#nu5@irc.freenode.net logs for 31 May 2004 (GMT)

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[07:07:11] --> Tanabi has joined #nu5
[07:07:21] <Tanabi> Hello :)
[07:21:16] <Sheng_Gradilla> hi
[07:21:29] <Tanabi> How
[07:21:32] <Tanabi> s it going?
[07:21:40] <Sheng_Gradilla> slow :P
[07:21:57] <Tanabi> Hee hee, yeah its 3:22 AM for me, couldn't be much slower
[07:23:04] <Sheng_Gradilla> how's the project going?
[07:23:16] <Sheng_Gradilla> got all graphical stuff done?
[07:24:47] <Tanabi> My text drawing stuff isn't ready, but my tile engine is done. Handles everything pretty much, and supports 3 border types (U5 only uses 2 that I am aware of, but the third is if I ever use the engine for something else :P :D)
[07:26:01] <Tanabi> Er map borders I mean. U5 has wrap around and single-tile forever repeating ;P
[07:26:44] <Tanabi> My engine can also just make it a black border all around, or define different tiles in different directions (north tile, south tile, etc) if that makes any sense :P
[07:27:52] <Sheng_Gradilla> and what is the engine structure?
[07:28:40] <Tanabi> You mean the back end lib? It's using SDL.
[07:29:06] <Sheng_Gradilla> no, I mean the way it actually works
[07:32:21] <Tanabi> :oh, well, probably overcomplicated. The function side is pretty simple though, there's some primitives to place individual tiles, and then there's a function to draw the screen (with darkness applied) with a given mapid,x,y,z coord set which will be used to actually draw the play field. Under the hood ...
[07:34:16] <Tanabi> ... I convert the U5 files to my own format with some conversion software I wrote, and the maps are basically grids of object ID's that mesh up with a cache table of objects. Everything's done so from the graphics perspective, there's nothing special about any particular object as they all have the smae grpahics properties (tileset, animation counter, transparency) :D
[07:34:50] <Sheng_Gradilla> well, the structure of nu5 will be client-server
[07:35:11] <Sheng_Gradilla> there will be a library to handle the protocol
[07:35:12] <Tanabi> I have a test program which you can actually use to wlak around maps, though you kinda have a 'no clip' mode going on ;)
[07:35:35] <Sheng_Gradilla> the client will request the server for the necesary info to display the screen
[07:35:50] <Sheng_Gradilla> the graphics would be client-dependant
[07:36:18] <Sheng_Gradilla> heh, I have such a program myself
[07:36:44] <Sheng_Gradilla> nothing much interesting
[07:37:03] <Sheng_Gradilla> what I yet have to look at is the dungeons
[07:42:48] --> Tanabi_ has joined #nu5
[07:43:02] <Sheng_Gradilla> died?
[07:43:04] <Tanabi_> Ugh, naturally, my laptop starts crapping out the night before the trip :P
[07:43:12] <Tanabi_> Yeah, just locks solid, reasons unknown
[07:43:31] <Sheng_Gradilla> heh
[07:43:47] <Sheng_Gradilla> you can check the logs
[07:43:52] <Sheng_Gradilla> exultbot is logging
[07:44:22] <Sheng_Gradilla> http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/nu5log.php
[07:46:01] <Tanabi_> Yeah, the dungeons look like they may be a pain to impliment graphically at least, being pretty differnet from the tile engine ;P
[07:46:56] <-- Tanabi has left IRC ("BitchX-1.0c19 -- just do it.")
[07:46:59] <Sheng_Gradilla> column based
[07:47:52] <Tanabi_> Ah, okay. :) I 've of course extracted all the graphics for the dungeon already. Haven't looked into the file formats yet :/
[07:48:08] <Sheng_Gradilla> I am more likely to take on scroll reading and conversation handling at the moment :P
[07:48:30] <Tanabi_> Yeah, dungeons are last on my list :)
[07:49:59] <Tanabi_> Looks like defining the object properties for all the things in the game is probably going to be manual labor + guess work, I haven't seen anything that looks useful
[07:52:51] <Sheng_Gradilla> useful?
[07:53:16] <Sheng_Gradilla> heh, don't want to interpret the OVL file? :D
[07:53:20] <Sheng_Gradilla> data.ovl
[07:54:46] <Tanabi_> That has a lot of stuff in it, but not everything :)
[07:55:09] <Sheng_Gradilla> and there is lots of useless junk
[07:55:16] <Sheng_Gradilla> know why?
[07:55:46] <Sheng_Gradilla> it is faster to read in powers of 2
[07:55:55] <Tanabi_> Ohhh :D
[07:56:20] <Sheng_Gradilla> so they left some garbage in there to fill the space so the actual data was neatly sorted
[07:57:25] <Tanabi_> Ahh :) Interesting. They'd shoot me dead if they saw my file formats. Actually a lot of people would probably give me a swift kick in my ass; thus far, y file formats for everything hve been plain text. :P
[07:57:53] <Tanabi_> If you open the iolo's hut map file in a spreadsheet, it actually looks like na ASCII version of Iolo's hut ;)
[07:58:04] <Sheng_Gradilla> :P
[07:59:49] <Tanabi_> My data files look kinda like MUD data files :P Or data files from the game Crossfire ;P
[08:00:40] <Tanabi_> Have you statred coding, or are you still in planning stages?
[08:02:33] <Sheng_Gradilla> I wish to define the structure a little better, and have been busy with school
[08:03:03] <Sheng_Gradilla> no code that could be considered part of the project
[08:03:59] <Sheng_Gradilla> did some test code for decoding the graphics files and displaying them on screen, and other things to understand the file formats
[08:05:15] <Tanabi_> Ah okay :) You're probably about where I am, 'cept you're more ambitious with your program structure ;D Being client/server will open your game up to a lot more possibilities but definitely require more planning and gneerally make it a more challenging thing :)
[08:05:41] <Sheng_Gradilla> yea
[08:06:13] <Sheng_Gradilla> I want to be able to respond to those asking for multiplayer gameplay
[08:06:45] <Sheng_Gradilla> to tell them: "If you want it, the code is there. Add the gameplay yourself"
[08:07:21] <Tanabi_> Multiplayer U5 is hard to picture, but hey, if you can do it right, go for it :) Multiplayer U4 though, I thought about that a bit, that would be cool. Especially if there was a roll for anti-avatars that want to prevent the Avatar-wannabies from succeeding :)
[08:09:46] <Sheng_Gradilla> :P
[08:10:05] <Sheng_Gradilla> I don't envision any multiplayer Ultima other than UO
[08:10:33] <Sheng_Gradilla> I just want the code to be multiplayer-ready, and see what others come up with
[08:12:04] <Tanabi_> *grins* Yeah, that's cool. I doubt I'll put multiplayer support into mine :P It would probably just be sloppy and hackish if I tried ;) I'm not that great at game programming stuff, no experience :P
[08:13:13] <Sheng_Gradilla> well, one thing you should consider is: there will always be people asking for this or that feature
[08:13:48] <Sheng_Gradilla> and you have to decide if you want to please them or not
[08:14:03] <Tanabi_> True... Though if I get to that point, I'll be surprised ;) That means people are actually playing it, gah! :)
[08:14:04] <Sheng_Gradilla> and must never forget that such projects are not for you alone
[08:15:32] <Tanabi_> True... If I get it to a releasable point and I'm not just absolutely embarassed by my code I'll realease it open source.
[08:16:11] <Sheng_Gradilla> don't you mean "dumped source"? :D
[08:16:17] <Sheng_Gradilla> lots of people do that
[08:16:26] <Tanabi_> Right now if you look at it, it's pretty obvious that there's a learning progression going on ;)
[08:16:51] <Sheng_Gradilla> code something without showing, and if they don't feel too embarassed, dump it on the web under some open license
[08:17:14] <Sheng_Gradilla> that's what I call dumped source
[08:17:23] <Sheng_Gradilla> open source is open since the beginning
[08:17:49] <Tanabi_> Heehee :) I see! :D
[08:18:01] <Sheng_Gradilla> and stays as such during every facet of he development process
[08:18:16] <Sheng_Gradilla> the idea is to have collaborative work
[08:18:46] <Sheng_Gradilla> that's where CVS, Subversion, BitKeeper and other utils come into play
[08:19:36] <Tanabi_> Yeah ... I've never really been a part of a big collaborative thing before. Or even a small one, heh, I run a small company with a friend and I'm the only developer so I'm used to solo mode :P :D
[08:19:48] <Sheng_Gradilla> those are used so other developers can contribute to fresh sources
[08:20:43] <Tanabi_> Yeah, I know what they're used for, just never used them :)
[08:24:44] <Tanabi_> I don't think anyone much cares about my stuff at this stage, so I haven't bothered setting up a sourceforge thingie or anything for it yet.
[08:25:07] <Sheng_Gradilla> heh
[08:25:25] <Sheng_Gradilla> put something out, and say it
[08:25:46] <Sheng_Gradilla> and you will be impressed at how many posts you will get
[08:25:58] <Sheng_Gradilla> there will be lots of lurkers
[08:26:13] <Tanabi_> There usually are :D
[08:26:22] <Sheng_Gradilla> and if you don't say anything in a while, they will rush to ask if the project is dead or what
[08:26:27] <Sheng_Gradilla> they will ask for news
[08:26:42] <Sheng_Gradilla> you are under watch, even if you have not noticed
[08:27:08] <Tanabi_> Yeah, i noticed that on your forums, the periodic news quries ;)
[08:27:33] <Tanabi_> At least if I posted source that would be pretty much a dialy update thing. er daily, feh, cellphone internet :P
[08:27:50] <Tanabi_> I try to do at least a little something every day so it's always growing.
[08:30:06] <Sheng_Gradilla> there is some guy doing an Ultima Classics Revisited project
[08:30:10] <Sheng_Gradilla> is that you?
[08:30:36] <Tanabi_> Nope, I'm only doing my one thing :) Which I call Ultima V: Evolution
[08:31:00] <Sheng_Gradilla> ah
[08:32:41] <Tanabi_> Do they have a site? I don't recall seeing that on sourceforge when I was looking for ultima stuff, but then again sourceforge's search appears to be kind of retarded unless you pay :P
[08:33:20] <Sheng_Gradilla> yes, they have one
[08:33:27] <Sheng_Gradilla> but I lost the link
[08:33:42] <Tanabi_> So sad!
[08:40:41] <Sheng_Gradilla> I think the link is on the xu4 forums
[08:40:47] <Sheng_Gradilla> my ISP sucks
[08:40:52] <Sheng_Gradilla> I can't get there right now
[08:43:37] --> Tanabi has joined #nu5
[08:43:41] <Tanabi> Crash AGAIN
[08:44:03] <Sheng_Gradilla> the link is on the xu4 forums
[08:44:14] <Sheng_Gradilla> in some post about a "fork"
[08:44:21] <Tanabi> Gah I really need to figure out what's going on here :/ In an hour I have to leave for like 7 days and if my laptop is crapping out constantly it will be miserable :P
[08:44:27] <Tanabi> Okay
[08:48:34] <-- Tanabi_ has left IRC ("BitchX-1.0c19 -- just do it.")
[08:49:57] <Tanabi> That looks interesting :D Anyway, I better head off. Was good talking to you :)
[08:51:48] <Sheng_Gradilla> :)
[08:52:06] <Tanabi> Bye :D
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