16:57] <Avenger> i had some vague idea that it might be fixpacked
[17:16:58] <fuzzie> > Equipping the prybar will now grant a 10% bonus to attempts to bash open locked containers, as its description implies.
[17:17:21] <fuzzie> anyway, see pst-fix/tph/enginefixes.tph
[17:17:31] <fuzzie> maybe it's helpful if you didn't map everything already
[17:17:45] <Avenger> well, i did
[17:17:52] <Avenger> it is very nicely mapped out
[17:18:07] <fuzzie> the fixpack comments are useful for finding bugs
[17:18:08] <Avenger> but the fixpack patch stuff stands out somewhat
[17:18:12] <fuzzie> but, they're very time-consuming
[17:18:24] <fuzzie> because they just say 'oh, this action is weird, so we do this'
[17:19:16] <Avenger> ok, so i guess, we shouldn't implement the prybar this way. I will just add an item flag
[17:19:21] <Avenger> or something else
[17:19:41] <Avenger> exe mods may require change, that's not a big deal
[17:20:13] <fuzzie> yeah
[17:20:27] <fuzzie> we'll need to add some code for fixpack compat
[17:20:29] <Avenger> you are right, i shouldn't have re-d this tampered exe, but i won't start again
[17:20:50] <Avenger> it takes a lot of time to make these notes
[17:21:10] <fuzzie> but the KNOW_TIRESIAS hack is the only really nasty one, i think
[17:21:12] <Avenger> i work on the five engines since july last year :)
[17:21:31] <Avenger> hmm, i didn't see them yet
[17:21:38] <fuzzie> that's in the secret door code
[17:21:55] <Avenger> finding a secret door?
[17:21:59] <fuzzie> yeah
[17:22:05] <fuzzie> some of the changes are impossible for you to notice, though :)
[17:22:44] <Avenger> the patch is at 43A37B
[17:22:59] <fuzzie> but most of them are obvious
[17:23:10] <Avenger> yes, if they are patched in place, without adding nops, i wouldn't notice them
[17:23:20] <Avenger> but looping out into this repurposed area is obvious ;)
[17:23:23] <fuzzie> sure
[17:23:38] <fuzzie> i think the ones which change single bytes are important bugfixes we should take anyway
[17:24:32] <Avenger> wait, if i understood this correctly, if the KNOW_TIRESIAS variable is set, you will see the secret door?
[17:24:39] <Avenger> any secret doors
[17:24:40] <fuzzie> yes
[17:24:42] <fuzzie> there's only one :P
[17:24:46] <Avenger> and this works because this is the only one, yea
[17:24:58] <Avenger> heh, this is obviously crap
[17:25:01] <fuzzie> we'll script it in gemrb
[17:25:16] <fuzzie> but apparently they had no way to script it in the original engine
[17:25:33] <Avenger> wouldn't if global("know_tiresias"..) then response #100; DetectSecretDoor("xxx") work?
[17:26:00] <Avenger> isn't there a detectsecretdoor action?
[17:26:33] <Avenger> lol, in bg2
[17:26:39] <Avenger> there is one
[17:27:32] <Avenger> pst has an action as 201, but i think it is dead
[17:27:57] <Avenger> the benefit of using 201 would be portable scripts
[17:28:12] <Avenger> but i don't mind having it relocated for pst
[17:28:55] <fuzzie> can you set secret doors to only be detectable from scripts?
[17:28:59] <fuzzie> if so, that sounds perfect
[17:29:03] <fuzzie> but, worry about it later
[17:29:08] <fuzzie> i'm sure we had this discussion before
[17:29:39] <Avenger> ok, i reboot to linux, and fix what i can today
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[18:01:38] <edheldil> ahh, I wanted to ask Avenger about ground circle sizes :)
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[18:29:03] <CIA-29> GemRB: 03avenger_teambg * r18b540982a7c 10gemrb/gemrb/plugins/AREImporter/AREImporter.cpp: fixed area script slot (this fixes pst mebbeth duplication bug in ar0102)
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[19:21:20] <Avenger> edheldil , what did you want to know about circles?
[19:41:38] <edheldil> we were talking with fuzzie about avatars.2da and resdata.ini. maybe we should use resdata.ini in other games than ps:t - but where from comes circle size, since it's not in resdata.ini? Do you have any idea? Is it hardcoded, or something else?
[19:42:07] <edheldil> Avenger: in original games, I mean
[19:42:08] <fuzzie> I really think trying to use a data file for non-pst hard-coded avatar code is insane. :P
[19:42:19] <fuzzie> But I would be interested to know where the pst circle sizes come from.
[19:43:03] <edheldil> fuzzie: why insane? it's mostly the same info as in avatars.2da
[19:44:26] <fuzzie> Because there's all this equipment stuff, and it would be even more difficult to maintain.
[20:06:21] <Avenger> it is probably hardcoded
[20:06:51] <Avenger> i should take a peek at the code, i will do that tomorrow
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[20:35:23] <edheldil> ok
[20:41:39] <fuzzie> I mean, I don't know.
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