#gemrb@irc.freenode.net logs for 6 Mar 2013 (GMT)

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[08:28:29] <DrMcCoy> https://torment.inxile-entertainment.com/ :)
[08:28:31] <Seniorita> Torment: Tides of Numenera - inXile entertainment
[08:29:00] <fuzzie> Thanks.
[08:33:32] <DrMcCoy> Still, I hope they get some actual information going when the kickstarter thing goes live in 5.5h
[08:33:54] <DrMcCoy> Also, a PayPal options
[08:34:07] <fuzzie> well, yes, otherwise it won't be a very impressive kickstarter..
[08:34:10] <DrMcCoy> Also, Linux as a target platform :P
[08:34:10] <Gekz> wait what
[08:34:16] <Gekz> it's Torment, but not Planescape.
[08:34:17] <Gekz> ...
[08:34:20] <DrMcCoy> Yes
[08:34:22] <DrMcCoy> Weird, but okay
[08:34:26] <Gekz> so
[08:34:30] <Gekz> he bought the trademark to the wrong half
[08:34:32] <Gekz> right.
[08:35:04] <DrMcCoy> I really doubt WotC / Hasbro would let the Planescape trademark go
[08:35:45] <fuzzie> well, they let BG:EE happen
[08:36:14] <DrMcCoy> I love both parts of Planescape: Torment. Even if it's not in the Planescape setting, I still have Torment
[08:36:39] <DrMcCoy> Numenera looks interesting as well
[08:36:55] <DrMcCoy> Dune-ish
[08:39:04] <DrMcCoy> I hope they're doing a German translation of the Numenera RPG books some day; this looks like something I'd play
[08:40:03] <fuzzie> heh, everyone just uses English-language rulebooks for everything here :)
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[08:41:25] <DrMcCoy> I've never seen that work out well here. Works fine with English computer games and board games, but English proper RPGs somehow don't
[08:41:55] <fuzzie> well, I think it demands a higher level of fluency
[08:42:11] <fuzzie> so understandable
[08:43:37] <DrMcCoy> Also, it's in general pretty hard to get the two groups I have move away from DSA for even one session...
[09:19:28] <edheldil> fuzzie: we use english sourcebooks as well
[09:19:46] <edheldil> the torment KS looks tempting :)
[09:20:58] <traveler> arrgh myconids
[09:21:04] <traveler> they were supposed to be easy
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[11:41:07] <traveler> do you cannot connect to ftp://ftp.freedesktop.org/pub/mesa/ too?
[11:44:18] <fuzzie> yeah, it's dropping the connection immediately
[11:52:11] <traveler> thanks
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[20:33:08] <brada> psch: can you see if that fixes the keyboard gestures for android?
[20:33:53] <brada> note that they are intended to be large quick swipes to prevent accidental triggering
[20:34:18] <brada> i dont know if i acomplish that because i have no good way of testing
[20:34:26] <brada> if you would be so kind :)
[21:19:35] <psch> building right now
[21:20:21] <psch> i did pull about 7 or so hours ago and had a crash with multitouches during dialogues, but from the looks of your recent commits that should be gone now
[21:20:34] <psch> finger0 was null again in line 391
[21:20:37] <psch> but that's gone now
[21:21:04] <psch> the access to finger0 in that line i mean
[21:21:09] <lynxlynxlynx> awesome, we also work on windows rt
[21:21:29] <psch> work as in function or work as in porting?
[21:21:48] <lynxlynxlynx> function
[21:21:54] <lynxlynxlynx> minimal changes involved
[21:21:58] <fuzzie> without having to jailbreak it?
[21:22:03] <lynxlynxlynx> http://forums.gibberlings3.net/index.php?showtopic=25120&pid=207437&st=0&#entry207437
[21:22:04] <Seniorita> GemRB on windows RT - The Gibberlings Three Forums
[21:22:21] <fuzzie> because it's just windows-on-arm if you jailbreak it
[21:23:20] <fuzzie> i guess that is uninformative on that front
[21:23:42] <lynxlynxlynx> i don't consider platform mixins as working by default
[21:24:04] <lynxlynxlynx> i see there are win8 versions of the surface thing too
[21:24:12] <fuzzie> yeah
[21:24:24] <fuzzie> winrt is really just win8 built for arm with the signature check set higher though
[21:24:50] <fuzzie> but, yes, i mean, it's cool that it works, it's a fiddly new architecture port
[21:25:10] <fuzzie> just a port that people can actually *use* would be really great, and not clear if that is there or not :P
[21:25:39] <fuzzie> can't think why it would dump weird values to the file, off the top of my head..
[21:26:27] <lynxlynxlynx> heh, that's the only make_pair use we have
[21:26:30] <fuzzie> since it works fine on e.g. arm
[21:26:37] <fuzzie> erm, e.g. android
[21:26:54] <lynxlynxlynx> and the value is low
[21:27:13] <fuzzie> it's 0x1fff9cc0 if i copy-and-pasted right
[21:27:22] <fuzzie> which seems not very meaningful
[21:27:46] <psch> brada: a really quick three finger swipe gives me the soft keyboard
[21:28:02] <brada> then another give console?
[21:28:08] <brada> and 3 down hides them?
[21:28:20] <psch> yeah
[21:28:37] <fuzzie> sounds good?
[21:28:42] <psch> it's pretty hard to do though
[21:28:55] <brada> why is that?
[21:29:00] <psch> the timing is really tight
[21:29:11] <brada> like i said i had no good way fof testing
[21:29:16] <brada> so i was guessing
[21:29:34] <psch> oh and something i discovered this afternoon
[21:29:47] <brada> can you play with the values some
[21:29:52] <brada> let me know what works?
[21:30:00] <psch> touching with two simultaniously let's me scroll without the selection box
[21:30:14] <psch> but if i touch first with one finger and add the second i have the box
[21:30:25] <brada> dont worry about it
[21:30:36] <brada> i have unpublished cahnges that will fix that
[21:30:37] <psch> im not worrying, i just thought i should mention it
[21:30:38] <brada> (i think)
[21:30:42] <psch> hehe
[21:30:52] <brada> the problem stems from mouse events
[21:30:58] <brada> because before we ignored them
[21:31:09] <brada> now we ignore them only if they arent created by touches
[21:31:22] <brada> but when i warp the mouse it doesnt know any better
[21:32:36] <psch> im looking at MIN_GESTURE_DELTA_PIXELS for my tests?
[21:32:59] <psch> oh probably both of the defines at the top of the file
[21:34:34] <psch> ah nvm, TOUCH_RC_NUM_TICKS is the delay for ProcessFirstTouch
[21:36:10] <brada> yes MIN_GESTURE_DELTA_PIXELS
[21:36:23] <brada> hell we could just not use that
[21:36:32] <brada> since its a 3 finger gesture
[21:36:37] <brada> but see what feels best
[21:36:47] <psch> alright
[21:37:43] <lynxlynxlynx> http://sprunge.us/hYAI?diff <-- you think letting the compiler decide will help?
[21:38:52] <fuzzie> why not just make it std::pair?
[21:41:07] <fuzzie> but yes, your change should hopefully be fine too
[21:41:59] <brada> psch: not sure what can be done about the 1 finger changin to 2 finger drag problem
[21:42:03] <brada> im listening for ideas
[21:42:15] <fuzzie> which is to say, "our current use of make_pair there is broken and your diff fixes it"
[21:42:49] <fuzzie> and less verbose is good i guess.
[21:44:18] <lynxlynxlynx> i was pondering the same
[21:44:37] <lynxlynxlynx> is the added typo info increasing the readability or not
[21:44:58] <fuzzie> i can't imagine so
[21:45:03] <fuzzie> and so your suggested change is better
[21:45:04] <lynxlynxlynx> and in the end decided it doesn't
[21:45:08] <lynxlynxlynx> yeah
[21:47:35] <psch> MIN_GESTURE_DELTA_PIXELS 2 feels good; the actual difficulty seem to come from touching "simultaniously enough", if that makes sense
[21:47:58] <psch> as in, with 2 for the constant i still can't do it every time, but it seems when it doesnt work i touch with two fingers first
[21:48:13] <psch> i don't know whether that is normal multitouch behavior though
[21:49:04] <brada> something very hard to do in the simulator for sure
[21:50:03] <psch> yes, i get it, "why don't you figure out how this works and implement it"
[21:50:20] <psch> not to sound snarky, sorry if i do
[21:50:42] <brada> what?
[21:51:02] <brada> i just dont have a device and the simulator is por for simulating multi finger events
[21:51:17] <brada> they are always simultaneous for example
[21:51:24] <psch> yes, i know, i was trying to be funny again
[21:51:26] <psch> my bad
[21:51:34] <psch> i had a glass of wine, don't hate me
[21:51:53] --- ermo^ is now known as ermo
[21:52:03] <brada> beer is better :p
[21:52:23] <brada> what happens if you put continuingGesture = false; at the front of both finger down /up unconditionally?
[21:55:37] <brada> yes ill bet that will work for you
[21:55:42] <brada> and be better anyway
[21:55:53] <brada> continuingGesture should be reset anytime the numFingers changes
[21:56:31] <Seniorita> [wiki] engine:platforms http://www.gemrb.org/wiki/doku.php?id=engine:platforms&rev=1362606707&do=diff
[21:58:07] <brada> psch: try that
[21:58:12] <psch> i am
[21:58:57] <psch> am i understanding it correctly that incrementally touching with three and then swiping should give me the keyboard?
[21:59:43] <psch> because that's not happening
[22:01:58] <brada> works for me
[22:02:11] <brada> not sure hwat you are doing exactly
[22:04:48] <psch> hm
[22:04:56] <psch> what i was doing is
[22:05:36] <psch> touch three fingers with about half a second apart and then, when all three touch, swipe upwards
[22:05:40] <psch> which doesn't work
[22:06:09] <psch> but swiping and increasing touching fingers to three gives me the softkeyboard
[22:06:35] <psch> as in, touch which one, move it upwards, touch with the other two while moving
[22:07:32] <psch> touching with three, waiting a moment and then swiping doesn't give me the keyboard
[22:07:50] <psch> that might be ProcessFirstTouch getting called i'm thinking
[22:08:16] <psch> but im not sure why im thinking that, and i kinda want to go to bed hah
[22:08:19] <brada> just swipe with 3…
[22:08:51] <psch> well, yes, i can reliably get the keyboard
[22:09:51] <brada> and console?
[22:10:17] <psch> that too
[22:10:42] <psch> im thinking 2 might be too little for the delta constant though, unless we want to have the user get both in one swipe if he wants it
[22:10:55] <brada> its still at 5
[22:11:00] <psch> i changed it locally
[22:11:03] <psch> i told you about that too
[22:11:03] <brada> ah
[22:11:10] <brada> yeah i ignored it :p
[22:11:37] <brada> but no you are not supposed to be able to get both keyboard and console in 1 swipe
[22:11:58] <brada> you must do 2 gestures intentionally
[22:12:27] <psch> ill play around with it a bit
[22:13:03] <psch> different values for the constant being "it" in this case
[22:13:08] <brada> i didnt think handling mouse events would cause me to rewrite touch event handling :/
[22:17:02] <brada> psch: is it really easy to make the selection rect when trying to 2 finger scroll?
[22:17:23] <brada> conversely is it easy to avoid?
[22:19:39] <psch> hard to quantify, but it happens when i think it shouldnt happen
[22:19:58] <psch> i mean, i'm not a robot so i can't 100% consistently touch with two fingers simultaniously
[22:20:12] <psch> but sometimes when i think i did touch at the same time i still get the selection rectangle
[22:20:26] <psch> about 1 in 10 or maybe 1 in 8
[22:20:49] --- ermo is now known as ermo^
[22:21:42] <brada> bleh
[22:22:21] <brada> not sure how to cancel it
[22:22:30] <brada> that stuff is internal to gemrb
[22:22:43] <brada> a mouse up would do it but have other undesired sideeffects
[22:26:39] <psch> MIN_GESTURE_DELTA_PIXELS 10 seems good wrt softkeyboard
[22:26:50] <brada> is 5 ok?
[22:26:57] <brada> i can change it if not
[22:27:06] <psch> i can still get both the keyboard and the console at the same time, but only with a quick swipe over the whole display as fast as possible
[22:27:26] <brada> hmmm
[22:27:27] <psch> ill go back to 5 and check again
[22:27:39] <brada> you should have to do a new event to get console
[22:27:50] <brada> which has nothing to do with the delta
[22:28:08] <psch> continuing the motion is not a new event?
[22:28:15] <psch> i'd figure it would be, seeing as x and y pos change
[22:28:57] <brada> look at continuingGesture
[22:29:06] <brada> im not talking about sdl events
[22:29:11] <psch> oh right
[22:29:39] <psch> did i miss adding it somewhere? i have it after the decrement to numFingers in FINGERUP and after the increment in FINGERDOWN
[22:29:48] <brada> anytime you motion it is set to true which would block the console from showing till you reset it with a new 3 finger swipe
[22:30:15] <brada> discard your changes and pull from git
[22:30:53] <psch> ok
[22:32:33] <psch> building right now
[22:32:58] <brada> i think i may have an idea for the other problem
[22:33:07] <psch> with head + setenv("HOME", ...) in GemRB.cpp
[22:33:35] <psch> i think im doing git wrong haha
[22:34:15] <psch> i have two changed lines in GemRB.cpp in a branch and switching to master branch for pulls and then merging master into my branch
[22:34:39] <psch> but well, it does what it should do so im ok with it
[22:35:08] <brada> whatever works without driving you mad
[22:36:28] <psch> i can still get both console and keyboard with one swipe
[22:36:40] <psch> delta at 5 makes it easier too
[22:40:42] <brada> how is that possible tho?
[22:40:57] <brada> with the continuingGesture logic
[22:44:11] <psch> it might be the sensitivity of my touchscreen i think
[22:44:28] <psch> as in, one finger goes up and down again during the swipe
[22:45:02] <psch> im just guessing, im not purposefully retouching
[22:45:18] <brada> sounds plausible
[22:45:51] <psch> im general, even if im trying, i can only get both with maybe 20% success
[22:45:56] <psch> rather less than that
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[22:55:38] <brada> this hack for the other problem works but would break with PST
[22:55:52] <lynxlynxlynx> reminds you that software bugs, however stealthy and insidious, are still better than hardware ones
[22:57:43] <brada> i need some way of reseting the GameControl state
[22:57:54] <brada> time to add a new method i guess
[23:03:34] <brada> there is definately a bug in sdl
[23:03:51] <brada> hiding the keyboard manually makes SDL_IsScreenKeyboardShown return the wrong value
[23:04:00] <brada> on iod anyway
[23:04:36] <brada> but for the life of me i cant replicate getting both keyboard and console in the same swipe
[23:05:08] <brada> even with the delta at 1
[23:05:36] <brada> not worried about it
[23:05:41] <brada> its not a huge problem
[23:06:17] <psch> hiding the keyboard with the homebar gave me only the console on a three finger up swipe once
[23:06:30] <psch> which is consistent with you getting the wrong value i guess
[23:06:32] <brada> so it seems android also suffers from that bug
[23:06:37] <brada> yes
[23:07:17] <brada> i can fix that selection rect problem
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[23:22:55] <brada> psch: try that
[23:23:00] <brada> for the selection box thing
[23:23:24] <brada> if sourceforge quits hanging up on me!
[23:23:31] <brada> there
[23:34:28] <psch> this feels pretty good to me
[23:34:54] <psch> couldn't yet get console + keyboard at the same time, and the selection box on scroll seems to be completely gone
[23:35:25] <psch> i did get a seemingly random selection box on trying to get the keyboard a few times, but that doesn't seem UX-breaking to me
[23:35:57] <psch> seeing as i was trying to do really fast swipes over nearly the whole display, which isnt really a normal 3 finger swipe i guess
[23:38:56] <brada> oh i should maybe reset GC more frequently
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