#gemrb@irc.freenode.net logs for 6 Oct 2009 (GMT)

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[07:30:51] <lynxlynxlynx> gmornin
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[08:48:36] <lynxlynxlynx> fuzzie: did that ids commit fix the out of sight targetting?
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[08:50:04] <fuzzie> nope
[08:50:32] <fuzzie> it fixed only Narlen's dialog so far :)
[08:50:59] <lynxlynxlynx> ok
[08:51:24] <fuzzie> it fixes only the case in dialog where you have something like [0.0.NAMED]
[08:53:49] <fuzzie> so i guess it also fixes some bg1 dialogs which check for male/female presence and some evil/good checks, but i see nothing in bg2, for example
[08:54:02] <fuzzie> still took me hours, meh :) good morning
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[10:46:32] <fuzzie> lynxlynxlynx: do you hae some immediate examples of the out-of-sight issues?
[10:46:51] <lynxlynxlynx> as in saves?
[10:47:07] <fuzzie> or somewhere i can teleport and see at once
[10:47:22] <lynxlynxlynx> i guess most bg1 wilderness areas would work
[10:47:29] <fuzzie> there's probably three different problems, that's all
[10:47:48] <fuzzie> and it seems related to ai scripts. let me poke.
[10:48:12] <lynxlynxlynx> in iwd some other kind of out-of-sight comes to mind - disabled(?) or some hard way of invisibility actors can be attacked
[10:49:17] <lynxlynxlynx> if you go to kuldahar and to the east part of the town, you'll maybe be able to kill all of the neo orogs that are supposed to be active only in later chapters
[10:49:20] <fuzzie> yes, this is why i'm seeing three different problems :)
[10:50:06] <fuzzie> you have: attack action doesn't check visibility, targeting doesn't check visibility, visibility check doesn't check invis
[10:50:27] <lynxlynxlynx> heh
[10:51:20] <fuzzie> none of them are hard to fix in some way, but i worry about introducing worse problems
[10:51:54] <lynxlynxlynx> since the problems are already significant, i don't mind trial and error
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[10:53:25] <lynxlynxlynx> the orogs don't spawn on first entry
[10:53:56] <lynxlynxlynx> but i remember similar issues with an area before the forge
[10:54:07] <fuzzie> well, i already have problems where targeting randomly breaks game playthroughs, you just get stuck
[10:54:12] <lynxlynxlynx> no close save though
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[12:09:17] <fuzzie> ok, back later.
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[14:57:12] <Taimon> barra_wlan: are you studying at tu dresden?
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[14:59:20] <lynxlynxlynx> heh
[14:59:39] <Taimon> they are upgrading wlan in two days
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[14:59:47] <Taimon> huh...
[15:00:09] <fuzzie> it does seem a little more flaky than usual :)
[15:00:26] <Taimon> ;)
[15:00:35] <lynxlynxlynx> and the upgrade hasn't even started yet :)
[15:00:55] <lynxlynxlynx> bofh having a bad day
[15:01:33] <Taimon> what is barra's relationship too gemrb?
[15:01:48] <Taimon> developement?
[15:01:57] <lynxlynxlynx> no
[15:02:06] <Taimon> okay
[15:02:16] <lynxlynxlynx> he's a developer of another game and previously an engine
[15:02:22] <lynxlynxlynx> parpg / fife
[15:02:36] <Taimon> looks like we are at the same university :)
[15:02:41] <lynxlynxlynx> so i guess the relationship would be common interest in proper rpgs
[15:03:08] <lynxlynxlynx> they were also contemplating using gemrb as the engine for parpg
[15:03:12] <fuzzie> well, and we talk about common technical things occasionally :)
[15:03:30] <lynxlynxlynx> of course
[15:04:01] <fuzzie> but gemrb is so terribly IE-specific, and making IE areas is still an awful lot of work
[15:04:08] <Taimon> yeah
[15:04:19] <fuzzie> got to try writing something cleverer for wallgroup creation sometime
[15:04:33] <Taimon> what are you doing/using currently?
[15:05:44] <fuzzie> hm, my 'ask Taimon' list right now is just spawns, and i guess your notes on the forum cover what you know of that :)
[15:07:14] <fuzzie> and, well, I do nothing :) I just try and write things to cover other people's complaints
[15:07:27] <lynxlynxlynx> we're focusing on getting ie compatible first, new games come later ;)
[15:08:29] <lynxlynxlynx> next release sometime at the other end of this month will bring iwd and bg1 completionability :)
[15:08:40] <lynxlynxlynx> completability?
[15:08:57] <fuzzie> well, that stupid script right at the end of iwd makes the claim a bit dubious :p
[15:09:27] <lynxlynxlynx> i consider that one minor, it's not like it breaks the game
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[15:09:59] <lynxlynxlynx> the forge and the worldmap ones were much more problematic
[15:10:58] <Taimon> fuzzie: I meant, what you are currently using for creating wallgroups
[15:11:14] <Taimon> and what about spawns? anything unclear?
[15:11:18] <fuzzie> Taimon: just manual construction in DLTCEP, which is .. not ideal
[15:11:48] <fuzzie> well, you reference your notes when talking about the creature spawn flag, so i wonder if i miss anything else which you put in your notes and not the forum
[15:12:58] <fuzzie> but i haven't tried implementing it all yet. it's more of a problem than in bg1 than in bg2, so maybe you don't have all the information anyway, we'll see.
[15:13:30] <Taimon> I was only referencing the offsets of the spawned field in creature + area
[15:13:43] <Taimon> so you didn't really miss anything
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[15:15:24] <Taimon> considering wallgroup creating: I recall jcompton talking about a tool a while ago
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[15:16:59] <lynxlynxlynx> yeah, on shs
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[15:18:08] <fuzzie> jcompton has come in here and explained a bit more, too
[15:18:13] <fuzzie> just a matter of finding the time to actually try it
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[15:19:31] <Taimon> I guess I'll have some spare time at the end of the week
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[15:19:43] <Taimon> so is there something else on the "ask Taimon" list? :)
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[15:21:43] <fuzzie> well, a lot of my thoughts I try and push in the direction of the forum; things like, does bg2 run area scripts during a cutscene? because bg1 does, as i noted
[15:21:59] <fuzzie> but i think i have nothing important, lots of wonderings, but nothing i've spent any time looking at myself yet
[15:22:39] <Taimon> good, more time for exe hacking :)
[15:23:28] <fuzzie> i should say, any time you hack the exe it would be nice if you document what you did, but you do that anyway, i guess :)
[15:24:50] <Taimon> depends on what you call documentation
[15:25:47] <Taimon> on a higher level sure, I do some kind of documentation
[15:26:18] <Taimon> but I don't actually note what instructions I changed, etc.
[15:27:00] <fuzzie> yes, just "this flag now does this" or "this trigger is now run in this situation" is good for me :)
[15:27:06] <fuzzie> i can always see the instructions by looking :p
[15:27:34] <fuzzie> although i don't do reverse-engineering for IE
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[15:31:46] <Taimon> why not? :)
[15:33:58] <fuzzie> no time - and whenever I want to know anything, asking you or others usually works :)
[15:35:20] <Taimon> delegation ftw
[15:40:07] <Taimon> gotta go, see you
[15:40:16] <fuzzie> bye!
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[16:29:26] <fuzzie> ok, do i have to name the rows of a 2da?
[16:29:28] <fuzzie> i just want a list..
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[18:51:17] <raevol> if anyone could, i'd love to look over some instructions on now to play gemrb at higher resolutions
[18:51:24] <raevol> can't seem to find them in my googling :/
[18:52:13] <fuzzie> you need to apply the 'widescreen mod'
[18:52:20] <raevol> where would i find that?
[18:52:24] <fuzzie> and you need the latest version of that, from the git repository
[18:53:16] <fuzzie> http://forums.gibberlings3.net/index.php?showtopic=16831
[18:53:24] <fuzzie> you want the 'cd widescreen' and 'git clone' lines
[18:53:29] <raevol> ok
[18:53:46] <fuzzie> then you need weidu
[18:53:58] <fuzzie> asking lynxlynxlynx how to do that might be easier
[18:54:09] <raevol> oh my, ok
[18:54:12] <raevol> complicated process
[18:54:21] <fuzzie> well, 'weidu' is the standard mod installer, basically
[18:54:28] <raevol> i see
[18:54:34] <raevol> and it works on linux?
[18:54:43] <fuzzie> an .exe copy comes with pretty much every mod, i think there's a linux one on weidu.org
[18:55:25] <fuzzie> http://www.weidu.org/~thebigg/WeiDU-Linux-211.zip i guess?
[18:55:37] <fuzzie> but then i don't quite know how to make the standard weidu install a random mod
[18:57:17] <fuzzie> 'weidu --game /path/to/bg1 widescreen.tp2' maybe?
[18:57:20] <fuzzie> that does seem to work fine
[19:00:28] <fuzzie> you should be able to install most bg1 mods that way, but we didn't test any of them!
[19:01:15] <raevol> git confuses me
[19:01:18] <raevol> i'll pass on it for now
[19:01:29] <fuzzie> well, just that 'git clone' line from the post i linked to should work
[19:01:43] <raevol> oh wait here we go
[19:01:53] <raevol> yea it pulled to the directory above where i ran it
[19:02:01] <fuzzie> ah
[19:02:09] <fuzzie> obviously usually you'd just download the .zip
[19:02:23] <fuzzie> but gemrb support is new, so there's no .zip with it yet
[19:02:32] <raevol> i see
[19:03:30] <fuzzie> maybe it would be a good thing to write instructions
[19:03:47] <raevol> hmm it's not finding CHITIN.KEY because it's chitin.key
[19:04:02] <fuzzie> it wants everything to be in lowercase
[19:04:06] <fuzzie> the errors are a lie
[19:04:26] <raevol> says that as a fatal error though
[19:04:29] <raevol> so it didn't install?
[19:04:39] <fuzzie> run 'rename tr/[A-Z]/[a-z]/ * */*' in your bg1 directory, if you want to change all files to be lowercase
[19:04:49] <raevol> well the file is lower case
[19:04:56] <raevol> wiedu is looking for an uppercase one
[19:05:05] <fuzzie> the error doesn't tell the truth
[19:05:08] <fuzzie> it looks for the lowercase one
[19:05:16] <raevol> but it is lowercase :(
[19:05:20] <fuzzie> so if you have an error, then it doesn't look in the right place
[19:05:22] <raevol> so it should have found it..
[19:05:34] <fuzzie> you're passing the right thing to weidu, '--game /path/to/bg1'?
[19:05:46] <raevol> yea
[19:06:03] <fuzzie> oh, hm, maybe it doesn't work unless you run it from the game directory
[19:06:25] <fuzzie> no, it works from anywhere for me..
[19:13:53] <fuzzie> every time i try explaining weidu's madness to someone, on Windows or Linux or OS X, it always reminds me how unfriendly it all is :(
[19:14:03] <fuzzie> and yet there are incredible amounts of people using these mods
[19:14:40] <fuzzie> ok, it's a little easier on Windows where they have the .exe in the zip with the mod, but not that much better..
[19:24:56] <fuzzie> lynxlynxlynx: your widescreen mod patch seems to assume that the world CHU file is always guiw10.chu (see bottom of core.tpa)...
[19:25:34] <fuzzie> doesn't work when there's no such file and the mod patches guiworld.chu
[19:26:16] <fuzzie> so i am guessing this is untested for bg1, heh
[19:27:41] <fuzzie> i don't have ToTSC installed so i can't try it myself right now..
[19:29:42] <fuzzie> erm, guiw.chu?
[19:34:08] <fuzzie> apparently it works with guiw.chu. i guess it should use this %chu% magic, maybe.
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[20:11:37] <fuzzie> hi, Edheldil
[20:24:39] <Edheldil> Hi, fuzzie
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[20:39:01] <lynxlynxlynx> fuzzie: it doesn't use the stuff from libsmall/ for bg1 and pst?
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[20:40:27] <fuzzie> lynxlynxlynx: it does
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[20:40:48] <fuzzie> but libsmall/ obeys whatever %chu% is set to (by game_config.tpa)
[20:40:54] <fuzzie> and that is guiw for bg1
[20:41:18] <lynxlynxlynx> so is there a problem or not?
[20:41:20] <fuzzie> and guiworld for pst
[20:41:31] <fuzzie> yes, your core.tpa change hard-codes 'guiw10'.
[20:42:19] <fuzzie> so the gemrb path fails for both games.
[20:47:53] <lynxlynxlynx> ah, the copying
[20:48:13] <fuzzie> (and when it fails, weidu gives up and reverts everything)
[20:55:36] <lynxlynxlynx> http://pastebin.com/d4330c0f8 <-- try this
[20:56:00] <lynxlynxlynx> i'll play with it tommorow, not much time left today
[20:56:11] <fuzzie> i'll try it later once i get totsc installed myself, thanks
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[21:22:54] <raevol> completed the game, though i had to ctrl+y sarevok
[21:23:01] <raevol> the end cinematic plays and the credits
[21:23:12] <raevol> but then it goes back to the game and seems to just hand there in cinematic mode
[21:23:20] <raevol> not sure exactly what's supposed to happen
[21:23:29] <fuzzie> i noticed that both the bg1 and iwd scripts just call EndCredits() and stop there
[21:24:14] <fuzzie> i expect we're probably meant to quit and go back to the main menu afterwards
[21:29:31] <raevol> coo
[21:29:38] <raevol> but it is completable :D conceptually
[21:29:40] <raevol> again i cheated :x
[21:30:01] <raevol> gotta love the music in the bg1 credits
[21:30:14] <fuzzie> it's not an easy game, especially with only two party members
[21:30:24] <raevol> hahaha yea
[21:30:29] <fuzzie> i think i usually got sarevok with the silly summoned creatures stuff
[21:30:30] <raevol> even if they are level 10+
[21:30:50] <raevol> yea wands of animal summoning are supposed to be golden in that last fight
[21:31:53] <fuzzie> i'm glad all the showstopper bugs got fixed, anyway
[21:31:58] <raevol> yea :D
[21:32:09] <fuzzie> i'll have to try bg1 myself once i fix some other things
[21:32:11] <raevol> i think that map one will mess some people up, but it's definitely workaroundable
[21:32:27] <fuzzie> that off-by-one portrait bug has got to be a simple fix
[21:32:48] <raevol> cool
[21:32:54] <fuzzie> why isn't that on the bg1_playthrough_Bugs page?
[21:33:26] <raevol> mm, i think i mentioned it here and someone said it was on their todo, or part of a larger issue on their todo
[21:33:26] <raevol> i can put it there if you like
[21:34:00] <CIA-22> gemrb: 03avenger_teambg * r7376 10/chitem/trunk/ (9 files): dltcep 7.2
[21:34:31] <fuzzie> it's probably on my list, but important to have written down somewhere
[21:34:39] <raevol> i'll put it up
[21:34:45] <fuzzie> the map thing i'll have to look at
[21:34:47] <raevol> i know the sight bug got taken off the bg1 page
[21:35:59] <fuzzie> yes, that happens everywhere
[21:36:09] <fuzzie> i wanted to fix it today, but i couldn't
[21:36:39] <raevol> ah, yea
[21:37:10] <fuzzie> huh, Avenger updated DLTCEP but didn't fix ARE reading?
[21:38:34] <fuzzie> i guess he updated items, and a lot of GUI fixes
[21:39:01] <raevol> cool
[21:45:14] <raevol> oh i guess the area spawns need to be fixed before a clean playthrough could be done too
[21:45:24] <raevol> forgot about how i was getting pwned by dire wolves heh
[22:01:48] <fuzzie> any idea of an example area name with all the spawns?
[22:04:07] <raevol> all the spawns? i can get you an area but i don't know how to look up thespawns
[22:04:44] <fuzzie> i mean, an area would be fine
[22:07:13] <raevol> hmm ctrl+m didn't give me antyhing that time
[22:08:10] <fuzzie> it only works if you're not over an actor, door, container or some visible region (eg, a travel point)
[22:09:02] <raevol> argh
[22:10:21] <fuzzie> if you look in the console output you can also find the area where it says 'Searching for ar0153.wed', 'Searching for ar0153.tis', 'Searching for ar0153.mos', 'Searching for ar0153.bcs', and so forth
[22:14:46] <raevol> here we go, ar2700
[22:14:52] <raevol> it's the area where gorion is killed
[22:15:15] <raevol> i remember being killed by dire wolves there
[22:18:37] <fuzzie> hm, spawn point 5 has both a WOLF and a WOLFDI, and spawn point 2 has a GIBBER2, a WOLF and a WOLFDR
[22:19:27] <fuzzie> it seems unlikely that those are all meant to be spawned at once
[22:19:50] <raevol> yea
[22:20:24] <fuzzie> that WOLFDR is a Dread Wolf, which is surely never going to spawn that early
[22:20:27] <fuzzie> so i guess the order matters
[22:21:19] <raevol> gotta jump in the shower, be back in a bit
[22:24:54] <fuzzie> i wonder more about the random areas though
[22:25:11] <fuzzie> AR6100, for example, has a huge number of random creatures in it, but they're all carefully scheduled seperately
[22:26:01] <fuzzie> i guess it's all about the scheduling
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[22:46:54] <raevol> hmm, makes sense
[22:46:57] <raevol> i'm back
[22:47:29] <raevol> oh i should reboot though... brb
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[22:49:24] <raevol> wee
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