#uwadv@irc.freenode.net logs for 30 Nov 2002 (GMT)

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[16:27:58] <wjp> hi
[16:28:09] <vividos> hi wjp
[16:28:22] <vividos> sorry for the spam :)
[16:29:02] <wjp> I was kind of surprised when I saw my uwadv-cvs inbox this morning :-)
[16:29:08] <wjp> 70 mails :-)
[16:29:20] <vividos> :)
[16:30:01] <vividos> be back in some minutes
[16:48:02] <vividos> http://www.asamnet.de/~finkm/uwadv/all_levels/
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[19:50:51] <vividos> hi Eldron
[19:51:10] <Eldron> hey
[19:51:57] <vividos> a question on blender3d - can I import 3ds files into it somehow?
[19:52:25] <Eldron> not directly..
[19:52:34] <Eldron> But with a script it would work
[19:52:40] <Eldron> I have no idea if anyone has made such a script though
[19:52:51] <vividos> hmm ok
[19:53:20] <vividos> I did a uw1 level map to 3ds exporter and wanted to "render" it somehow
[19:54:04] <Eldron> with textures and everything?
[19:54:30] <vividos> yes, just look at the link I mentioned earlier, in the
[19:54:32] <vividos> ?logs
[19:54:32] <exultbot> Logs are available at http://www.math.leidenuniv.nl/~wpalenst/uwadvlog.php
[19:56:05] <Eldron> hmm, if I knew python I'd write a plugin.. could be useful know it too..
[19:56:36] <Eldron> export/import is a small issue with blender atm.. since natively it doesn't come with many formats to export to.. or import :)
[20:01:22] <vividos> found sth interesting: http://helium.homeip.net/support/search.php?mode=all&key=*
[20:03:18] <vividos> hmm, can I import dxf or vrml into blender?
[20:03:38] <Eldron> yep, both I think
[20:03:56] <vividos> ok I'll try
[20:04:07] <vividos> (the page mentioned a 3dto3d program
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[20:04:38] <Telemachos> evening..
[20:04:41] <Eldron> yea, But dxf doesn't contain texture coordinates
[20:04:49] <Eldron> dunno about vrml though
[20:05:09] <Eldron> hello tele
[20:05:33] <Telemachos> Im pretty sure vrml can contain texture coords.
[20:06:32] <Telemachos> Actually - my own old UW viewer tool.. I seems to remember it could export levels to VRML with texture coords
[20:06:33] <vividos> hi Telemachos
[20:07:03] <Telemachos> hi Vividos.. is anyone doing any work on 3d models (bridges, rocks, doorframes etc) for uwadv?
[20:07:07] <vividos> btw, just to mention the link again: http://www.asamnet.de/~finkm/uwadv/all_levels/ :)
[20:08:32] <Telemachos> btw - way cool with the conversations!! ;) (and looking at stuff)
[20:08:41] <vividos> thanks :)
[20:08:51] <Telemachos> but there is still the problem with black lines all over the screen
[20:09:14] <vividos> someone should give me a worse graphics card, so I can see the lines :)
[20:09:29] <vividos> blender still imports the 23MB dxf
[20:10:41] <Telemachos> worse? ;) he heh... no offense but I doubt you can get a better one than mine atm (a Radeon 9700 Pro) ;)
[20:11:02] <vividos> ok, then a better one :)
[20:11:20] <Telemachos> he heh.. what card do you have?
[20:11:40] <Telemachos> and what resolution do you uwadv at normally.. windowed or fullscreen?
[20:11:44] <Eldron> gah, I was drawing a texture today, and my monitor went crazy, lost blue color.. so I had no other options than to not draw.. since I could be drawing the completely wrong color..
[20:11:59] <vividos> it's an Asus, GeForce2 MX
[20:12:03] <Telemachos> k
[20:12:12] <vividos> Eldron: heh
[20:12:22] <Telemachos> hit the monitor hard on the side ;)
[20:12:33] <Eldron> I've been doing that when that happened..
[20:12:46] <Eldron> it works, sometimes :)
[20:13:02] <Eldron> currently my monitor works fine though
[20:13:04] <vividos> maybe a broken cable?
[20:13:06] <Telemachos> (or maybe just make sure all cables are properly inserted ;)
[20:13:10] <Eldron> nah, its not the cable
[20:13:30] <vividos> hmm, blender still imports, which makes me ... a bit nervous
[20:13:55] <Telemachos> but what about those models? Is there any code in uwadv to parse the models from the exe?
[20:14:05] * vividos is currently reading the uw2 walkthrough and thinks that this game may be way harder to do than uw1
[20:14:30] <vividos> Telemachos: there already is code, but I didn't get to write a rendering or model management class yet
[20:15:22] <Telemachos> I suggest that for all "dynamic" models you simply make an instance each time it's used and forgets about a model interpreter as such
[20:15:32] <vividos> Telemachos: sorry for the late answer, I usually run uwadv in 512x384 in windowed mode
[20:15:45] <Telemachos> make an instance each time it occurs on the map that is.. not each time you encounter one in a frame
[20:16:04] <vividos> of course. the decoder just collects vertices and (later will) generate triangles
[20:16:51] <vividos> frame?
[20:17:11] <Telemachos> each time you draw the screen.. thats called a frame ;)
[20:17:18] <vividos> ah, 'that' frame :)
[20:17:38] <vividos> I thought of animated objects and their 'frames' or animation steps
[20:18:05] <vividos> the static objects even can go in a display list
[20:18:36] <Telemachos> my point is simply that while one might be tempted to share 3d data for many instances of a model .. like you would for the static objects... then I think its too slow/troublesome to modify ONE version of a doorframe each time it is needed
[20:19:54] <vividos> ah, you mean the variable sized models?
[20:20:36] <Telemachos> yes
[20:22:36] <vividos> well, a door always starts at the ground and the height of the model can be as high as the maximum height of the ceiling (or so)
[20:22:53] <vividos> didn't look into that much yet
[20:25:49] <vividos> another thing - just looked at the uw2 map levels with your viewer - are there some tiles with higher slopes, too? there appeared some rather steep tiles
[20:32:43] <Telemachos> except for the encoding the format is the same
[20:33:22] <vividos> are there more tile types?
[20:34:02] <vividos> heh, the 3dto3d program even generates C OpenGL code from the 3ds
[20:34:12] <Telemachos> nope, but it's possible there are some errors in my building of the mesh.. I remember there was an error in uw1 even - at that slope in level 1 where there is a hole with a boulder in
[20:34:19] <vividos> ah ok
[20:35:11] <vividos> hey, vrml import worked!
[20:36:57] <Eldron> with texture coords too?
[20:37:33] <vividos> don't know
[20:37:58] <Eldron> and there is just one texture?.. with all the dungeontextures..
[20:38:13] <vividos> I just see the mesh
[20:38:22] <Eldron> guess you just have to add a material, then a texture, and choose uv-mapping..
[20:39:41] <vividos> well, don't know how to do anything in blender3d :/
[20:40:47] <Eldron> heh :) I find that quite easy to do..
[20:41:09] <vividos> I got 5 minutes experience with it yet :)
[20:45:00] <vividos> another thing, Telemachos. some users complained about climbing stairs in uwadv - it's too hard
[20:46:27] <Telemachos> yes I noticed that when I tried it out.. I'll see if I can tweak it.. the problem is that steps are pretty high compared to the height of the player and the height of a tile
[20:47:17] <vividos> do you think the scale factor in the renderer is too big?
[20:47:33] <vividos> or better: too small
[20:49:25] <Telemachos> well, the important thing is that it LOOKS right ;) but from the physics point of view it would rather have smaller steps ;)
[20:50:17] <vividos> ok right
[21:06:52] <Eldron> http://eldron.20m.com/boxed_uw.jpg
[21:07:23] <vividos> cool!
[21:07:40] <vividos> it almost looks like a borg cube
[21:07:43] <Eldron> lol
[21:07:56] <Eldron> resistance is futile, you will be added to our undeworld!..
[21:08:29] <vividos> lol!
[21:09:27] <Eldron> architects of the styggian abyss had a very proportional cubic design, and with primitive tools, its amazing!
[21:10:43] <vividos> with cubic design, do you mean that the rooms all are cubic?
[21:11:12] <Eldron> the whole dungeons is cubic
[21:11:16] <Eldron> dungeon*
[21:11:37] <vividos> well, they selected a 64x64 map and they used all the available space
[21:12:52] <Eldron> oh well, hardware have a tendense to limit stuff I guess
[21:13:14] <vividos> yes
[21:13:56] <Eldron> though technology is advancing fast nowdays..
[21:14:42] <vividos> yes. remember, uw1 is from 1992.
[21:15:12] <Eldron> yea, I know
[21:15:16] <vividos> I often see features that already were in uw1 that other games "claimed" to have invented later
[21:15:44] <Eldron> uw1 looked extremely nice back then too
[21:16:12] <vividos> yes, but now with uwadv it looks even better now :)
[21:16:15] <Eldron> I liked the nice physics, and the detail of the world it had.. dropping items and picking them up and such :)
[21:16:22] <Eldron> yeah.. with full AA >:)
[21:16:26] <vividos> hehe
[21:16:35] <Eldron> ah.. and texture filtering..
[21:16:45] <Eldron> and alpha blending of sprite edges..
[21:17:43] <vividos> I have to depth-sort the sprites some times, to get rid of the hard edges
[21:18:05] <Eldron> hard edges?
[21:18:56] <vividos> when two objects are near each other, the one is drawn over the other, and a hard edge is the result
[21:19:52] <Eldron> oh
[21:19:57] <vividos> did you see it?
[21:20:05] <Eldron> I haven't noticed it yet
[21:20:15] <vividos> well, it's only a minor issue
[21:20:21] <Eldron> guess I never got into that view so that two sprites overlapped
[21:20:38] <vividos> would be a nice quit message :)
[21:20:50] <Eldron> wha?
[21:20:52] <vividos> would be a nice quit message :)
[21:21:06] <vividos> ah sorry, scrolled up a bit :) I meant the "resistance is futile, you will be added to our undeworld!.."
[21:21:15] <Eldron> lol
[21:23:37] <Eldron> oh well, Im going to play some ns now.. bbl..
[21:23:49] <vividos> bye Eldron
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[22:23:03] <vividos> gtg, bye!
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