#pentagram@irc.freenode.net logs for 5 Jul 2003 (GMT)

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[10:50:47] <Cashman> hi ya
[10:52:48] <SB-X> hello
[11:00:21] <Cashman> hi
[11:01:41] <SB-X> hey there
[11:05:25] * Cashman goes to update..
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[11:17:48] <Cashman> oooh Willem just cleaned up the snapshots dir
[11:23:41] <wjp> I hope you didn't need any of the older snapshots? :-)
[11:24:35] <Cashman> no I'm quit alright wjp
[11:25:00] <Cashman> hmm typo hmm quite
[11:25:24] <Cashman> quiet
[11:25:28] <Cashman> hehe
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[11:27:16] <Colourless> hi
[11:27:48] <wjp> hi
[11:27:54] <wjp> did you see Jeff's mail?
[11:28:02] <wjp> that's probably relevant to pentagram too
[11:28:23] <Colourless> haven't loaded my email client
[11:28:37] <wjp> some arrays in fmopl were conflicting with arrays in SDL_mixer
[11:28:51] <wjp> that's what caused that crash while playing the intro song
[11:29:48] <Colourless> heh
[11:29:55] <Colourless> funny
[11:29:57] * Cashman hmmm so I shouldn't get updates yet.
[11:30:15] <Cashman> k I'll get updates some othertime
[11:30:18] <Colourless> it's a linker thing i thin
[11:30:19] <Colourless> k
[11:30:21] <wjp> that was a crash in exult
[11:31:29] <Colourless> SDL Mixer is a so correct?
[11:31:43] <wjp> usually, yes
[11:33:07] <Colourless> i'll update the bend_find and bend_coarse in our FMOpl stuff to be members in the FMOplMidiDriver class
[11:33:21] <Colourless> s/members/static members/
[11:33:21] <wjp> or an FMOpl namespace maybe?
[11:34:10] <Colourless> might consider adding that as well for fmopl.cpp/h
[11:35:02] <Colourless> it's a most... interesting problem, which has wider range of effects than you would normally think about
[11:35:33] <Colourless> example: Using Timidity in Pentagram would conflict with Timidity in SDL_Mixer too...
[11:35:57] <Colourless> i guess that means that i'll be required to name space all of the Timidity lib stuff now :-)
[11:36:12] <Colourless> and convert the C sources to C++ sources
[11:36:13] * Dark-Star wonders why the linker doesn't choke on these duplicate symbols
[11:36:24] <Colourless> cause libraries are 'funny'
[11:36:48] <wjp> duplicate symbols are supposed to be allowed
[11:37:06] <wjp> which one overrides which one is a bit of black magic :-)
[11:37:16] <wjp> (i.e., I never bothered to look up the rules :-) )
[11:37:27] <Colourless> normally, if a symbol is defined in the app, it take precidence
[11:37:36] <Dark-Star> but there should be at least a warning or something IMHO
[11:44:43] <DarkeZzz> There probably is. Most people only compile with the basic -Wall, 'n such so they don't get it.
[11:45:08] <wjp> or you can enable lots of output with LD_DEBUG :-)
[11:46:10] <wjp> 01765: binding file /usr/lib/libSDL_mixer-1.2.so.0 to /data/exult/clean/exult/exult: normal symbol `bend_coarse'
[11:46:13] <wjp> things like that :-)
[11:46:36] <wjp> pity LD_DEBUG=all produces 32174 lines of output :-)
[11:49:30] <DarkeZzz> That's waaaaaaaay Too Much Information. *grin*
[12:11:54] <wjp> just a bit :-)
[12:21:01] --- Cashman is now known as CashZz
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[12:33:14] <wjp> right... equipment :-)
[12:33:23] <wjp> I've been delaying that long enough
[12:34:24] <wjp> will need some hackish changes to initial item loading
[12:42:58] <wjp> I wish they had added a 'backpack' equiptype
[12:43:47] <DarkeZzz> Anything to stop us from adding one?
[12:44:18] <wjp> not really...
[12:47:35] <DarkeZzz> So the only question is... would the benefit of adding it, be greater then the complications of adding it? *grin*
[12:47:42] <wjp> no :-)
[12:48:01] <wjp> mostly because it would need modifications in multiple places
[12:48:11] <wjp> this just needs a small hack in Actor
[12:48:25] * DarkeZzz snickers.
[12:54:23] <Colourless> :-)
[12:54:28] <Colourless> from the fmopl stuff
[12:54:29] <Colourless> /* These tables 'borrowed' from Timidity tables.c
[12:54:49] <wjp> they borrowed the name too? :-)
[12:56:53] <wjp> hmm
[12:57:08] <wjp> there's equipment in the avatar's starting npcdat entry
[12:57:36] <Colourless> what equipment?
[12:57:47] <wjp> objid 0x0101
[12:57:52] * wjp crossreferences with itemcach
[12:59:02] <wjp> shape 0x211
[12:59:10] <wjp> backpack
[12:59:28] <Colourless> :-)
[13:00:19] <wjp> it's in location 0x54 in npcdata
[13:00:45] <wjp> which is 0x23 in the avatar's entry
[13:04:39] <wjp> hm, item 0x100 in itemcach is magic armour
[13:05:03] * wjp wonders which npc got lucky :-)
[13:05:10] <Colourless> devon?
[13:09:06] <wjp> hm, none, actually
[13:10:13] <wjp> makes me wonder what that item is doing in itemcach
[13:11:39] <Colourless> what are it's coords?
[13:11:59] <wjp> x = 1, y = 0x283F, z = 0
[13:12:09] <Colourless> in a container.
[13:12:14] <Colourless> what's it's item next value?
[13:12:14] <wjp> yes, one level deep
[13:13:03] <wjp> 0
[13:13:14] <wjp> hm
[13:13:23] <wjp> but that backpack's next is 0x100
[13:13:45] <wjp> oh, sorry, z = 3
[13:14:12] <Colourless> which would tend to suggest that it's owned by the avatar, IF the item list works as i think it works.
[13:14:30] <wjp> yes, my guess too
[13:14:32] <Colourless> what's the avatar's next?
[13:14:45] <wjp> 2
[13:15:19] <Colourless> i know what i can do.
[13:15:20] <wjp> 2's next is 0x8BE, strangely
[13:15:59] <Colourless> copy itemcach from the itemcach from the initial game to a game already started in the original to see if it's doing anything 'funky'
[13:16:16] <wjp> that could have very interesting effects :-)
[13:17:01] <wjp> could you also take a look at the itemcach from a brand new game?
[13:17:04] <Colourless> perhaps, but i can just to a quicksave 'really' quickly after the game starts
[13:17:38] <Colourless> itemcach from a brand new game 'should' be the one straight from the initial save game
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[13:17:57] * CashZz slaps CashZz around a bit with a large trout
[13:18:08] <Colourless> the game automatically starts a 'new game' if there is no avatar.dat which doesn't exist untill you explicitly save
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[13:18:42] <wjp> well, it "should", but I'm wondering :-)
[13:18:52] <wjp> you clearly don't start with magic armour on :-)
[13:21:21] <Colourless> funny
[13:21:29] <Colourless> i started a new game
[13:21:37] <Colourless> then i quit
[13:21:42] <Colourless> copied the gamedat
[13:23:05] <Colourless> went back in. did a quick save. quit. copied over the itemcach and npcdata.dat from the new game to the saved
[13:23:14] <Colourless> then went back in, and i was wearing magic armour :-)
[13:24:16] <wjp> :-)
[13:25:06] <wjp> there really is no 0x100 in the avatar's npcdata... weird
[13:25:31] <wjp> maybe things are stored in a list
[13:26:04] <Colourless> i can tell you this. if i didn't copy over npcdata.dat, the magic armour wouldn't appear till i attempted to 'drag' at the avatars gump
[13:26:19] <Colourless> and i couldn't double click the backpack
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[13:38:14] <Colourless> 100 or 101 is the armour?
[13:38:24] <wjp> 0x100 is the armour
[13:38:28] <wjp> 0x101 the backpack
[13:38:39] <Colourless> well, according to my data
[13:38:48] <Colourless> avatar is equiped with armour and no backpack
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[13:40:01] <Colourless> equip bytes are 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0100, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000 and 0x0000
[13:40:36] <Colourless> after saving they become 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0000, 0x0100 and 0x0000
[13:42:08] <wjp> 0x0100?
[13:42:12] <wjp> hmm
[13:42:17] <Colourless> the 4th Equip type is for body
[13:42:18] <wjp> in which file is that exactly?
[13:42:22] <Colourless> yes
[13:42:42] <Colourless> index 0 if npcdata.dat
[13:42:50] <Colourless> (it's a flex remember)
[13:42:56] <wjp> yeah
[13:43:15] <wjp> npcdata.dat of u8save.000 or of the gamedat one?
[13:44:15] <Colourless> from the gamedat
[13:45:18] <Colourless> u8save.000 is the same
[13:48:17] <wjp> hmm... so that changed with the patch?
[13:48:35] <Colourless> dunno might be
[13:49:09] <Colourless> are you sure your armour isn't in your backpack?
[13:49:35] <wjp> yes, it changed
[13:49:41] <wjp> positive
[13:50:00] <wjp> the postpatch indeed has 0x100 there
[13:50:03] <wjp> prepatch is 0x101
[13:50:46] <Colourless> i wonder if that is the reason the items nums are different pre and post patch then :-)
[13:51:22] <wjp> (if armour was in the backpack it would have x=2, too, btw)
[13:59:51] <wjp> anyway, it kind of sounds like we can just forget all about starting equipment
[14:00:03] <wjp> and give the avatar a backpack
[14:00:15] <wjp> seems to be what the original is doing anyway :-)
[14:44:45] <wjp> bbl
[14:44:54] <Colourless> m
[14:46:27] <DarkeZzz> Bye.
[14:57:00] * DarkeZzz is deleriously cheerful, reinstalling his 'doze box. Yes, his install of winxp lasted an *entire* week, before dying sufficiently painfully that he couldn't even boot into safe mode. It died... as he tried to install a game. No, he doesn't know why or how that should have killed it.
[14:58:58] <-- Kirben has left IRC (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
[14:59:36] <DarkeZzz> Hmm... looks like it's contageous. There goes Kirben. *grin*
[15:01:57] <Colourless> :-)
[15:06:16] <DarkeZzz> Oh... ICK! They've got hold music playing when you're finishing the last bit of the XP install! How horrid!
[15:06:50] <Colourless> ??
[15:07:08] * DarkeZzz is *so* glad he never knew that before, and hopes to forget it as soon as lapinly possible!
[15:07:39] <DarkeZzz> When that little 'help' bubble pops up and it asks you to put in your network settings and such.
[15:08:01] <DarkeZzz> Just after the animated fullscreen windows splash screen.
[15:09:04] <Colourless> that's news to me
[15:09:14] <Colourless> you installing home or professional?
[15:09:57] <DarkeZzz> Pro.
[15:10:08] <Colourless> odd. can't say i've ever noticed it
[15:10:19] <DarkeZzz> It was a 'repair' install, so it knew my sound drivers.
[15:10:48] <Colourless> hmm, maybe
[15:10:51] <DarkeZzz> And unfortunately, I had speakers plugged in. *shudder*
[15:11:31] <Colourless> yeah well, most of the time i wear headphones, and when installing an os, i am mostly not at my computer ;-)
[15:12:11] <DarkeZzz> (Which I can't remember ever being the case with my previous installs, since I've usually had it unplugged completely and on a workbench elsewhere, returning it when I've put it back together again. *grin*)
[15:14:58] <DarkeZzz> Unfortunately, the music reminds me of SS1's elevator theme...
[15:15:20] <DarkeZzz> Which is, strangely enough, quite appropriate since you exit from that particular area, back into the hell that is windows...
[15:21:54] * DarkeZzz is surprised that no-one's done a mod for SS2, to replace Xerxes' logos and such with Windows ones... though the thought of Shodan being replaced by a chubby penguin, or sickeningly cute daemon is... frightening.
[15:36:14] <DarkeZzz> Don't thank me for that nightmarish image, it's all part of my job. *humblefluff*
[15:44:55] <Colourless> woot!
[15:45:07] <Colourless> Pentagram + Timidity (compiled INTO Pentagram) = Go
[15:56:35] <-- SB-X has left IRC ("@_@")
[15:56:51] * DarkeZzz blinkieblinkblinks.
[15:57:30] * DarkeZzz sloooooowly backs away from the far, far, FAR too excited dragon.
[15:58:00] <Colourless> *evil grin*
[15:59:06] * DarkeZzz backs away *just* a little quicker!
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[16:32:55] <wjp> Colourless: awesome!
[16:33:06] <Colourless> :-)
[16:33:26] <wjp> fmopl isn't exactly optimal for software midi :-)
[16:33:37] <Colourless> you don't say :-)
[16:33:37] <wjp> timidity tends to sound a lot better
[16:33:58] <Colourless> hey, even with these really crappy 4 mb patches, timidity sounds better than FMOpl :-)
[16:34:26] <wjp> :-)
[16:36:01] <wjp> how's the cpu usage?
[16:37:51] <Colourless> not much it looks
[16:38:00] <Colourless> i can't really tell :-)
[16:43:07] <wjp> ok, it looks like none of the NPCs have any equipment at the start
[16:43:15] <wjp> saves me the trouble of having to load it :-)
[16:46:41] <Colourless> i... have made some changes so you can actually choose what midi driver you want to load
[16:46:47] <wjp> sounds good
[16:50:27] <Colourless> you can even disable music from the config file :-)
[16:50:59] <wjp> sounds even better ;-)
[16:52:07] <wjp> bbl, dinner
[17:11:13] <wjp> b
[17:13:43] <Colourless> wb
[17:24:00] <Colourless> is it fine to put all the files for timidity in audio/midi/timidity
[17:24:37] <wjp> yes, that was my idea too
[17:25:02] <wjp> did you put everything in a separate namespace?
[17:25:12] <Colourless> yes
[17:26:16] <Colourless> it took me more time converting all the damn files to C++ than it did to actually get it to wokr :-)
[17:26:24] <wjp> :-)
[17:27:37] <Colourless> i've also prefixed timidity_ to the start of all the files (except for timidity.cpp/h) cause some of the names are pretty generic
[17:27:46] * wjp nods
[17:32:37] <wjp> I'll need to take a good long look at the timidity.cfg locating code
[17:33:17] <wjp> SDL_mixer just wouldn't use the timidity.cfg I had in my home dir
[17:33:21] <Colourless> now... i know i looked at it myself... just where was it...
[17:33:39] <Colourless> #define CONFIG_FILE "timidity.cfg"
[17:33:41] <Colourless> #ifdef __WIN32__
[17:33:41] <Colourless> #define DEFAULT_PATH "\\TIMIDITY"
[17:33:41] <Colourless> #else
[17:33:41] <Colourless> #define DEFAULT_PATH "/usr/local/lib/timidity"
[17:33:41] <Colourless> #endif
[17:33:51] <wjp> yes
[17:33:56] <wjp> that's kind of bad :-)
[17:34:18] <Colourless> static PathList defaultpathlist={DEFAULT_PATH,0};
[17:34:36] <Colourless> actually
[17:34:38] <Colourless> static PathList defaultpathlist={DEFAULT_PATH,0};
[17:34:38] <Colourless> static PathList *pathlist=&defaultpathlist; /* This is a linked list */
[17:35:24] <Colourless> there is a add_to_pathlist() func that will do as it says :-)
[17:35:33] <wjp> I seem to remember RH finally synchronized the timidity.cfg location between timidity/SDL_mixer packages in RH9
[17:35:53] <wjp> does it actually use the path list?
[17:35:57] <Colourless> yes
[17:36:34] <wjp> ah, ok, in open_file
[17:36:41] <Colourless> yes
[18:18:11] <Colourless> you know, using a OAutoBufferDataSource for saving instead of the ODequeDataSource seems much much faster :-)
[18:18:35] <wjp> funny :-)
[18:18:50] <wjp> WriteFile should be much faster
[18:19:14] <Colourless> writing a game seems instantaneous
[18:24:52] <Colourless> hmm, we don't need sdl mixer
[18:24:57] <Colourless> not yet anyway
[18:25:48] <wjp> yeah, just one audio source currently
[18:25:55] <Colourless> we can just use SDL itself for our software synthed midi output
[18:26:18] <wjp> hm, buying items is half-working
[18:26:23] <wjp> you lose money, but you don't get an item :-)
[18:26:26] <Colourless> neat :-)
[18:26:28] <wjp> (from the blacksmith)
[18:26:50] <wjp> I hacked in a backpack, and 500 obsidian in that backpack :-)
[18:27:05] <Colourless> try Orlok
[18:28:22] <wjp> hm, no errors, but no drink either
[18:28:35] <Colourless> well, that's better than what I get
[18:28:38] <wjp> come to think of it, I may not be setting an item's in-gump coordinates properly
[18:28:48] <Colourless> some error about invalid item num in a list
[18:28:54] <wjp> yes
[18:29:02] <wjp> before that error it just crashed :-)
[18:29:08] <Colourless> yes i know :-)
[18:34:34] * wjp hmms
[18:34:54] <wjp> it's adding the drink directly to the avatar
[18:35:00] <wjp> Trying to add item 65535 (180) to container 1 (1)
[18:35:11] <wjp> and it seems to be lacking an objid :-)
[18:35:15] <Colourless> should automatically be put into the backpack
[18:35:21] <Colourless> :-)
[18:36:09] <wjp> oh, it only assigns the objid after adding it
[18:40:06] * wjp puts Devon into his backpack... always handy to have him around :-)
[18:40:52] <wjp> hmm.. getting errors when closing the backpack
[18:40:52] <Colourless> odd :-)
[18:40:57] <wjp> (even when Devon wasn't in it)
[18:43:26] <wjp> um, just how much is a loop supposed to put on the stack?
[18:43:30] <wjp> sp = 24; 00BD: 70 loop [BP-04h] 06 05
[18:43:31] <wjp> sp = 29F; 00C1: 51 jne 003Bh (to 00C4) (not taken)
[18:43:58] <Colourless> um, not that much as far as i know
[18:44:20] <wjp> hm, typo, it seems
[18:45:08] <wjp> stacksize = 0x281 instead of 0x28 :-)
[18:45:34] <Colourless> ow
[18:48:26] <wjp> not that this fixed this backpack issue
[18:55:45] <wjp> it looks like getting an element from an invalid list is just supposed to return 0 or something
[18:56:44] <wjp> there's a loop here that adds values to list [BP-08]
[18:56:57] <wjp> (and [BP-08] is uninitialized)
[18:57:08] <wjp> there's no guarentee that the loop finds any items, AFAICT
[18:57:27] <wjp> and afterwards it tries to get element 1 from it
[18:57:54] <Colourless> well, if it's adding items to an that list, perhaps you should be creating the list
[18:58:46] <wjp> the problem is that the loop is empty
[18:59:06] <wjp> it's looking for items with the same shape to 'combine' into one item
[19:00:29] <wjp> hm, now Orlok's not selling me a drink because "my hands are full" :-)
[19:02:15] <Colourless> committed timidity. You can now remove the check for SDL_mixer
[19:03:39] <Colourless> if you have some 30 mb of patches, it should sound pretty nice
[19:09:40] <wjp> I hope so :-)
[19:10:46] <wjp> hm, that broke fold
[19:11:12] <wjp> do FMOPL/TIMIDITY need sdl-mixer currently?
[19:11:18] <Colourless> no
[19:11:41] <Colourless> hmm
[19:11:44] <Colourless> fold hey...
[19:12:36] <Colourless> it appears i forgot to change some OBufferDataSource to ODequeDataSources
[19:12:39] <Colourless> let me fix them up
[19:13:58] <wjp> ok, updated makefiles, configure... let's see if it compiles :-)
[19:18:26] <Colourless> ok, i broke a few things :-)
[19:21:06] <wjp> outside fold too? :-)
[19:21:27] <Colourless> yes :-)
[19:21:37] <Colourless> disasm i broke, and shape converter
[19:22:52] <Colourless> that should be it
[19:26:10] <Colourless> does it take 'that' long to compile pentagram?
[19:27:01] <wjp> it does if you mess up with the configuration :-)
[19:27:28] <wjp> GenerateSamlpes?
[19:27:53] <Colourless> :-)
[19:28:08] <wjp> ok, finally :-)
[19:28:22] <wjp> now it fails to initialize it...
[19:29:09] <Colourless> if you want to see timiditys output messages
[19:29:15] <Colourless> edit timidity_sdl_c.cpp
[19:29:20] <Colourless> line 102
[19:29:32] <Colourless> uncomment it :-)
[19:29:42] <wjp> oh, really? :-)
[19:29:56] <wjp> ok, can't find the config file
[19:30:02] <wjp> even after I added the right dir to the pathlist
[19:30:14] <wjp> hm, maybe it needs a trailing slash
[19:31:59] <wjp> where do I set the verbosity level?
[19:32:12] <Colourless> the ControlMode ctl=
[19:32:19] <Colourless> near the top of that file
[19:32:23] <Colourless> change OF_NORMAL
[19:32:31] <Colourless> to OF_VERBOSE
[19:33:13] <wjp> I want more :-)
[19:33:17] <wjp> OF_DEBUG?
[19:33:28] <Colourless> just set it to a really large int
[19:33:55] <wjp> I'll just remove the check :-)
[19:34:06] <wjp> hm, it seems to be happily ignoring the path I added to the list
[19:34:19] <Colourless> how are you adding it?
[19:34:39] <wjp> add_to_pathlist("/usr/share/timidity/") in Timidity_Init
[19:34:55] <wjp> right before it tries to open the config file
[19:34:57] <Colourless> wrong init func :-)
[19:35:02] <wjp> ah :-)
[19:35:20] <wjp> which one is the right one? :-)
[19:35:24] <Colourless> you want Timidity_Init_Simple
[19:35:51] <Colourless> i considered getting rid of Timidity_Init, but for some reason i decided to leave it
[19:36:02] <wjp> ok, now I want _less_ output :-)
[19:36:21] <Colourless> :_)
[19:36:25] <Colourless> ow
[19:36:32] <wjp> timidity produces a _LOT_ of output :-)
[19:37:04] <Colourless> yeah, i can tell by just looking at the code that it produces a huge amount of output
[19:37:14] <wjp> works great :-)
[19:38:08] <Colourless> i'm thinking, we should perhaps have a config setting for the TimidityMidiDriver so you can specify another config path
[19:38:18] <wjp> yes, that was my plan
[19:39:01] <Colourless> not too hard to do
[19:48:00] <wjp> another day, another email waiting to be accepted to the pentagram CVS ML :-)
[19:48:13] <Colourless> and again, from me :-)
[19:48:29] <Colourless> and again , its to do with midi
[19:48:51] <wjp> I think this is the biggest one so far
[19:49:00] <wjp> over 190Kb
[19:49:09] <Colourless> hehee. in an email
[19:49:15] <Colourless> and it's only text :-)
[19:49:18] <wjp> others were about 80 and 65
[19:49:27] <Colourless> do we really nead it :-)
[19:50:02] <wjp> probably not, but you're going to get it anyway :-)
[19:51:59] <Colourless> oh thank you :-)
[19:56:20] <Colourless> i already have 9 mb of cvs emails for pentagram
[19:57:00] <Colourless> exult is over 24 mb of cvs emails
[19:57:22] <Colourless> and only 23 mb of exult general emails, with spam deleted
[19:58:08] <wjp> check http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/cvs/ :-)
[19:58:20] <wjp> our source size has jumped up quite a lot recently :-)
[19:59:13] <Colourless> 130 kb in 3 days
[19:59:57] <wjp> that's over 25% :-)
[20:00:02] <Colourless> i wonder if backporting some of this midi stuff into exult would be a good idea
[20:10:49] <Colourless> ah well. i think i'll be going now
[20:10:52] <Colourless> cya
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